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Just wanted to know what people thin about them

Very competetive. Not quite as high as Dark Eldar and Imperial Gaurd, but still very good.

Competitive? Not really.
This is my impression from having a first look into the codex.
Grey Knights die from shooting like normal Marines.
Their rending shooting weapons are nice but rending got nerfed.

Stormbolters and Powerweapons for 10pts per 5 marines or 30 per 10 marines, YES PLEASE!
Very effective against both Hordes and MEQ, No melta weaponry, but the Psycannon is such a nice weapon and I feel it definitely makes up for it. Especially in the contex of the entire codex, you torrent vehicles down instead of bluntly blowing them up with Melta's.
I feel no current codex plays the midfield game better (and that's what 5th is all about, if you still haven't noticed).

Grey Knights die from shooting like normal Marines.

Certainly, but they also kill the enemy faster, so in later turns you receive less damage...

You can build an army that plays the long range game very successfully as well.

Quick and powerful assault based lists are also possible

There's just tons you can do with this codex. Much of it will prove effective competetively.

This codex is easily up there with Wolves/BA/Guard. Good thing too, perhaps we'll see some dilution of the common tournament armies....some spreading around of the races so to speak.

I feel no codex plays the midfield game better (and that's what h5th is all about, if you still haven't noticed).

This seems to be the truth and eventually makes GKs playable at the competitive level.
On the other hand, fast armies like mech Eldar eventually fly circles around a midfield GK army shooting it at leisure.

wuestenfux wrote:

I feel no codex plays the midfield game better (and that's what h5th is all about, if you still haven't noticed).

This seems to be the truth and eventually makes GKs playable at the competitive level.
On the other hand, fast armies like mech Eldar eventually fly circles around a midfield GK army shooting it at leisure.

When you're midfeild it's much harder to avoid psycannon fire for your opponent, unless he wants to restrict himself to the 6 or so inch area on the right/left sides where he would be out of range after your troops' movement.

That's hardly flying circles around a GK army...and the point of being midfeild with it.

Oh yea...and those psyflemen that are so popular right now? Kill eldar skimmers dead, and that's 4' range. Fly around that.

Deadshane1 wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:

I feel no codex plays the midfield game better (and that's what h5th is all about, if you still haven't noticed).

This seems to be the truth and eventually makes GKs playable at the competitive level.
On the other hand, fast armies like mech Eldar eventually fly circles around a midfield GK army shooting it at leisure.

When you're midfeild it's much harder to avoid psycannon fire for your opponent, unless he wants to restrict himself to the 6 or so inch area on the right/left sides where he would be out of range after your troops' movement.

That's hardly flying circles around a GK army...and the point of being midfeild with it.

Oh yea...and those psyflemen that are so popular right now? Kill eldar skimmers dead, and that's 4' range. Fly around that.

This also seems to be true - I got the codex yesterday...
But Eldar has means (runes of withnessing) to shoot down GK psychic powers.

And GK have means (Vindicare Assassin) to shoot down Eldar Farseers.

GK psychic powers are nice...but that doesnt have to be "the army". Not with psybolts laying all around.

Fafnir wrote:And GK have means (Vindicare Assassin) to shoot down Eldar Farseers.

Better keep the Farseer safe and try in a Serpent since the runes have infinite range.

I think we'll have a better understanding of where the GKs are within the scope of the competitive scene once we start seeing tourney reports giving us the details of what units work best, and good combos and synergy for GK lists to work off of.

wuestenfux wrote:

Fafnir wrote:And GK have means (Vindicare Assassin) to shoot down Eldar Farseers.

Better keep the Farseer safe and try in a Serpent since the runes have infinite range.

I played against a BA player who brings his storm ravens against me several times with GKs. With 3 Prifflemen dreads, at least one of his stormravens is dead on first turn, and if I don't get his other one on turn one, its gone on turn 2. You can't really hide from 48" range dual S8 autocannons, or from shunting 30" psycannons (on interceptors) for long (or at all). Most eldar lists I've seen recently have 2-4 grav tanks, and they aren't any more durable than a stormraven (well, the falcon usually has holofields, but that isn't as common or as good as it used to be). Keeping that farseer safe is a lot harder than it seems.

Competitive? Very. Purifier spam and termy armies abound, and all the 30" shunting means no-one is safe. Also great for contesting objectives.

GK can build a solid all comers list that is well tooled to be a hard counter against many common MEQ armies. GK armies tooled to kill MEQ armies will have some difficulty with IG, DE, Tau, and Eldar, but the situation just going uphill a bit instead of being far from hopeless. The thing is most tournament armies are MEQ which is far more common than DE or IG. Regular eldar are somewhat of a rare sight, and Tau are a very rare sight (I usually table tau with chaos and DOA)

Most opponents are MEQ, and with most opponents being MEQ in the hands of the right player GK have an excellent chance of winning a tournament. Hopefully with the GK codex out there we will see more DE, Tau, Eldar, and IG but it will take a while for the meta game to adapt.

Well, with the psybolt aminition dreadnought being comparable with the SW long fangs I think it is shure to say that for 405 points you will be abel to compete in the long range department.

Also, the psycannon for regular units running at 110 points, (115 if you want a halberd (I think it looks like a good adition vs fellow marines and other things)) is very good if you compare it to the SW 5 man squad + wolf guard melta+combi melta and banner at 113 points. Both work very well in a rhino.

Onbiusly the SW are better against mech and hordes, but the GK have 12" more range of death enshuring that they can fall back vs hordes, or have a bigger threath buble vs mech. An eldar player will have trouble doding 4 rhinos with 24" range each vs the 12" space wolves for 460 points. Back that up with the dreadnoughts and for 865 points you got quite a long and dangerush reach.

Of course that might not even be an optimal build. GK can do all sorts of things, but that will be the "worst" you will meet in any compative GK list (although I would think dreads + lazorspam would also seem verry sweet.)

GK have purifiers, so they have the tools to handle horde.

The weakness of a GK army that's tooled to kill MEQ is being both outgunned and outmaneuvered by some armies.

The weakness of a henchman army that's tooled to kill mech (6 psyfleman + 6 henchmen razorbacks) would be a fast assault army like a DOA army.

Went 3-0 at a tournament yesterday w/GK's yesterday in a KP only tournament running 17 KP's. And took best general instead of overall because my army isn't anywhere near painted yet. Only 1 opponent had more than a single unit left on the table at the end of the game. I played against IG, SW's, and Tyrannids.

I think GK's are going to be a very solid and very competitive codex w/a ridiculous amounts of builds. The strength of my list rests on 10-man Strike squads w/Psybolt Ammo. But there will be a ton of options out there once people really dive in.

I simply think it's too early to tell.

My opinion is however that once they're used a bit more, it'll be a simple case of them being powerful, but only really tournament-competitive in the hands of a skilled player. I don't think they'll be on the pick-up-and-play level of IG/SW/BA, but more akin to Nids on the power-level in that when used correctly, they'll be very powerful but otherwise largely unforgiving.

I also think the title should have a question mark and 'thin' should say think, but that's another thing all together...

this is interesting a lot of people have told me that grey knights look like MEQ same armor as MEQ and die like MEQ
anyone else agree?

All armies are competitive in one way or another, but situational discussions aside, they appear to make an excellent all-round strength TAC list that has a clear tradeoff in the form of points costs!

wuestenfux, my fellow Mech Eldar player - I am not so confident! Psycannons, being S7, penetrate on a 6 so they essentially work exactly as normal As.Cannons without Energy Fields in effect... plus they glance on a 5 too! S5 storm bolters also ruin Eldar from up to half the board away when they get out of their vehicles to try and soak them in wounds, although this option is not prevalent in the tougher builds I've seen thus far.
Eldar Psykers are not really combat characters so for the most part they aren't too worried about GKs, and Runes of Warding are brilliant. Don't get cocky though - they are an elite army that can make a hell of a mess up close or from a distance.

I've found that they are much more balanced against my Daemons than they used to be, to my surprise! They were intimidating at first but once I learned to get a solid jump on them I started doing fine.

Considering that there has not been enough time to even evaluate the competitiveness of the Grey Knights codex, isn't this a bit premature?

Granted that it may be a bit early to call but i think that we can get a general understanding of how competative they are

It's never too early to discuss what we've learned so far. If you really depend on an internet forum to tell you how the army plays then maybe you should get out and play a few games against them yourself - after all, not all serious competitive players use forums anyway.

Just the loud-mouthed ones.

I've seen Grey Knights table Guard (just as I predicted!), and yet I've tabled them with my Chaos Daemons (when I expected to lose rather badly). I'm quite happy with how balanced they seem to be in my experience so far. They're a good challenging army to play against, and although I don't play them myself... I wouldn't want to play against myself using them!

Impresive hulksmash! Can I ask you what sort of list you where fielding that beated mech so thurowly? My one oponent always play mech, I think I never have wonn with my tyranids. :(

Yes yes do tell

Hulksmash wrote:Went 3-0 at a tournament yesterday w/GK's yesterday in a KP only tournament running 17 KP's. And took best general instead of overall because my army isn't anywhere near painted yet. Only 1 opponent had more than a single unit left on the table at the end of the game. I played against IG, SW's, and Tyrannids.

I think GK's are going to be a very solid and very competitive codex w/a ridiculous amounts of builds. The strength of my list rests on 10-man Strike squads w/Psybolt Ammo. But there will be a ton of options out there once people really dive in.

What was the points limit?

Anti-mech is actually one of GK's best strengths - that's why I predicted they would counter Guard so well - and part of why they're a naturally flexible army in the 5thEd environment!

People really tend to underestimate just how much mobile firepower they put out, and the fact that they jump on anything below AV14 with ease and no meltaguns makes them quite original too. Running them on foot you can match another MEQ's model count and level the playing field by quickly sorting out his armour.

Damn it, I'll talk myself into getting them if I keep up like this. I have to admit that although I've been playing against very competitive players with GK, they're obviously still getting around the new army themselves. So far, though, they've been great to challenge and it'll only get 'worse'. I really recommend that people challenge as many GK players as possible.

Point limit was 2,000. The level I think all 5th edition codexes are balanced for. The list looked like this:

2xInquisitors w/TA, Psycannon, Servo Skull
2xSingle Paladin w/Hammer
10 Purifiers w/4 Pyscannons, 6 Halberds, Rhino
5 Warrior Accolytes w/Rhino
2x10 Strike Squads w/Hammer, 2 Psycannon, PsyAmmo, Rhino
10 Strike Squad w/2 Psycannon, PsyAmmo, Rhino
7 Interceptors w/PsyAmmo, Hammer
Dread w/Dual AC's, PsyAmmo
Dread w/Assault Cannon, PsyAmmo, Auto-Cannon

It's got a lot of tweaking still to come but it was my starting point. The warriors were basically a tax so I could combat squad the Purifiers. Worked out pretty well.

I would have put:
feth grey knights! they are overpowered cheapshots specifically designed to nerf all xenos armies back to the stone age!

unfortunately there was no option for that.

honestly, a 2+ invulnerable save should cost at least 60 points, and even then it should only be available to one model per army.

it almost seems like GW is putting out codex after codex for space marine chapters for the express purpos of making xenos forces uncompetitive. blood angels shot down tau, and now GK is screwing over eldar. don't believe me? grey knights use a lot of psychic powers, eldar would normally counter that with runes of warding. but oh, no. they had to ruin that too with the culexus ASSho- sorry assassin. in fact, the entire GK army seems to be anti psychic oriented. In my view, matt ward not only makes atrocious fluff, but the rules he writes are really unbalanced.