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Is Emperor a xeno hater?

Many of you will say yes, but think about it.

-He started the Great Crusade to reunite Humanity, there is nowhere mention of destroying other civilizations.
-The Eldar tried to warm him about Horus, and even arrange a meeting to forge an alliance. Sadly that Horus came to represent the Imperium ( when he was already fallen ).
-He is maybe the only reason Tau are still existing ( creating the warp storm around their home planet ).
-The fact that Inquisition, Grey Knights and Deathwatch have secret alliances with Eldar.

So what is your opinion?

Not really.
It just happens to be that most of the Alien species they met were trying to kill them.
He would most likely have been a sensible fellow who would have agreed to a ceasefire/armistice/mutual living pact
What Grey Knight alliance with Eldar?
He isn't responsible for all or possibly any warp storms.

purplefood wrote:
What Grey Knight alliance with Eldar?

There is an example - the battle of Malan'tai.
They killed the daemon there, then left some Knights to guard a Craftworld.
Then they contacted the Eldar and they came to recover soulstones.
The fact they contacted them is smell like something of alliance to me...

- His Legions wiped out numerous alien species ( La'er, the Interex, the Diasporex, the Jorgall the Keylekid, amongst many others )
- There is no proof that the Emprah created anything. Even the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath, which destroyed much of Vandire's fleet, cannot be reliably attributed to the corpsegod on Terra
- The Inquisition's occasional cooperation with some Eldar craftworlds is at most an alliance of convenience and never one of true acceptance

Brother Coa wrote:

purplefood wrote:
What Grey Knight alliance with Eldar?

There is an example - the battle of Malan'tai.
They killed the daemon there, then left some Knights to guard a Craftworld.
Then they contacted the Eldar and they came to recover soulstones.
The fact they contacted them is smell like something of alliance to me...

They did that because:
GK fight daemons.
The daemon they killed was killed by them (Thus proving they fight daemons)
Slannesh is like a daemon but so big and so bad that he/she/it is practically an omnipotent being.
Therefore Gk also fight Slannesh.
Slannesh wanted the souls in the soulstone.
The Gk wanted to prevent this.
Therefore they contacted other Eldar who they have no problem with and allowed them to take the Soulstones.
This is an alliance of convenience and nothing else.


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KingDeath wrote:- His Legions wiped out numerous alien species ( La'er, the Interex, the Diasporex, the Jorgall the Keylekid, amongst many others )
- There is no proof that the Emprah created anything. Even the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath, which destroyed much of Vandire's fleet, cannot be reliably attributed to the corpsegod on Terra
- The Inquisition's occasional cooperation with some Eldar craftworlds is at most an alliance of convenience and never one of true acceptance

Most if not all of those aliens were hostile or became hostile.

-He started the Great Crusade to reunite Humanity, there is nowhere mention of destroying other civilizations.

In uniting humanity he would do anything, which including destroying aliens that threatened humanity or that used them.

-The Eldar tried to warm him about Horus, and even arrange a meeting to forge an alliance. Sadly that Horus came to represent the Imperium ( when he was already fallen ).

That shows nothing of the Emperor's beliefs

-He is maybe the only reason Tau are still existing ( creating the warp storm around their home planet ).

That is just your wild speculation about how the warp storm was created.

-The fact that Inquisition, Grey Knights and Deathwatch have secret alliances with Eldar.

Are these the secret alliances so secret that GW has never published anything about them? Any cooperation is due to need and will end as soon as the need is gone. A few inquisitors have been taken in by the Eldar, but again this shows nothing of the Emperor's beliefs

The Interex were human yet believed that the Luna Wolves had fallen, while this was wrong Erebus already had and started the conflict but this was on a outpost and i have'nt heard of them being wiped out yet?

Brother Coa wrote:Is Emperor a xeno hater?

Many of you will say yes, but think about it.

-He started the Great Crusade to reunite Humanity, there is nowhere mention of destroying other civilizations.
-The Eldar tried to warm him about Horus, and even arrange a meeting to forge an alliance. Sadly that Horus came to represent the Imperium ( when he was already fallen ).
-He is maybe the only reason Tau are still existing ( creating the warp storm around their home planet ).
-The fact that Inquisition, Grey Knights and Deathwatch have secret alliances with Eldar.

So what is your opinion?

To be fair, the whole randomness of the warp storm smells like tzeentch. If the Emperor has power to spare for things like that, the astronomicon wouldn't be fading.

Also, I think it was the Tallarn had an alliance with Eldar, could've been another IG R though.

And yeah, the Emprah hated Xenos. Remember Ullanor?

Please remember that this forum is for discussion of fluff, not random speculation.

I have no idea whether the Emporer hated Xenos or not, however if I wished to make a claim on it I would produce some evidence.

"The Triumph of Ullanor" was a lengthy campaign prosecuted by the Emperor and Horus against an Ork Warlord.

There's been mention going around recently of "The Conclave of Isha" which is an Inquisition/Eldar means for them to share information and arrange alliances as necessary in times of great need.

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:The Interex were human yet believed that the Luna Wolves had fallen, while this was wrong Erebus already had and started the conflict but this was on a outpost and i have'nt heard of them being wiped out yet?

According to Ravenor Rogue ( as cited by Lexicanum ) the Kinebrach, which formed an important part of the Interex, have died out. While there are other reasons for why this has happened i think
the most likely one is that the Interex does no longer exist, which wouldn't be too suprising given the Imperium's absolute intolerance for xeno species and "deviant" cultures as well as the state of
war between the nascent imperium and the interex at the end of Horus Rising.

I dont think they hate Xenos before anything happened. But well, I dont think you can like Orks if some of them killed ur family or destroyed the planet were you are living..

It's hard to know really, he kind of disappeared after killing some orks, which was the orks' fault really. He did have a tendency to kill any aliens in control of humans though, like when he recruited Mortarion.

Notice how Tau are the only faction without a god? I just realized that literally EVERY other faction has a diety(s)....

im2randomghgh wrote:Notice how Tau are the only faction without a god? I just realized that literally EVERY other faction has a diety(s)....

In fairness those Deities are real to some extent...
The Emperor is real though possibly not a god.
The Eldar gods were/are real though many are dead.
The Chaos Gods are real.
Gork and Mork are real to an extent.
The C'tan are essentially Gods in terms of their power.

im2randomghgh wrote:Notice how Tau are the only faction without a god? I just realized that literally EVERY other faction has a diety(s)....

Tyranids?

im2randomghgh wrote:Notice how Tau are the only faction without a god? I just realized that literally EVERY other faction has a diety(s)....

Ethereals are basically a sacred priest caste, some of whom have a sort of god/saint-king feel to them.

Other than that, Tyranids don't, but they're mindless beasts so one wouldn't particularly expect them to. Dark Eldar don't have any gods, though they do have the Dark Muses, which are long-dead mythic rolemodels, basically.

Dark Eldar worship Khaine don't they?

Dark eldar have gods, it's just that most of them are dead. They know that the laughing god is still around, but being DE they are too selfish to care. Worshiping him provides them with no benefit so they don't bother.

It has nothing to do with hate.

But, the fact nearly ever Xeno Allie decided to turn on the IoM at there weakest moment.

Its just safer to wipe them out then risk that again.

4M2A wrote:Dark eldar have gods, it's just that most of them are dead. They know that the laughing god is still around, but being DE they are too selfish to care. Worshiping him provides them with no benefit so they don't bother.

They have gods in the sense that there are gods associated with their race, but as a culture they've forsaken what remains of them.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:Notice how Tau are the only faction without a god? I just realized that literally EVERY other faction has a diety(s)....

Ethereals are basically a sacred priest caste, some of whom have a sort of god/saint-king feel to them.

Other than that, Tyranids don't, but they're mindless beasts so one wouldn't particularly expect them to. Dark Eldar don't have any gods, though they do have the Dark Muses, which are long-dead mythic rolemodels, basically.

Well the Tyranids hive-mind is as powerful as a god and the Eldar created a god so...

im2randomghgh wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:Notice how Tau are the only faction without a god? I just realized that literally EVERY other faction has a diety(s)....

Ethereals are basically a sacred priest caste, some of whom have a sort of god/saint-king feel to them.

Other than that, Tyranids don't, but they're mindless beasts so one wouldn't particularly expect them to. Dark Eldar don't have any gods, though they do have the Dark Muses, which are long-dead mythic rolemodels, basically.

Well the Tyranids hive-mind is as powerful as a god and the Eldar created a god so...

The Hive Mind is certainly godlike in scale and influence, but it is not a god in 40K's sense of the word. Not to mention that the Tyranids have no concept of worship.

im2randomghgh wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:Notice how Tau are the only faction without a god? I just realized that literally EVERY other faction has a diety(s)....

Ethereals are basically a sacred priest caste, some of whom have a sort of god/saint-king feel to them.

Other than that, Tyranids don't, but they're mindless beasts so one wouldn't particularly expect them to. Dark Eldar don't have any gods, though they do have the Dark Muses, which are long-dead mythic rolemodels, basically.

Well the Tyranids hive-mind is as powerful as a god and the Eldar created a god so...

There's no indication that there is a consistent, universal hivemind for the Tyranids, nor that this mind even approaches the cognitive function of a dog. Their actions are more consistent with a massive evolutionary algorithm than intelligence: just trying a massive number of random actions or permutations on general archetypes, and then repeating whichever happens to function the best.

Admittedly they have more of a soul than Tau do, though it's in the opposite direction, towards having a negative warp presence. That precludes the sort of mass-accumulation that created Slaanesh or the Emperor, or possibly the other gods as well, though they lack any concrete origin description.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
There's no indication that there is a consistent, universal hivemind for the Tyranids, nor that this mind even approaches the cognitive function of a dog. Their actions are more consistent with a massive evolutionary algorithm than intelligence: just trying a massive number of random actions or permutations on general archetypes, and then repeating whichever happens to function the best.

Admittedly they have more of a soul than Tau do, though it's in the opposite direction, towards having a negative warp presence. That precludes the sort of mass-accumulation that created Slaanesh or the Emperor, or possibly the other gods as well, though they lack any concrete origin description.

Actually, the Tyranid codex goes a long way in characterizing the Hive Mind as devilishly intelligent, and does present it as one unified, controlling force behind the Tyranids.

Tau also have souls, which show positively in the Warp. That they don't, and are somehow a race of blanks is a common misconception.

EDIT: Well, ok. I don't think the codex out and out personifies the Hive Mind as a sentient, so your Ant hive model is still possible.

Brother Coa wrote:

purplefood wrote:
What Grey Knight alliance with Eldar?

There is an example - the battle of Malan'tai.
They killed the daemon there, then left some Knights to guard a Craftworld.
Then they contacted the Eldar and they came to recover soulstones.
The fact they contacted them is smell like something of alliance to me...

That was pretty dumb anyway. There shouldn't have been any spirit stones left active after the Doom of Malan'tai was finished. It was literally sucking the souls out of the spirit stones and infinity circuit to power itself. There shouldn't have been any left for the greater daemon to eat, let alone the Grey Knights to give back.


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Sir Pseudonymous wrote:There's no indication that there is a consistent, universal hivemind for the Tyranids, nor that this mind even approaches the cognitive function of a dog. Their actions are more consistent with a massive evolutionary algorithm than intelligence: just trying a massive number of random actions or permutations on general archetypes, and then repeating whichever happens to function the best.

Admittedly they have more of a soul than Tau do, though it's in the opposite direction, towards having a negative warp presence. That precludes the sort of mass-accumulation that created Slaanesh or the Emperor, or possibly the other gods as well, though they lack any concrete origin description.

I think you should maybe read the fluff in the 5th edition Tyranid codex. If you still come to the same conclusions after reading it... I really think you need some help with comprehension.

Ironsight wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
There's no indication that there is a consistent, universal hivemind for the Tyranids, nor that this mind even approaches the cognitive function of a dog. Their actions are more consistent with a massive evolutionary algorithm than intelligence: just trying a massive number of random actions or permutations on general archetypes, and then repeating whichever happens to function the best.

Admittedly they have more of a soul than Tau do, though it's in the opposite direction, towards having a negative warp presence. That precludes the sort of mass-accumulation that created Slaanesh or the Emperor, or possibly the other gods as well, though they lack any concrete origin description.

Actually, the Tyranid codex goes a long way in characterizing the Hive Mind as devilishly intelligent, and does present it as one unified, controlling force behind the Tyranids.

EDIT: Well, ok. I don't think the codex out and out personifies the Hive Mind as a sentient, so your Ant hive model is still possible.

It repeatedly has figures viewing it describe it as intelligent, but the behavior described is more of a physical evolutionary algorithm than the sort of cognitive simulation of the same; this creates the appearance of intelligent behavior as failed methods and designs are weeded out, with the successful methods being propagated throughout the local hive. It doesn't think in the sense that you or I do, where courses of action are planned out from a past archetype, and their effects are roughly simulated prior to enacting them; no forethought, only instinct and mutation. Whether this is the intent or not, one must admit that it's a nicer characterization than Bugs In Space! in any case...

Tau also have souls, which show positively in the Warp. That they don't, and are somehow a race of blanks is a common misconception.

Blanks have souls, or rather more specifically a sort of a negative image of a soul/warp-presence, while Tau are more akin to rocks or machines without Machine Spirits. One could almost picture a being with a warp-presence, such as a human or eldar, as a chunk of matter, and its warp-presence as the force of gravity exerted by this object; a blank would also be a chunk of matter, but instead of a force pulling towards it, it exerts a force pushing away, as if it were distorting space in the opposite direction to normal matter; Tau would be space bereft of any matter, wherein no force is exerted towards or away.

Yay for tau. nobody really cares about them since they dont have any preasence eather way. (thou they do seem to have a slight positive presence if i remember correctly but its to small for any real perpose).
Im certian that at least one of the races that are in the empire is warp sentive. people keep posting but there must be at least one out of the 50 or so they have met.

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:Blanks have souls, or rather more specifically a sort of a negative image of a soul/warp-presence, while Tau are more akin to rocks or machines without Machine Spirits.

Your statement is a load of rubbish with no actual amount of fluff at all

Blanks/pariah - are clearly described as soul less, it is the fact that they have no presence in the warp (which is due to having no soul) that freaks people out.
Tau - have a very low presence in the warp, but they still have a presence.
normal humans/eldar/ork all have a presence in the warp of varied degrees.

The Grey Knights do have a wraith-bonr phone for communicating with Eldrad.