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Whats a good set-up?

Depends on if your thinking close combat or ranged? What were you thinking?

Ranged is what I'm leaning too.
The only thing current that are definitely in the list are the Callidus and Coteaz.

Callidus is awesome but not in the retinue so thats a seperate thing alltogether.

For a shooty retinue I'm thinking:
(im not telling you what to do as I would never say I was actually good at 40k, I'm not one of those people, I just have ideas)

-Inquisitorial servitors x3 with either multi-meltas or plasma cannons or a mixture of both
-Warrior Acolyte x3 with either plasma guns or melta guns.
-6x combination of Jokaero Weaponsmiths and Warrior Acolytes with hotshot lasguns. (I would suggest giving all Acolytes carapace armour aswell)

This makes for a very shooty warband which can either be mostly plasma weapons for killing power armoured troops or mostly melta based for easily destroying most vehicles. I think the plasmas are the best way to go as the AP3 hotshot guns really add to the anti marine firepower the squad can dish out. A squad with plasmas could realistically take our an entire power armoured marine squad in one turn.

Do you want henchmen to be the focus of your army? If so try the list dashofpepper posted a couple of weeks ago from vassel games. You won't make any friends but you will win.

If you're using them as cheap troops, I recommend 3-6 warriors in a chimera with 3 special weapons as your set up. Throw in the odd servitor, jokearo and psykers if you want for some boosted firepower. You get lots of tanks, lots of special weapons (I like meltas personally) and its cheap enough to leave lots of points for other stuff in the list.

I prefer the cheap route as you still get loads of special weapons and chimeras and room to put all the other goodies from the codex in, but henchmen are so customizable you can't go wrong with trying out other combinations.

Personally i use a combination of 6 psykers, 2 jokaero's, a crusader, and 3 servitors (your choice of weps) chucked in a chimera with heavy bolters. Minus the crusader and put coteaz in there and you've got a modedit: swearingshooty unit. Oh, you just deepstriked here? Well first off ill take a psychic test (Ld 8), and blow you up with strength (9/10 can't remember) ap 1 large blast. Then youre gonna get hit by my 3 servitor's (plasma cannons, heavy bolters, whatever), then ill hit you with my chimera's heavy bolters, and then two shots in the face from my jokaero's. I think youre dead now.

Not so fast there there champ, there's a lot of controversy over how Coteaz's "I've been expecting you" works with the stuff you described.

First, your chimera definitely can't shoot because Coteaz only affects the unit he's joined and technically the chimera isn't part of that unit, its the transport.

Second, its not entirely clear that you can use psychic attacks as part of the ability. The wording of the power grants the unit a "shooting attack" at the unit that triggered it but there's no word on whether you can use psychic powers out of normal phase in that manner. Something like this is very new so its uncertain whether Coteaz's ability can affect psychic powers. If it can, more power to you, but I like to err on the side of caution and play my games as if that wasn't the case. FAQ may prove you right, or not.

And servitors in a unit without an Inq is a bad idea... Stay away from that.

I think that there are a few good unints that have started to develop out of the henchmen lists, but I think that people are stil trying to firgure out how to make it into an entire army.


My list of Favorite Henchmen units.

1) 5 Death Cult Assassins + 5 Crusaders with Hammerhand and Ras Grenades (either from a Xeno guy or a Techmarine)

Super deadly in combat, not may points, fits in either a chimera or a Storm Raven.


2) 8x Psykers (maybe add 1x Warrior) Mounted in a Rhino.

S10 Ap1 is nothing to fool with. You can outrange a hood ro shadows. Your transport has fortitude. The one warrior is there to keep the whole unit from ding from a perils. It saves a kill points, and keeps the rhino scoring.

while it is a LD 8 psyker, it is a very scary spell, and a very cheap unit.


I am not sure what would be next.

I hate to keep being the bearer of bad news but that warrior in the unit will not save the psykers from dying to perils. In fact, if they suffer perils, he's going to be the sole survivor. When henchmen psykers get hit by perils, they all die, because they have no invulnerable save and take the test as 1 unit, rather than separately.

Notice how GK get a special rule in the codex called Brotherhood of Psykers that has them assign the perils hit to the justicar, or else a single model in the unit. Regular ol' psykers have no such luck. There's not even an overseer like the PBS has in the IG codex, to kill off just some of them rather than all on a failed test.

They have an awesomely powerful attack, don't get me wrong. But between not working with Coteaz's ability and all dying on a failed leadership 8 test, thanks but no thanks to taking them for me.

Perils only triggers on 2 or 12, so it's not quite so bad for the psyker squad as dying any time they roll 9-11. I think the power of the squad is worth the risk.

I would agree. You only need too kill 2 Terminators with the power too gain the points back. They're also good at thinnning hordes.

It's just they're unpredicatable. I did some Maths and Stormbolters are better than Hot-shots everytime. More shots more range cheaper and more versatile.

I was thinking of a firebase sort of affair though.
Mabye something like a Kanwall? I was thinking 24 Crusaders could do the Job well but too kill 8 you only need around 50 Lasgun shots.

This is kinda on topic: Do henchmen warbands use a seperate elite choice to an inquisitor like cotez or are they part of the hq choice as like a retinue type thing?

Psykers will struggle against
1. Runes of Warding
2. Targeting _anything_ within 12" of something with reinforced aegis
3. Psychic hoods
4. Shadow in the warp if you are unlucky enough to have big bugs get close (unlikely).

By no means are the Psykers a "perfect" unit.


I forgot about the reinforced aegis thing, that is bad too.



they are very deadly, S10 AP1 Large blast at 36" that can move and shoot is very good.

You pass LD8 about 3/4 times, and hopefully you can move such that you are out of range of hoods and Shadows. (also shadows does not go into tanks)


Runes or warding is bad, but it is only in one army. I think psykers are good enough to include, but not so good that you should make an army based on 6 units of them.


The lone warrior is there so that IF you roll a perils, the whole unit is not gone. All the psykers are, but there is still one guy left who can score, and will not give up a kill point until he is dead.



Another unit I have been trying out is a unit of 2 Jokero, 3 Meltaguns, and 5 Storm Bolters mounted in a Chimera.

So far I have not had great luck with them in my games, but I think the unit has potential.

As my last army was IG, when the codex first came out I experimented heavily with henchmen builds because I have so many chimeras and guardsmen (warriors) at home. The only 2 henchmen builds I had any consistent success with were death cult/crusaders and 3 melta warriors in a chimera. Both options are incredibly cheap and good at their job. The melta warriors may be fragile with only 3 GEQ wounds to get through, but they have all the killing power of a mech vet squad from IG for less than 100 points.

Henchmen have tons of options that can be used well but I find the biggest strength of this unit is bringing incredibly high offensive power (in cc and shooting) while still being cheap. For all the power of mechvet IG troops you pay about 40-50% less, or you can get a cc deathstar for around 150 points. Keeping them cheap lets you add in all the other things that make the codex good without really sacrificing any of their power.

5 Stormbolters in a Chimera costs 90 points total. That's a beautiful thing.

It's for 1500P and be able to expand too 1750P.

This is a good thread.

1) 5 Death Cult Assassins + 5 Crusaders with Hammerhand and Ras Grenades (either from a Xeno guy or a Techmarine)

Me likes.

I'm not a fan of that. Crusader's don't defend very well for the points. 3 Acoyltes with Boltguns is more bodies same points also. I only put in Crusader's if I'm strapped for places.

What about a squad completely composed of death cult assassins? They all have power weapons and inv saves. Enough attacks each to kill most units before they even strike back

Which will have loads of fire powered into them. Anyway I said mainly going for range. I've got a Callidus that will cause havoc in enemy lines.

For a retinue for Coteaz, I personally say take a Henchmen unit consisting with Death Cult Assassins and Inquisitorial Wracks for the main build, then Crusaders.

DCA have a good amount of power weapon attacks which are high Weapon Skill and kill most of the unit before they strike back leaving the rest for the other henchmen. The Wracks are great because they are high strength and many attacks, this is great against most things like Orks because of the many attacks and Marines because they die when forced saves. Crusaders are brilliant just to sponge the hits off the unit with their Storm Shields and in combat they have power weapons which munch on many things.

To add to this Coteaz has Hammerhand which will make the DCA str 5 ignoring armour saves, Wracks with many str 6 attacks, and just to laugh Crusaders with Str 5 power weapons > Also they munch on pretty much everything in combat.

By Wracks don't you mean Arco-Flaggelants. At I3 the only units I think they will be good against is Orks.

I would like some long range AT and No transports or a very small amount.

For gaks and giggles at 2500 you could run coteax and 30 chimeras all with three warriors with each squad having one meltagun.

youbedead wrote:For gaks and giggles at 2500 you could run coteax and 30 chimeras all with three warriors with each squad having one meltagun.

NO no no no no.....

Do not buy 30 chimeras because you think this is legal.

There is a very good chance that the FAQ will clear up this little misunderstanding.
Most TOs will not allow this sort of thing.
Most people will not play a friendly game against this list.

Back on topic here.

========

1) I think that Coteaz does not work with a combat unit as well as he does with a shooting one.
Hammerhand is good.
Sanctuary and Defense against reserves is great for protecting your firebase.
He in only T3 with no INV save. A lot of stuff will ruin his day in combat.


2) I think that Arco Flagellants work well with a Librarian.
Quicksilver helps to counter the INT 3 problem
Might of Titan makes them killer against vehicles
Shrouding + FNP gives them good protection against small arms fire. You can put the big stuff (lascannons ect...) onto the Crusaders with them.


3) Crusaders are good, as they allow you to pack a lot of defense into a small unit.
If you could take a unit of 20+ henchmen (and they were stubborn), it would be a good idea to just take warriors as ablative wounds. (look up close combat guard lists, they do this better)
In close combat, Every wound you save helps add to your combat resolution. Abative wounds are not as good in combat as durable models.
Crusaders with Rad grenades and Hammerhand will still kill stuff. WS4, S4, A1(2) with a power weapon. Unless you are going for a small, disposable combat unit (just 5 DCA no Character) you should have the Crusaders.

svendrex wrote:

youbedead wrote:For gaks and giggles at 2500 you could run coteax and 30 chimeras all with three warriors with each squad having one meltagun.

NO no no no no.....

Do not buy 30 chimeras because you think this is legal.

There is a very good chance that the FAQ will clear up this little misunderstanding.
Most TOs will not allow this sort of thing.
Most people will not play a friendly game against this list.

Back on topic here.

Well yeah I wouldn't do it since it would cost almost $1,500. Though I am curios as why it would not be legal. Even if only 6 can be troops then the rest will just be elites

According to the rules, infinite henchmen units is legal. We'll see if GW decides to throw out a rules change on it.

In similar vain to the chimera list of doom, coteaz plus 30 8 man psycher units. 30 str 10 ap 1 large blasts, hope to god you get first turn

My friend got a Landraider redeemer with about 7 assasins, 2 crusaders, inquisitor with rad grenades and psychotropic grenades. Those assasins hit with S4 powerweapons that become S5 (hammerhand) and those rad grenades take away one extra toughness... on top of it all my unit suffers from the psychotropic grenades.

My Ork army cannot take down that landraider with coming within his 18 bubble of close combat assasin death!!

I really hate that thing..