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As an avid Chaos fan (having collected an army from every legion across my 22+ years of gaming, except Night Lords and the Red Corsairs), I read a bit about their fluff from 2nd ed all the way to the current books.

There are so many contradicting stories for both forces. One states that Huron Blackheart has no love for the Imperium or Chaos and neither do the Night Lords, where as some fluff states they are full on Chaos worshipping swine.

Which one is true?

And secondly, the Red Corsairs used to have an awesome colour scheme that involved each Marine keeping his original Chapter colours and just covering the Imperial and Chapter symbols red... Could that still be a valid colour combination?

For the Night Lords; they were a traitor Legion and like most, split into much smaller warbands and factions. As such, it's unlikely they'll have a uniform/collected view on things; therefore some may support Chaos, whilst others hate it etc.
Typically, the Night Lords hate the Imperium (Kurze pointed out the corruption and hypocritical nature, they're traitors & the IoM killed Kurze), but also don't worship Chaos. They may USE Chaos every now and then, but MOST Night Lords hate the Imperium and don't worship Chaos.

Regarding Red Corsairs, I'm less sure. AFAIK, they of course hate the Imperium and are fairly 'meh' towards Chaos, in that they are undivided and don't appear to delve into full-on worship, but they do support the gods of Chaos and will use them as allies.
So whereas Night Lords typically dislike and don't support Chaos, I THINK (as I said, I know less about the Corsairs) the Red Corsairs like and support Chaos, but don't worship it at such.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Regarding the Colour Scheme, that sounds both good, characterful and fine.
Ultimately, you can do what you like, but regarding fluff that sounds pretty believable.

Yep above poster is right on.

Asherian Command wrote:Yep above poster is right on.

you beat me to it!

Okies TY.

Just thinking of what Chaos Legion to do when 6th Ed comes out.

The Night Lords are followers of Chaos, they're just not too big on the whole 'worship' thing.

Up until the current Codex, the Red Corsairs were never really a Chaos force, but were simply renegades. While Huron had a daemonic pet and the protection of some un-named Chaos God, they were never depicted as Chaos Marines.

GW do seem to be Chaosificating them a little currently, though.

Hawk wrote:

Asherian Command wrote:Yep above poster is right on.

you beat me to it!

Muhahaha All your posts belong to me
Is that all we know about the Red Corsairs that they might be worshipping?

It will probably become clear when the Chaos Legions book returns and the current codex becomes Codex: Chaos Renegades with additional fluffy bits.

as rumored for 6th edition changes.

insaniak wrote:The Night Lords are followers of Chaos, they're just not too big on the whole 'worship' thing.

Up until the current Codex, the Red Corsairs were never really a Chaos force, but were simply renegades. While Huron had a daemonic pet and the protection of some un-named Chaos God, they were never depicted as Chaos Marines.

GW do seem to be Chaosificating them a little currently, though.

Ok not hugely up on the Nightlords but what I gathered from reading Blood Reaver and Soul Hunter was that the Nightlords wish to continue their war against the Imperium and realise that joining forces with other renegades and traitor legions is the only way to do this. That said however they don't in the majority willingly worship Chaos, they have however become tainted by prolonged time in the warp and in the eye of terror etc. for example mutation is relatively uncommon, some like the Exalted become possesed by daemons but it isnt the original Night lord still in there, some fall prey to their lusts and a way opens up for chaos to start to seep in like with Uzas, or falling into feral mutation like the raptors.

In summary I believe they cannot be included in the same group as the Black Legion or other Chaos followers, they are very much following their own agenda not following the guidance of chaos or any greater daemon or god, They are simply twisted with hate and biterness, deterimined to continue their primarchs "long war".

Ugly Green Trog wrote:

insaniak wrote:The Night Lords are followers of Chaos, they're just not too big on the whole 'worship' thing.

Up until the current Codex, the Red Corsairs were never really a Chaos force, but were simply renegades. While Huron had a daemonic pet and the protection of some un-named Chaos God, they were never depicted as Chaos Marines.

GW do seem to be Chaosificating them a little currently, though.

Ok not hugely up on the Nightlords but what I gathered from reading Blood Reaver and Soul Hunter was that the Nightlords wish to continue their war against the Imperium and realise that joining forces with other renegades and traitor legions is the only way to do this. That said however they don't in the majority willingly worship Chaos, they have however become tainted by prolonged time in the warp and in the eye of terror etc. for example mutation is relatively uncommon, some like the Exalted become possesed by daemons but it isnt the original Night lord still in there, some fall prey to their lusts and a way opens up for chaos to start to seep in like with Uzas, or falling into feral mutation like the raptors.

In summary I believe they cannot be included in the same group as the Black Legion or other Chaos followers, they are very much following their own agenda not following the guidance of chaos or any greater daemon or god, They are simply twisted with hate and biterness, deterimined to continue their primarchs "long war".

So in other words they are renegades, renegades in the fact they are against the imperium, but not necessarily in league with Chaos. They may have some relations or deals, but they will not bow to them.

That's why I'm torn between the two factions.

Do I go with the all out rebellious Night Lords (who like Terror Tactics and Fast Attack) or do I go for the Red Corsairs (who as far as I can see like lightning raids on space craft and other targets)???

As far as I have read, neither of them like Chaos or the Imperium.

I just picked up Soul Hunter and Blood Reaver today, will definitely have a good read of them soon.

Pirates vs. Terrorists really. Both want quick guerilla fighting as bloody and brutal and efficient as possible, they just do it with two different styles.

Night Lords are pretty much terrorists where Corsairs are pirates.(As their name partially suggests. Actual Corsairs were given permission by the king/queen/whomever to rape, pilage, and plunder in their respective countries name. Huron Blacksparrow?)

Pirates tend to opperate in a much larger collection of bodies and be very rag tag where terrorists will develop cells and warbands (us programmers call that loosely coupled.) which often comprise members who are local to a region, but not always.

Rough comparison, but it seems to make sense.

I was massively impressed with Soul Hunter and Blood Reaver - very cool.

It also worth getting Lord of the Night as some parts are referenced by the latter two novels.

Some Night Lords embrace the powers of Chaos - other resist it as much as they resist the Imperium

Mr Morden wrote:

Some Night Lords embrace the powers of Chaos - other resist it as much as they resist the Imperium

This is true but I feel that those true to the memory of Night Haunter resist Chaos. Chaos is contradictory in the sense that it is another controlling force that would seek to use the Night Lords just as the Imperium once did, this wwouldn't appeal to thier nature at all, most view those that would serve the Despoiler with barely veiled contempt.

Night Lords worship Chaos Undivided and the red Corsairs are just BAMFs that went renegade.

IIRC.

DeadlySquirrel wrote:Night Lords worship Chaos Undivided and the red Corsairs are just BAMFs that went renegade.

IIRC.

Night Lords (by and large) don't worship Chaos in any way AFAIK, when it comes down to it, they're just on the same side and another tool to be used, but they don't really worship Chaos.

Some of the fluff I've read suggests the Night Lords aren't even on the same side as other Chaos aligned powers and they are a form of uber renegade that want just one thing - Justice.

Be it justice for the wrongs they have bore from the Imperium or anyone else, they simply will not conform to any other faction or cause but their own.

That's how I'm reading it ATM.

On a side note...

Aren't the Red Corsairs also really good at sieges/cityfights? They held out in the Palace of Thorns for ages against three chapters of Marines.

insaniak wrote:The Night Lords are followers of Chaos, they're just not too big on the whole 'worship' thing.

Up until the current Codex, the Red Corsairs were never really a Chaos force, but were simply renegades. While Huron had a daemonic pet and the protection of some un-named Chaos God, they were never depicted as Chaos Marines.

GW do seem to be Chaosificating them a little currently, though.

Now don't chew me out on it, but I remember something about the Red Corsairs making a deal with Malal, a minor Chaos god. Can anyone confirm this?

carbonpillow wrote:

insaniak wrote:The Night Lords are followers of Chaos, they're just not too big on the whole 'worship' thing.

Up until the current Codex, the Red Corsairs were never really a Chaos force, but were simply renegades. While Huron had a daemonic pet and the protection of some un-named Chaos God, they were never depicted as Chaos Marines.

GW do seem to be Chaosificating them a little currently, though.

Now don't chew me out on it, but I remember something about the Red Corsairs making a deal with Malal, a minor Chaos god. Can anyone confirm this?

It no longer matters as Malal is no longer canon thanks to the power of retcon.

IIRC, Malal's creator in the GW design team quit the company and took the rights of Malal with him and so GW removed the God of Chaos turned on itself.

insaniak wrote:The Night Lords are followers of Chaos, they're just not too big on the whole 'worship' thing.

Up until the current Codex, the Red Corsairs were never really a Chaos force, but were simply renegades. While Huron had a daemonic pet and the protection of some un-named Chaos God, they were never depicted as Chaos Marines.

GW do seem to be Chaosificating them a little currently, though.

I think GW has been pretty clever with this. Initially, throughout the Badab War, the Red Corsairs (known as the Astral Claws) could only be seen as renegade, at worst. After their expulsion, they've been forced to turn towards Chaos, not worshipping it, but having to utilise and stay in close proximity in order to just survive.

Reallly nice but the dark apostal was a big let down for me

Sry MOD's this was refering to Just Dave's Codex in his sig. donno why it went here can i delete it somehow?

The Red Corsairs are allied with Chaos, but not devoted to it. Those that worship Chaos are casual about it.

The Night Lords hate Chaos, but are too weak to attack the Imperium by themselves so they were forced to ally with it.