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This may be a rant, it is NOT a rant about the poorness of the Sisters WD codex. Take those rants elsewhere please and less discuss the REAL issue here....

Yes, the Sisters WD article/codex will indeed be terribad...there, I said it.

This should have been obvious to everyone involved in this hobby that knows GW, and I'll tell you why.

First, you have to realise that GW is a company with a responsibility to it's stockholders. They are NOT the friendly game company of years ago. They don't care about you, your army, your fun or anything about you. They care about your money and their bottom line. THAT IS IT. Everything else isnt worthy of their attention. GW will experiment with releases, books, and timing to get as many dollars out of its target demographic as possible. There are probably people employed who's sole responsibility is to come up with sales plans and stratagies to get as many dollars out of you as possible.

Surprisingly enough...this plan is probably not restricted to "put out good codexes" and "put out great models". While this should definatly be in their plan, there is probably much more involved than JUST that.

Look at White Dwarf itself. No Veteran gamer buys this rag. Newb gamers probably drop it after the first few issues they get suckered into. Result? White Dwarf sales are faltering due to poor content, lack of interest and premium price point. What have GW done recently? They've done everything in their power to 'cap' the rumourmill. Probably including "threatening" their employees. (this wouldnt surprise me) Where will be be forced to go for info on stuff coming out? You guessed it...White Dwarf. Remember years ago when they stated that there would never be another Codex released in a WD? Now in the month of August there are TWO army codexes featured in the mag? What's next? Chapter Approved? Don't be surprised....WD's will sell. More than earlier anyway. It's all part of their business plan...not a conspiracy.

I will probably be purchasing the magazines in August and September just so that I have a "book" of sorts containing the current sisters rules. I know I'm probably not the only one. This is generated sales that GW would have otherwise NOT gotten. Small, perhaps, but generated sales nonetheless. Simply by putting out this codex, changing the content, and keeping a lid on the rumourmill.

So, knowing that this sort of tactic is at least "possible" let's dig a little deeper into the "evil corperate" of GW and their psyke. What about the sisters codex....?

We can all see that it sucks. Sisters players are pissed bar none. Faith has been raped by this new mechanic that doesnt scale. Wargear will likely be shot.....It's obvious to everybody that people are really discontented with these rules. They suck the flavour and interest from players who love sisters armies. Sisters players are NOT inspired by these rules.

GW has in all probability....DONE THIS ON PURPOSE!

Think about it, what does GW need to do to have a successful launch? DE was a resounding success. They were the oldest codex around, and they released an entire new line of beautiful miniatures that were sucked up en masse by fans. What do sisters have? Oldest codex...check. Lots of opportunity in their model line....check.

Blood Angels were also a big success. They had a WD/PDF codex (that sucked) and they finally released a book that is HIGHLY successful. Tourney's are rife with BA's as people everywhere continue to play them. No doubt many BA players were leaving the fold selling their armies under the PDF rules. I'm sure many returned with the new "flying land-raider" book and new models.

So, in the sisters we have established players who GW would obviously like to upgrade their models when the plastics come out. Why would they do that though? They can play with the old sisters models. Why invest in 100's of dollars of new plastic and finecast when they've already got full metal sisters armies bought and painted?

You guessed it....we'll release a crappy codex!!!! Why? What happens when people's armies turn into steaming piles? THEY SELL THEM ON EBAY FOR NEW STUFF! This happens all the time! Now this sisters player has no sisters of battle army to use....

PERFECT TARGET FOR NEW CODEX RELEASE WITH NEW LINE. Results from the Dark Eldar and Blood Angel's releases say so.

Here's a scenario for you.

Bob has a large sisters army.
Bob is anxiously awaiting new sisters rules to make his army competetive.
Bob hears of WD codex coming out.
Bob BUYS WD codex with sisters army...and is disappointed with August issue.
Bob BUYS WD in September for the second half and realises that they've bastardized his army.
Bob, finally frustrated with his sisters, sells them on ebay vowing never to play them again.
Bob picks up a full Grey Knight army and play's them now. They're new and cool right?
Month's later, a new sisters codex is released.
Bob, struck with nostalgia, declares himself a longtime sisters player and decides to get back with them thanks to the new codex rules.
Bob buy's lots of sisters stuff, it's new and beautiful.
GW wins again.

Think about it, what is the best way to make current sisters players give up their armies? Release a fantastic WD article? No....
Release no WD article? No, they'll keep their models and wait for the dex.
How about we frustrate the current masses and release crap...then they'll unload their garbage on e-bay and start over.

Why ELSE would GW release such OBVIOUSLY terrible rules? Put yourself in GW's place and ask why? Is it really THAT hard to make a GOOD faith system. Surely noone is silly enough to think that this new faith system is better/more fun than the old. Is it good for business....hmmmmm.

What have GW to gain by releasing stellar rules for the sisters in WD right now when there is no current line of new plastics and finecast to sell? If you think about it, I think you'll agree that they have every reason, not only to NOT release a good codex...but in fact put out a BAD one.

This is a company that doesnt care about the game, balance, fun or anything else. They care about your dollar, and that includes future dollars.

So, sisters players, do NOT sell off your models. Mothball them. I know I will be watching on e-bay for cheap sisters models in the next couple of months. Why? b/c I think I've figured out the big plan.

This is all orchestrated by GW to garner bigger sales with the future release of their new SoB codex. Watch, that codex will be awesome, models will be beautiful and many box sets will be sold.

Probably to the silly saps who got frustrated as a knee-jerk reaction and didnt think b4 they ebayed their stuff.


.....and THAT is why the WD sisters rules WILL suck. It's all to plan.

Do you get a discount on tin hats bought in bulk?

DarknessEternal wrote:Do you get a discount on tin hats bought in bulk?

Actually, that is indeed more or less Games Workshop's business model. They don't turn a profit if you buy one army and then nothing else ever again. Their goal is to get you churning through various new releases as much as possible.

DarknessEternal wrote:Do you get a discount on tin hats bought in bulk?

Go sell your sisters on e-bay then. Or do you think that the new rules are O.K.? *scoff*

Has anyone even seen the new Sisters Codex?

How do you know it is going to be bad?

People who use the word "terribad" are in the same category as people who use the word "sheeple" and organizations with "truth" in their names. Once that word comes up, my eyes glaze over and that's about it.

So then....

"This is not a rant about the WD Sisters codex.

Rant about the WD Sisters codex: Business Rationale Edition!"

Right?

BeefCakeSoup wrote:Has anyone even seen the new Sisters Codex?

How do you know it is going to be bad?

The first half has been scanned and posted on Dakka. Things do not bode well so far. Or do you mean the full Codex they will inevitably receive?

Seaward wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:Do you get a discount on tin hats bought in bulk?

Actually, that is indeed more or less Games Workshop's business model. They don't turn a profit if you buy one army and then nothing else ever again. Their goal is to get you churning through various new releases as much as possible.

Not really. The people who have been in the hobby for more than 3 to 5 years are an almost negligible number. Certainly not significant enough to build a marketing strategy around. Very, very certainly not significant enough to build a conspiracy for "tricking them out of their army" as a sales-engine.

As noted, their are indeed sales and market researchers at GW. And they will have their eye set firmly on the customer segment that turns the most revenue. These are by and large white, middle-class boys between 11 to 16 or so, who, on average, stay with the hobby 2 years or so.

And, tell you what, this is nothing terribly unique for GW or even minatures. The average "Golf-player", even those buying a new set of high-tech clubs worth several thousands, stay with the sport less than 3 years. Though they tend to be older than the 40K customers. Same for pretty much any other sport, hobby or recreational activity.

That is the simple truth. If you are an "old-timer" and with the game for several years, you are NOT THE TARGET GROUP. GW doesn't hate you. GW doesn't try to trick you out of yoru money. GW doesn't do conspiracies to get you to sell your minis. But you are not worthwhile their time.

Actually, I would think FW, in some parts, is one of GW's attempts to capture the "more mature" players out there. But for basic GW? Well, they have bigger fish to fry!

Brother SRM wrote:People who use the word "terribad" are in the same category as people who use the word "sheeple" and organizations with "truth" in their names. Once that word comes up, my eyes glaze over and that's about it.

Thanks for sharing.

But you are not worthwhile their time.

But note they still warmly welcome your cash into the drawer of the till.

Seaward wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:Do you get a discount on tin hats bought in bulk?

Actually, that is indeed more or less Games Workshop's business model. They don't turn a profit if you buy one army and then nothing else ever again. Their goal is to get you churning through various new releases as much as possible.

Isn't every business's business model to get people to buy more?

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:
But note they still warmly welcome your cash into the drawer of the till.

Sure. And Nike likes to take the cash of a 70-year old granny who enjoys the soft, comfortable shoes. But that doesn't mean that Nike can build on this type of customer to run a successful business.

I think the hypothesis is reasonable and makes sense from a quarterly profit perspective. Drumming up interest to get a sales bump is what makes stakeholders happy.

Ultimately it isn't about trickery, deceit, honour, or fun. As stated it's about PROFIT. That's what it means to be a publicly held corporation: You're a slave to that quarterly report. 2 quarters without positive gains might mean your head for CEO's and board members.

A part of that is making unprofitable sectors positive again. "Turning around" a losing line looks good, even if it is done in a less than honourable way.

None of which matters....

There HAS to be a reason behind a shoddy WD dex. One way or the other, it's meant to get money out of people.

Even if the veteran demographic doesnt matter to GW...which is by and large as much as an assumption as what I'm proposing here....that doesnt mean that GW doesnt want that Revenue.

The tactic above requires actually very little effort to get that very little extra revenue.

....that very little revenue that GW STILL WANTS.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Grunt_For_Christ wrote:I think the hypothesis is reasonable and makes sense from a quarterly profit perspective. Drumming up interest to get a sales bump is what makes stakeholders happy.

Ultimately it isn't about trickery, deceit, honour, or fun. As stated it's about PROFIT. That's what it means to be a publicly held corporation: You're a slave to that quarterly report. 2 quarters without positive gains might mean your head for CEO's and board members.

A part of that is making unprofitable sectors positive again. "Turning around" a losing line looks good, even if it is done in a less than honourable way.

Above post wasnt meant for this....totally agree here.

What about the fact, that GW sometimes just makes bad rules?

Sure. And Nike likes to take the cash of a 70-year old granny who enjoys the soft, comfortable shoes. But that doesn't mean that Nike can build on this type of customer to run a successful business

So they build soley (pun intended) on Little Jimmy Onebox and his AoBR purchase?
That'll keep the business running nicely (pun intended)

Anung Un Rama wrote:What about the fact, that GW sometimes just makes bad rules?

Is it THAT surprising that they might do it on PURPOSE?

Especially if it results in sales they wouldn't have gotten in the future?

Zweischneid wrote:
Not really. The people who have been in the hobby for more than 3 to 5 years are an almost negligible number. Certainly not significant enough to build a marketing strategy around. Very, very certainly not significant enough to build a conspiracy for "tricking them out of their army" as a sales-engine.

Using the golf example, the trick is that it is the job of retail outlets, such as a sporting goods store (or the FLGS) to market their products to anyone who comes in. My dad works the golf department, and it is a relatively unsuccessful week if he DIDN'T get an "old-timer" to get a new set of clubs. In the gaming world, the FLGS wants to attract all customers, and will have a much tighter target audience than GW as a corporation does. its the FLGS that knows the regulars, what they play and what they want/need to expand their armies.

In either example, the "GWs" of the world win, because people are sending money to them.

GW's policies may be cranky, but claiming that they deliberately composed some dodgy rule set in a nefarious attempt to gain sales (if I have understood the OP correctly) is stretching things imho

They may have published poor rules in haste to generate WD sales, but if the rules are blatantly gakk, then it is possible that people soon get wise to it and sales will fall off again. In the long run (no pun intented this time) it would be of little value.

Explain the nids codex then.

@Shane

Thank you. Your OP does have some merit. GW is here to make money plain and simple.

If the question is addressed to me Happy G then I cannot answer.
I only use the Nids codex rolled up to splatt 'roaches in a pique of just and righteous irony.

My personal suspicion is that they're focusing on the "Bait, gak-on-it, and Switch" buisness model with the imperium armies first (IG, SoB, the umpteenth SM chapters, etc.) before going towards stuff like DE, Necrons, Tau, and Nids that might not have as much entry-level-player appeal.
They seem (to my untrained eye) to be releasing a codex or two of Imperium armies between stuff like the DE or Necron releases, and I think Nids are just cuddling with Tau waaay down on the priority list.
Dunno. Just refolding my tin hat to deflect my suspected theories...

Happygrunt wrote:Explain the nids codex then.

Wow, yeah. And the FAQ.

GW gets all the oldschool 'Nids players sell their carnifexes, buy trygons, and then buy carnifexes again when the next codex gives carnifexes 7 toughness 7 wounds with a +2 armor save and 6 S10 attacks base at I5 for 130 points. *Goes and places 'Fexes in security deposit box*

In all seriousness, I agree that the OP's hypothesis does have some merit, but I can't se GW stooping quite that low.....yet.

His article makes sense until you apply the nids.

I honestly don't think GW has the foresight to pull something like that off, because that would show some understanding of *le gasp* LONG TERM PROFITS!

GW put the Sisters codex in WD to eliminate all traces of the allies rules, "update" another codex for 5th ed, and give people a reason to buy their magazine. If they really wanted to make lots of money with it, they'd make their army list ridiculously good so people would buy more stuff, then release a real codex a few months down the line that almost completely invalidates the better builds of the WD codex.

Being cynical about GW strategies is nothing new. The OP's theory requires too much tinfoil on my head to pay attention to.

I don't think this make sense. Your theory relies on the idea that GW is not just evil money hungery, but is also very stupid about it. It relies on the idea that releasing a bad codex will get them more money as people re buy the same models. Their is no logic to that.

Releasing a poor codex, won't make people sell all their models and pick up a different army. They are just as likely to keep their models or play with a broke codex. I know I wouldn't just switch with one real bad codex.

If someone dose get sad and sells their army, It's unlikely they will just buy it all again when a new codex comes out. They will have moved on by then or still be soured by the old bad release. Also the models they sell will still be out in the world. GW dosen't make money when they force you to sell your army. They actually lose money because the person buying your models dosen't have to buy theirs.

The big clincher of this is that they make more money when they put out a good codex. A good codex gets people excited about playing sisters. Old players keep their models (that way they don't fill the secondary market with models GW gets no money for) and even pick up some new ones. New players go out and buy a bunch of new models so that they can start an sister army.

Well i'm glad that cleared everything up.
I was all confused without anyone telling me what to do or think about or care about.

Brother SRM wrote:GW put the Sisters codex in WD to eliminate all traces of the allies rules, "update" another codex for 5th ed, and give people a reason to buy their magazine. If they really wanted to make lots of money with it, they'd make their army list ridiculously good so people would buy more stuff, then release a real codex a few months down the line that almost completely invalidates the better builds of the WD codex.

Being cynical about GW strategies is nothing new. The OP's theory requires too much tinfoil on my head to pay attention to.

I agree completely.

Firstly, Deadshane1, your entire argument is based on a "what if" scenario, then descends into a slippery slope argument. What you're saying is that if the sisters book is bad, people will sell off their armies because the book is bad, and then the players will pick up different armies, then, when the book becomes good again, they'll pick up everything else. All of this being meticulously planned by the "big evil empire" the whole time, who chuckles while putting the poor sod's money in their big, greedy pockets.

Here's another, more likely situation.

Bob has a large sisters army
Bob waits for the new book because he's genuinely excited for a rules update.
Bob buys both WD's, and, now here's the stretch for most of Dakka, is actually either happy or indifferent
Bob, being a rational and well-adjusted person, realizes that GW will release a new book, and so he doesn't sell his sisters.
Bob waits 'till the new book comes out and buys it.

The temporary Warriors of Chaos book wasn't terrible, and there's no reason except bias to expect that this book will be bad.