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I have been looking through my latest issue of WD and have decided to share my thoughts on GW update to the Cairn wraith rules. Making Wraiths and banshees now hero characters instead of the excellent rare unit rules available. Now if these heroes were immune to crumble and cost alot more points Id say they would be amazing for disrupting army advances, but in true GW fasion all they are good for is placing in a large unit and getting heroes or champs without magical weapons to hide until the crumble rule kills them off. The rules in WD seem to have been an after thought to accompany what is one of the best looking models in the current GW range after the new plastic necromancer IMO.

Please could someone make me feel more warmth of these cold dead models and the shocking rules for them.......

I don't really like the Banshee model, I loved the metal one. It just felt so creepy! I also did prefer the old Wraith models but hey I don't even play VC so why should I complain right?

They are Heroes now? Heroes as in being able to lead an army? (Sorry if it's a weird question I'm not just familiar with VC rules)

Pob82 wrote:Making Wraiths and banshees now hero characters instead of the excellent rare unit rules available.

Read your WD again: Wraiths and Banshees are now hero choices IN ADDITION to being rare choices. For people wanting a reason to buy just one of the new good looking miniatures.

Yeah, I don't think they un-unit stuff in WD. It would need to be FAQ'd. They just add extra options that are usually really bad and not thought out. But hey, they got magazines to sell.

Kind of like Forge World. Their rules don't seem to be quite on the same testing level as main GW.

See I would use a Banshee just the challenge a Ogre Tyrant with a Longsword...and just laugh and laugh and laugh.

Also building a army based around Ethereal units sounds fun!

Only use I can see in these as heroes is to put them in a unit with your vampire and when challenged, accept will the wraith or banshee. Due to crumble and the small number in unit sizes the role ethereals can play is limited. Personally I think they made new rules to try and sell more when looking at the quality of the model it wasn't necessary. I demand better rules for the poor zombie and better models then the special looking ones in the current range.

What about not giving a unit any Com, then plugging 5 of them in the front rank and just slamming into non character holding units and winning every fight as they can only attack ethereals

DukeRustfield wrote:Yeah, I don't think they un-unit stuff in WD. It would need to be FAQ'd. They just add extra options that are usually really bad and not thought out. But hey, they got magazines to sell.

Kind of like Forge World. Their rules don't seem to be quite on the same testing level as main GW.

Do you play 40k? If you do, look at me with a straight face and tell me they play test and think everything through.

Ralin Givens wrote:What about not giving a unit any Com, then plugging 5 of them in the front rank and just slamming into non character holding units and winning every fight as they can only attack ethereals

You sir are not a nice person.

You know its funny.... I mean how would you deal with 5 banshee/wraith heros with a ton of ranks of skelies with spears behind them? You would be steadfast and could not be hurt and you deal a bit of damage yourself.

FearPeteySodes wrote:

Ralin Givens wrote:What about not giving a unit any Com, then plugging 5 of them in the front rank and just slamming into non character holding units and winning every fight as they can only attack ethereals

You sir are not a nice person.

Not nice, but genius sure!

That is pretty brutal i must say, although they would become a prime target for light magic

^ add a Vampire Lord tooled for challenges to that unit.... now even if they have a magic wielding hero, you can take him.



I think its time to write some new lists...

But adding a vampire lets the unit your fighting attack.... and thats no fun

Unless you make the vampire ethereal... granted that means no magic items. But you can still take dreadknight or what not.

VC are the only Warhammer army I'm interested in and it's good to see Wraiths back as heroes - although it's a shame they can't take an ethereal nightmare with barding like they used to

It's also a shame they can't join Zombies - might actually make them useful (though probaly not)

What about not giving a unit any Com, then plugging 5 of them in the front rank and just slamming into non character holding units and winning every fight as they can only attack ethereals

The unit wont get to attack if you are in a challenge, and that is why you would put a vampire in there, so that if the enemy does have a magic weapon wielding hero, you have a vamp to prevent all your expensive banshees from getting annihilated.

Ralin Givens wrote:You know its funny.... I mean how would you deal with 5 banshee/wraith heros with a ton of ranks of skelies with spears behind them? You would be steadfast and could not be hurt and you deal a bit of damage yourself.

Attack from the side or back.

aerethan wrote:Unless you make the vampire ethereal... granted that means no magic items. But you can still take dreadknight or what not.

Sadly an Ethereal Vamp can't join non ethereal units....so whilst he could join Banshees and Wraiths it can't join a mixed unit including Skeletons.

I assume a non magical bolt thrower would bounce off the front rank or ethereal heroes?

full front rank or ethereal characters seems a little expensive points wise but what is the true value of fun lol. I love it

Kroothawk wrote:

Ralin Givens wrote:You know its funny.... I mean how would you deal with 5 banshee/wraith heros with a ton of ranks of skelies with spears behind them? You would be steadfast and could not be hurt and you deal a bit of damage yourself.

Attack from the side or back.

This is true, but the point of the unit is you getting the charge and protecting its flanks, though if you are 5x5 (though why you would be this small is behond me) you could just make way and block again

This idea of 5 Ethereal characters in the front rank sounds nasty but besides VC I play WE and to be honest if this came up against my WE army I would be laughing, "hello Miss banshee say hello to my Treekin"

apart from this I am struggling to find any otherway of dealing with this setup.

Dwarf War Engines tend to be magical and likely quite enjoy firing at this unit.......

Yes but thats why you have all your flyers and big meanies for the guns to deal with first, you see the trick with the unit is it does not look scary at a glance....that is untill you wind up facing it down in combat.

Against an army with multiple magical shooting attacks, just divide the banshees amongst your units, he wont have a unified target, and after the shooting threats are dealt with just move the banshees into your vampire's unit.

I have a bloodthirster to introduce to this tatic.

We can poke holes in this all day but not a one of you can admit this wouldn't cause a WTF moment if you ran into it. Haha

The thing is the unit is not a obvious threat, now if you sat down across a game table and you saw me sitting there with my VC (which do not exist btw) then you would know about this trick, but if I was some random joe at a tournament with a Zombie Dragon in my list also and a ton of graveguard I doubt my unit of lovely ladies would be your main bloodthirster target.... *end rant*

If I'm not mistaken , these both are a 0-1. So no having 5 of em. You could take 3 ethereal vamps though. How nasty would that be.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Scratch the last part of the last post. Forgot you can't join non- ethereal units

Steimy wrote:If I'm not mistaken , these both are a 0-1. So no having 5 of em. You could take 3 ethereal vamps though. How nasty would that be.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Scratch the last part of the last post. Forgot you can't join non- ethereal units

The 0-1 is for the scroll of binding for Storm of Magic.
Vampire armies can take as many as they want.

I'm thinking Ghoul Kin + 15 ghouls + wraith on the flank.
8" pregame move forward, + the 6" +2D6" charge from the wraith leaving the unit on turn 1 = terror test for you, before your first turn.
Then, when I fail the charge (still causes terror test), odds are good I don't move too far forward, and might be able to rejoin the ghouls on turn 2.

Ethereals leading infantry blocks is rad. Adds hitting power, reduces losses.

-Matt

I thought the new rules and options looked quite good myself.

And the new model reminded me of Rebecca Brooks.