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Right so something came up at our gaming club tonight which quite astounded me:

Some new guy, around 15-16, asked me for a game. Me being me I jumped at the chance. I played my Seer Council Eldar and he his Imperial fists.

First thing comes up, I reserve my entire army beside the Seer Council due to the 2 whirlwinds hovering about and I was wary about him stealing the initiative and blowing my Guardians off the table. I elect to reserve them and we ended up having a 10 minute debate as to whether I could. However, he was under the assumption that I has elected to Deep Strike them instead of reserve, so no harm done; simple misunderstanding.

Secondly, I manage to turbo-boost the seer council right across the table and drop myself right in front of his whirlwinds and after rapid-firing around 30 bolters at me, firing 3 missiles at me and 4 lascannons I had failed 2 Armour/Cover saves, which I saved with Fortune. Next turn I announce my assualting one of his Whirlwinds and multi-assualt the other. He absolutely is appalled by this and demands to see the rulebook. I point out the paragraph on assualting multiple units and he reluctantly agrees (with green-steam billowing out his ears might I add.)

Then, I tell him I am S9 against his RA 10 and again, he disputes this. I show him the relevant entry for Witchblades in the rulebook and he simply says "I don't agree with this so I'm leaving" and packs up his stuff and leaves at 6:15. (the club itself starts at 6:00!)

Was I perhaps playing a bit too WAAC against someone who was quite obviously a newer player with the multi-assualting and using a rather hard-hitting list?

Iranna.

Are you a douche for him disagreeing with the rules laid down in the codex? No. As a new player, or as ANY player playing against something new, he should have asked you "what do those guys do" when you had them on the table. I'm not a new player, but I still ask every time if I see something new (when DE came out, GK, various Tau things [since nobody plays them]). Maybe take an easier list if you suspect him of being a new player, but if he was just new to your club but had a fully done up army, there is a good chance he had played a few games before. I think he's more at fault for not asking questions, then getting pissed off when he thinks a hard army to play was unfair of you. Then again, he must have been new if he took TWO whirlwinds!!

timetowaste85 wrote:Are you a douche for him disagreeing with the rules laid down in the codex? No. As a new player, or as ANY player playing against something new, he should have asked you "what do those guys do" when you had them on the table. I'm not a new player, but I still ask every time if I see something new (when DE came out, GK, various Tau things [since nobody plays them]). Maybe take an easier list if you suspect him of being a new player, but if he was just new to your club but had a fully done up army, there is a good chance he had played a few games before. I think he's more at fault for not asking questions, then getting pissed off when he thinks a hard army to play was unfair of you. Then again, he must have been new if he took TWO whirlwinds!!

This is what threw me off a bit, his army was beautiful literally one of the best IF armies I've ever seen so I thought I was in for an epic game. Instead, I won in 15minutes by default, kind of bummed me out.

Perhaps in the future I'll ask people if they have any questions relating to my army, I am the only Eldar player in our club after all.

Iranna.

I would say that your not a douche for doing what your codex does best but to a new player......ouch. I play IG, black templar and tyranids all of which have some very good builds, but I dont run them against a new player or a beer and pretzels game just because I feel it takes the fun out of the game sometimes. So yes your a douche for doing it against a new player but no its not a douche thing to do against a vet because they know how to counter/ work around it.

No, you're not a douche, he is for being such a baby.

He asked you for a game, you agreed and he got pissy because he wasn't winning; it's not as if you took your models and rammed them down his throat.

Honestly, he should've simply decided to man up and take it on the chin; instead, he decides to throw a wobbler and leave. The game obviously wasn't going to take long, so he had ample time to ask for another game with a different list, or even to ask for pointers.

Unless you were shoved up a [censored] and used to pump cleansing saline solution into a [censored] to clean out [censored], no you are not a douche.

I make a point of asking any player if they've played against my faction/army and if they want any explanation of what my pieces can do, but if he didn't ask, it's his fault, not yours.

However, I tend to avoid the most powerful combinations I have against new players: I use it as an excuse to test new combos/seldom-used pieces.

Okay guys, thanks for the feedback, I'll try to be a little less competitive around newer players and will try not to assume people are as sad as me and read each and every new codex

Iranna.

timetowaste85 wrote:Are you a douche for him disagreeing with the rules laid down in the codex? No. As a new player, or as ANY player playing against something new, he should have asked you "what do those guys do" when you had them on the table. I'm not a new player, but I still ask every time if I see something new (when DE came out, GK, various Tau things [since nobody plays them]). Maybe take an easier list if you suspect him of being a new player, but if he was just new to your club but had a fully done up army, there is a good chance he had played a few games before. I think he's more at fault for not asking questions, then getting pissed off when he thinks a hard army to play was unfair of you. Then again, he must have been new if he took TWO whirlwinds!!

Avatar 720 wrote:No, you're not a douche, he is for being such a baby.

He asked you for a game, you agreed and he got pissy because he wasn't winning; it's not as if you took your models and rammed them down his throat.

Honestly, he should've simply decided to man up and take it on the chin; instead, he decides to throw a wobbler and leave. The game obviously wasn't going to take long, so he had ample time to ask for another game with a different list, or even to ask for pointers.

Between these two, theyve taken the words right out of my mouth.

You arent at fault here Iranna.

I would no to being a douche. My friend plays Eldar and we were all picking up the game at around the same time, and when you're new encountering a seer council for the first time is quite frustrating. One of my friends refused to play the other's Eldar for a few months due to his general hatred of the seer council. But perhaps you could have taken it a tad easier on him, but if he packed up within 15 minutes he might have just been a bad sport in general.

My reply would have been "ouch" and keep playing. What he did he seems to be overreacting to you doing legal moves and actually damaging him...
Seer councils might be tough but they end up expensive, he could have just (eventually) shot the rest of the army up, especially with it having meatshields, i mean guardians in it

Seems the guy didn't know the rules very well, and just took it out on you.

Iranna wrote:
Secondly, I manage to turbo-boost the seer council right across the table and drop myself right in front of his whirlwinds and after rapid-firing around 30 bolters at me, firing 3 missiles at me and 4 lascannons I had failed 2 Armour/Cover saves, which I saved with Fortune.

Except for this bit, where you accidentally cheated. The rules for turbo boosters forbid you from doing anything else that turn. That means if you cast fortune, you are forbidden from boosting because you have already done something. Whatever, 12+6 is still lots of movement, it just means you can't ever re roll 3+ cover

I don't see why people get so irked over casual games. The first time I played my IG, My 20 Man power blob got murdered by two squads of Wyches. I laughed my ass off.
No, You are not a douche.

So is this new guy mostly a painter and finally started to play the game or did he just buy a bunch of already painted models?

Sounds more like someone who hadn't played in a long time, probably even skipping an edition or two. Were all his models current? If he had things like metal Venerable dreadnoughts and such, I'd bet it was someone who got out of the hobby in 4th edition and just want to get back in.

Still, if that's the case, he should have let you know so you could go a bit easier on him.

akaean wrote:

Iranna wrote:
Secondly, I manage to turbo-boost the seer council right across the table and drop myself right in front of his whirlwinds and after rapid-firing around 30 bolters at me, firing 3 missiles at me and 4 lascannons I had failed 2 Armour/Cover saves, which I saved with Fortune.

Except for this bit, where you accidentally cheated. The rules for turbo boosters forbid you from doing anything else that turn. That means if you cast fortune, you are forbidden from boosting because you have already done something. Whatever, 12+6 is still lots of movement, it just means you can't ever re roll 3+ cover

He reserved everything apart from his Seer Council, which means he can Turbo Boost in his scout move, which would, IIRC, still give him the 3+ cover in the enemy's following shooting phase, but still allow him to cast Fortune, since Scout moves are done before the first turn.

I'm unsure though.

Err... the Council couldn't have Scout.

It definitely looks like a slip-up.

Right off the bat you should have known he was a "Fun At All Costs" player when he plopped down two Whirlwinds.

For shame... lol

SlaveToDorkness wrote:Err... the Council couldn't have Scout.

I know, you beat me to the edit.

feth knows where I got Scout from...

I'm not really new to 40k but fairly new to actually playing 40k still. When I get screwed by rules I wasn't aware off I usually face-palm, laugh it off and keep it in mind for next time. (I'm one of those people who doesn't take things in if I read them, but by doing it repetition).

If this guy is so sore and stormed out for something like that, he's not worth the angst.

CadianCommander wrote:I'm not really new to 40k but fairly new to actually playing 40k still. When I get screwed by rules I wasn't aware off I usually face-palm, laugh it off and keep it in mind for next time. (I'm one of those people who doesn't take things in if I read them, but by doing it repetition).

If this guy is so sore and stormed out for something like that, he's not worth the angst.

As my good buddy Jules would say: EXACTAMUNDO!!!!!!!

I think the guy was just being pissy cause he wasn't having a good game. So what if your opponents list is powerful the game is what you make of it. I played GK for the first time a few weeks ago with my orks. His list was was set up to be crazy good where my was a green tide fun list. I got decimated the 2nd turn when he charge and did cleansing flame everywhere and wiped out all my boyz(I had no idea they could do that). I actually killed more shooting than assaulting that game , but I still had a good time the guy was nice and we had our fun and interesting moments during the game I didn't just pack up my stuff and refuse to play just because it might be tough for me thats not the orky way .

CadianCommander wrote:I'm not really new to 40k but fairly new to actually playing 40k still. When I get screwed by rules I wasn't aware off I usually face-palm, laugh it off and keep it in mind for next time. (I'm one of those people who doesn't take things in if I read them, but by doing it repetition).

If this guy is so sore and stormed out for something like that, he's not worth the angst.

I play at a farily competitive store, most "causal" games are often practise games for the next tournament or 'ard Boyz. So usually I get my behind handed to me (I think I have gotten a draw, but often I am happy when I can keep the loss to a 'minor loss'). I never get pissed at the other guy, always take note of how I got hosed this time around, and learn from it.

Leading up to the 1st round of WFB 'Ard Boyz I played the same Chaos Demon army 3 or 4 times, getting cleared off the board each time. But after each game I learned a new way to delay the slaughter and take a few more guys with me. Stuff like using Eagles as roadblocks by making sure he has to either waste a turn charging them or wheeling around them. Each game was a total loss, but after each game his units were a little smaller than the game before. One of the other guys was talking to him during our last game and mentioned that his units are looking kinda slim, and my opponent told him that I actually learn from each game.

Super-competitive gaming is my meta, so I am used to it. I would not have considered your move a douche move at all.

Fortune is cast at the begining of the eldar player turn. So he can indeed cast fortune, then Turbo boost, as its done before movement

Imo anyhow

and if it was just one seer council, i dont think it was really that bad tbh, i mean, its just 3 ups, they dont have power weapons, and they can eat vehicles, but....i think space marines would still win the day, specially vs just one council, i think he was just suprised and didnt know how to handle it

In 40K there are a number of armies which can field astonishingly powerful units. The seer council is a good example.

When a player who is not used to this sort of unit comes up against one, it can look like the other guy just pulled out an "I win!" card, and there seems like no point in continuing the game.

That doesn't excuse the guy's behaviour in packing up after 15 minutes, but it helps explain it.

Nightrave wrote:Fortune is cast at the begining of the eldar player turn. So he can indeed cast fortune, then Turbo boost, as its done before movement

close...when you turbo boost you may not perform any other voluntary action during the turn you turbo boost or plan on turbo boosting

anyway...ive had some games like this in the past and we are defiantly not the only ones. however if i feel the game might be a bad experience for my opponent i generally do my best to tone down my tactics to make the game more enjoyable. but sometimes there isnt anything you can really do and the way your opponents army is painted doesn't indicate play skill

OP you weren't being a douche. You were merely playing the game. I can see why the other guy got frustrated if he is a new player. He had 2 Whirlwinds, which to be honest aren't all that great, but no matter what he shouldn't have packed his stuff up and just left like as if it was that big of a deal. When you are new it happens. Things happen to you that you simply forgot about after reading the rulebook or maybe you haven't even gotten around to reading the rule book just yet.

Seems to me like you did nothing wrong and he was just having a bad day. It happens. If you really feel bad you could apologize to the guy the next time you see him.

This game can be frustrating because of the ammount of time it takes to prepare a game. For those of us who don't have Army Builder, writing an army list and setting up a game can take awhile. When someone gets jumped by one of those HQ and there Body Gaurds units they tend to get upset. People feel like they were 6 pooled (zerg rushed) or cannon cheesed. They lost to tactics which denied them an interesting game.

Its not like SC2 or any other PC game though where won could feesibly play half a dozen games or more (way more) in one day, if you loose a game of warhammer like that, you may not be able to find another game that day.

You aren't a bad person, just maybe ask how experienced people are and maybe inform them of what your units do. Sometimes you have to elevate the skill level of your opponents to make it fair enough to be interesting.

If you cant win, then you can lose gracefully. Thats my motto...

Anyway seems to me nobody commented on the fact that the opponent was a teen (no offense intended for anyone here as I have met 14 year olds that have more maturity that people at my age (26) ). The attitude was bad, if you are new in a game you are bound for a wooping 99% of the times (I got my handed to me the other day ). Imo you could have been a little less competitive and go for the lulz but that depends on your playstyle and your mood tbh.

Ok, so to wrap it up, not your fault; if someone does not like failure then he should not try anything, since even living goes hand in hand with failure.


"Why do we fall sir? So we might learn to pick ourselves up."
-Alfred Pennyworth, Batman Begins (2005)

if you cant handle the heat get out of the kitchen.

Good job slapping him imo.