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I have been contemplating about starting Dark Eldar and I am too lazy to make a list.

Is this one viable? I found it in a White Dwarf.

====================
HQ
*Urien Rakarth
*Haemonculus w/ Venom Blade + Dark Gate
*Haemonculus w/ Venom Blade + Liquifier Gun
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ELITES
*5 Incubi
-Raider w/ Dark Lance + Night Shields
*4 Grotesques w/ 1 Liquifier Gun
-Raider w/ Disintegrator Cannon
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TROOPS
*7 Wracks and Acothyst w/ 1 Liquifier Gun
*8 Wracks w/ Liquifier Gun
*4 Wyches and Hekatrix w/ Power Weapon
-Venom w/ Additional Splinter Cannon
*4 Wyches and Hekatrix w/ Power Weapon + Blast Pistol
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FAST ATTACK
*6 Scourges and Solarite w/ Haywire Blaster + Heat Lance
*Beastmaster w/ 4 Khymerae
*8 Hellions and Helliarch w/ Stunclaw
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HEAVY SUPPORT
*Razorwing Fighter w/ Flickerfield
*Talos Pain Engine w/ Chain-flails + TL haywire Blaster
*Cronos Parasite Engine w/ Spirit Vortex
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm going to regret this, but CC welcome.

Not really no.
It might do ok in friendly games, but it's more an all-over-the-place list to try and show off the different units there. It's nicely variant and will look interesting, but ultimately won't be overly effective.

If you're too lazy to make your own list, just look over any of the 500 or so DE lists in this section.

Woof! That is a really bad list. Though that is generally the way with GW. You could do some relatively minor adjustments to sharpen it up immensely - but if by "viable" you mean "competitive at something bigger than local RTT" then you should really start from the ground floor up.

Thor665 wrote:Woof! That is a really bad list. Though that is generally the way with GW. You could do some relatively minor adjustments to sharpen it up immensely - but if by "viable" you mean "competitive at something bigger than local RTT" then you should really start from the ground floor up.

Like using an Archon first?

Maybe Raider Rush...

I personally think Haems are better than Archons most of the time - Urien is kind of 'meh' though and would never show up from me in a list I wanted to be competitive with.

Raider Rush is certainly viable - but while we're at it there are many non-Raider/Venom spam lists that are much more viable than this list. There are *theme* DE lists that would be more viable than this list. This list is just random piles of things.

Footslogging minimized squad of Wyches looking to use their Str 3 power weapon to own face?
A Razorwing, master of eating infantry, in a list that is all assault and all wants to eat infantry?
Having an assault army be built to assault Turn 1 and Turn 3?
It's a mess, and I'd expect even a player who plays "just for fun" and "just want to use these kewl models" to manage to put together a more thematic and functional army than this.

Yeah, that army you have there is pretty much a massive meat shield. Hell, it'll probably get chewed up in like 2 turns of shooting. Try to fit a WWP and some transports, and replace the Ravenwing with a Ravenger.

Alright, If I wanted to start a DE army, what is the ABSOLUTE MUST HAVE unit in all DE lists?

No such thing. Probably if you twisted my arm and forced me to name something I'd go with the Kabalite Warrior box - as only a few armies (some WWP, Cult, and Coven builds) don't use either Trueborn or Warriors in them.

For buying up a DE army I *do* think the Battleforce is a solid start point - Raiders are great, Warriors are great, Wyches are great. RJBs are...okay and can be used competitively depending on the list - but since you're fnctionally getting them for free by buying the Battleforce they're a solid addition just for bits or if you want to re-sell them even if you refuse to play them.

For HQs a Haem with Liquifier is probably the most commonly seen HQ because he's generally useful for almost any type of list and is very affordable.

To save money and focus yourself - I'd probably try to do a couple of things in the following order;

1. Come up with a basic idea of what you want the list to do (even if it's just as simple as shooty or stabby - or 'I really want to use Razorwings, or whatever)

2. Then toy around making an army and post it up to get feedback - make sure to specify the goal of the army so that hopefully about 1 in 6 of the posters will consider that when answering

3. Once you have a solid list, then you can start buying.

A HQ and 2 troops.

But I jest - you'd likely want:
HQ:
Archon -
Use this if you want to go for something a little more durable, with a little more oomph gearwise, your standard archon is ok to lead, alright in CC and with shadowfield fairly hardy - like most DE it's a great infantry / heavy infantry / MC / IC hunter, but generally falls short on vehicles.

Something like Duke Sliscus (gives all deepstrike, better combat drug control and increasing 1 squad to Poison 3+) is a good core with some flavour and flair.

Haemonculi -
Take this for your standard HQ, it's cheap, all of 60 pts including a Liquifier Gun (Template Str4 APd6 Assault 1) and you can have up to 3 in a single slot, allowing for up to 6 seperate ICs if you want to easily disperse pain tokens among your army. They also make Wracks troops.

Elites:
Kabalite Trueborn - These can easily be specialised to just about any role and it's best to not diversify, be it tank hunting, shredding infantry, sniping, gunboats, etc.

Grotesques - If running a WWP list or a coven etc, 4 of these with a haemy in a raider is fun. They have fnp and furious charge off the bat, so it's a ton of highpower attacks backed by toughness and lots of wounds.

Troops:
Kabalite Warriors, Wyches or Wracks - take all of one or a mix, all depends on whether you want (shooty, assaulty, resilient) and how much of each you're after.

FA:
Erm.. personally I like scourges with 2 haywire blasters in blocks of 5,
but this is pretty personal choice and depends on the list and the person, there are those who like hellions, those who like bikes, those who prefer beast packs etc.

Heavy Support:
Ravager / Razorwing - these are both fast hunters. the ravager for tank hunting, the razorwing for tank + ant infantry.

Talos - Talos is a close combat beast. TL Liquifier Guns are great, the TL Haywire Blaster or a Splinter Cannon are useful, and it's a big old monstrous creature, though a bit slow. Useful in a coven or WWP list.

Personally, I have 2 Ravagers and 2 Talos (and a cronos)

I also like Haywire Blasters in particular because it's a S4 hit (can still glance AV10) + Haywire.

But ultimately - the best way is to read through the codex and decide what's favourite for you.

Yes, I was thinking about using the Duke...does his Poison upgrade affect just Kabalite Warriors? If not maybe 5 Trueborn with shredder cannons in a Venom.

I don't know about Grotesques...without a Haemy, they go full slow...unless 2 Haemies can act indepently of each other i.e no squad cohesion...

2 haemys can act independently of each other in an army. You could have up to 6 haemys spread out between 6 squads to give each a pain token they do not have to be together in a squad. Duke is just awesome I usually run him with a 4 man squad of trueborn with blasters. While they fly around and pop tanks he hops out at some point to whack on some troops it has worked well for me so far.

Oh and his poison thing does only work with either a trueborn squad or a kabalite squad which he has to start with at the beginning of the game.

Begel Dverl wrote:Yes, I was thinking about using the Duke...does his Poison upgrade affect just Kabalite Warriors? If not maybe 5 Trueborn with shredder cannons in a Venom.

I don't know about Grotesques...without a Haemy, they go full slow...unless 2 Haemies can act indepently of each other i.e no squad cohesion...

I'd suggest getting the codex and reading to start

Grotesques require a haemy, but you take up to 3 Haemys as a single choice - as in, it's still 1-3 seperate units, all ICs but only uses 1 HQ slot.

The Dukes poison upgrade works on any Kabalite Warrior and Kabalite Trueborn he joins. The most effective uses of this is sitting him in a squad of 20 Kabalite Warriors with 2 splinter cannons (makes 12 Splinter Cannon shots at 36", 18 Splinter Rifle Shots at 24 inches and a further 18 rifle rounds at 12") for a potential 30-48 3+ poison shots. Though tbh, the standard warrior (rifles) work as well as ablative armour as anything .

Alright, so if I got more than one haemy, what should I arm it with? There is one in the store now, and I am thinking about buying it.

Begel Dverl wrote:Alright, so if I got more than one haemy, what should I arm it with? There is one in the store now, and I am thinking about buying it.

shattershard is a pretty. Its a one shot flamer that instagibs anything that failed its toughness test.

I personally refuse to pay 10 quid per haemy.

I'm currently converting all mine out of Wood Elf Dryads.
Also Grotesques from Wood Elf Dryads, though Rat Ogres work too.

But with dryads... 6 Haemys + 6 Grots = £15-20
With official models... 6 haemys + 6 grots = £138

yeeeeah.

Best load out for a Haemy is Liquifier Gun.
You can also give venomblade for 2+ poinson in CC.
Hex rifles are fun. But pretty much everything else is just personal taste / giggles.

Ovion wrote:I personally refuse to pay 10 quid per haemy.

I live in 'Murica; I don't use quids.

I have heard that flesh gaunlets are good...especially on Grotesques.

Against most things Grotesques wound on a 2-3+ anyway.
Giving the grotesque a Flesh Gauntlet a poison weapon that causes instant death, that it can re-roll against anything with T5 or less is relatively good yes. BUT - how many multiwound models are the grots going to be fighting that 15-30 S5-6 hits aren't going to finish off anyway.

I find Scissorhands to be far more effective with the bonus attacks granted and lower cost.

And lets put it another way.
Cost of 2 Haemonculi = slightly more than the cost of 1 box of 12 Dryads.

For buying stuff purposes....You will need Raiders. You will need Venoms. Almost regardless of what style, you will want to buy these and probably 1-3 to start. Personally, I like raiders for their dark lances but venoms can shred infrantry with their s. cannons.

Ohyeah.. forgot about dedicated transports xD

I use 2 venoms and a raider myself.

I'm assuming 2 kabalite warriors and a squad of incubi(?) in the transports?

2 Squads of 5 Wracks and one of 4 Grotesques actually.

At least thats what's in mine. :p

Would an Archon and 2 haemies suffice?

Are the rules for the court okay for a raider rush list?

Begel Dverl wrote:Would an Archon and 2 haemies suffice?

Are the rules for the court okay for a raider rush list?

I would stay clear of the court. It's not that good and is really expensive.

OP:

What's your goal? I don't want to give you advice without knowing what you're trying to do. Do you want wracks, or was that just something you saw in White Dwarf?

There are two links in my signature that are worth a read if you're planning on starting Dark Eldar. The first is the Tactical Guide on beating face with Dark Eldar; something I take great pride in doing. Both my kabalite and my wych cult armies are linked in that article, and there are discussions about both. The second is the DE Mythbusters article, which I actually just finished the other day. It addresses some of the things floating around the internet about DE that the unwary believe.

Okay, just got the codex. Now all I have to do is make my list.

A veteran player helped me with as to what to get. He said mechanize evrything and use ravagers. So I developed a tactic.

Use the Ravagers and/or Raiders (all with DL) to pop transports. Send three Raiders with Wyches to mop up those in the transports. Destroy any tanks (battlewagon, leman russ, etc.) with the Ravagers and then send out two more Raiders (this time with Kabalite Warrirors armed with whatever) and mop up anything not a tank. I want to use the Duke,but I have yet to find a way for him to do anything.

Unautomatically appended next post:

Hello! I'm back with a list!

HQ
*Duke Sliscus

ELITES
*Kabalite Trueborn (4 Trueborn)
-4 Blasters
*Venom
-2 Splinter Cannons
-Flickerfield

TROOPS
*Kabalite Warriors (9 Warriors and a Sybarite)
*Sybarite Upgrade
-Agonizer

*Raider
-Dark Lance

*Kabalite Warriors (9 Warriors and a Sybarite)
*Sybarite Upgrade
-Agonizer

*Raider
-Dark Lance

*Wych Squad (9 Wyches and a Hekatrix)
-Hydra Gauntlets
*Hekatrix Upgrade
-Agonizer

*Raider
-Dark Lance

Wych Squad (9 Wyches and a Hekatrix)
-Hydra Gauntlets
*Hekatrix Upgrade
-Agonizer

*Raider
Dark Lance

Wych Squad (9 Wyches and a Hekatrix)
-Hydra Gauntlets
*Hekatrix Upgrade
-Agonizer

*Raider
-Dark Lance

HEAVY SUPPORT
*Ravager

*Ravager