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hey dakkites,
Me and a couple buddies of mine decided to start a new 40k army with a twist. each of us needs a starting army of 250 pts and each month were going to add 250 pts each month till we've got 2000 point armies. ive not been collecting 40k for long so saw this as a opportnity and need some help im working out a 250pts space marine army that includes 5 scouts (not with snipers) as i already have those and also wanted to include telion (if possible). were not going to start battling until we've got at least 500pts of models each and id like a list that can win. my friends are using tyranids and grey knights. Ive heard that tyranids and grey knights are both really good at shooting and close combat. Any help you could advise will be welcomed.

Nids and GK are two very different armies as far as style of play. The good thing for you is that at low point levels knights will generally have a very low number of models on the board.

The thing with Tellion is while he's really cool, you can't afford to throw around 50 points like that until larger games. Focus on just adding "meat" to your army first. Tactical squads are great as they are very versatile. I highly suggest magnetizing them as you'll want meltaguns or plasma guns for GK and flamers and the like for Nids.
Don't forget you need an HQ. STAY CHEAP! All the different SM HQ options can be tantalizing, but you can't afford to get carried away this cheap. At first try to stay as simple as you can. The three main options are available, it all just depends on taste. Remember, captains and chaplains like to be in combat, libbies can be combat or close support.
More than that, remember to have fun building you list. As for fighting, shoot the fighty stuff, and fight the shooty stuff. Space marines are generally not specialists- they can do a lot. Therefore don't let your opponent's specialists do what they're good at.

I agree with everything that swordshaver said ^ but one thing make sure you add quite a few bolters into play here, especially when it comes to the nids. having a few sniper rifles is a great support especially when you infiltrate but scouts are weak and will most definitely get ripped apart if anything gets to close.

Is there any help to build an army you can give ? I dont have the space marine codex yet so i cant make an army yet. Also, on a side note, what is best to make scouts up as ?? bolters, shotguns or tailored for assault ????

Do you have to include a HQ in your initial 250pts?

My suggestion for 500pts would be
Librarian (Avenger, Force Dome)
Scouts (5) (CCW & BP)
Scouts (5) (Snipers)
Dreadnought (Twin-linked Autocannon, Twin-linked Autocannon)
Dreadnought (Twin-linked Autocannon, Twin-linked Autocannon)

Maybe swap Force Dome for Gate of Infinity if you wanted to jump around, lots of long range fire power, a close combat unit (dreads can also tarpit) and generally pretty fun to play.

Yes we need a HQ. were trying to do it all legal so starting with 2 Troops and a HQ. i was going to have a unit of scouts, a unit of 5 tactical marines and a captain as a starter army. does that look ok ??

Just to add a bit of help my tyranid friend is going to have a tyranid prime and genestealers in his 250pts army. ive seen the tyranid codex and the prime is awesome, is there any way a small space marine army can beat it ???

At your current level, I'd use sniper rifles to take out the prime. A missile launcher would help too.

Well, it depends if you want to follow the FOC strictly or not - especially for low-points armies.

Usually for low points (under 400-500pts), the only restriction is 1+ Troops Choice.

Option 1 : Standard FOC (1HQ, 2+ Troops) (silly, but... who knows)

You actually don't have much of a choice

HQ : Captain or Librarian - 100pts (if someone can confirm a Librarian is 100pts, that'd be great - in which case it's preferred to Captain due to psychic powers)

Troops 1 : Scout Squad (5 Snipers) - 75pts
Troops 2 : Scout Squad (5 BP & CCW) - 75pts

Total : 250pts

You'll want the HQ to go with the close combat squad, under support fire from the Sniper Squad.
You should be able to handle Tyranids Monstruous Creatures with the Sniper Rifles, but you'll have problems if GK bring in Henchmen squads in vehicles (Razorback, etc) as you have almost nothing to harm them (except with the Librarian's psychic powers - Machine Curse, Might of the Ancients, Vortex of Doom, or Krak grenades in hand to hand).

Option 2 : Adaptative FOC (1+ Troops, 0-1 from all others)

Either :

Troops 1 : Scout Squad (4 Snipers, 1 Missile Launcher) - 85pts
Troops 2 : Tactical Squad (Combi-melta, Power Fist) - 125pts

Dedicated Transport : Razorback - 40pts

Total : 250pts

Or :

Troops 1 : Scout Squad (4 Snipers, 1 Missile Launcher) - 85pts
Troops 2 : Tactical Squad - 90pts

Dedicated Transport : Razorback (Twin-Linked Assault Cannon) - 75pts

Total : 250pts

Or :

Troops 1 : Scout Squad (4 Snipers, 1 Missile Launche, Combi-Melta) - 95pts

Fast Attack 1 : Land Speeder (Multi-Melta, Heavy Flamer) - 70pts

Heavy Support 1 : Predator (Heavy Bolter Sponsons) - 85pts

Total : 250pts

The latest one maybe being the most efficient, but a lucky can screw your plans !

If you want more troops, go with Scout Squads + Tactical ; if you want more armour, go with Dakka Predator (pretty cost-efficient at low levels) & Land Speeder.

Or, if you really want Telion & a fluffy Scout list, go for :

Troops 1 : Scout Squad (4 Snipers, Telion) - 125pts
Troops 2 : Scout Squad (BP & CCW) - 75pts

Fast Attack 1 : Land Speeder Storm (transport for Troops 2) - 50pts

Total : 250pts

Hope that helps !

I like those lists. ill talk to my friends and see if we can change the force organisation. btw ive got some spare space marine weapons from another friend and in them is a bolter/ plasma pistol combo and a power fist. can scouts take these weapons and is it worth it ?? i think they look really cool.

Well, the problem with SM (or CSM) is that their HQ & Troop Choices are expensive for low point armies.

So if you want to strictly follow the FOC (which is kinda silly, for 250pts), since the cheapest HQ is 100pts, and the cheapest Troops is 75pts, it doesn't have much of a deal...

Whereas with the 1+ Troops, it's far more customizable !

Alternatively, offer the use of "Elite" characters to count as your HQ.

The 50pts Techmarine, for instance, would be better suited to low points armies...

As for your question about weapons :
- combi-weapons in general are pretty useful in the metagame. They're not so expensive, and can get you out of trouble if neeeded. Combi-plasma coud be useful in your case for popping low AV vehicles (Razorback, Chimeras, Dreads?) or hurting monstruous creatures.
- powerfists are useful against walkers, MCs & vehicles again, but are really expensive in low-points games : 25pts is 10% of your total allowance ! For a 23pts Scout Sergeant, that is more than double its price !

As you have seen in my previous post, there are lists with, some without. It also depends on your type of play !

I want a balanced all comers force so a mix of shooting and close combat.
A bit of background on my army is a rough fighters force thats been in combat with the tyranids on their lava based homeworld for hundreds of years. They rely heavily on scouts to co-ordinate attacks and a small number of veterans. There a small chapter due to the tyranids destroying most of their number and are lead by a librarian and a crazy close combat commander (crazy as in suicidal crazy, not good lol).