Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Ok so every month my brother, our friend and me play a small 40k touney. At first my brother was playing eldar and our friend was using space wolves, then he drop his wolve to start imperial guard. I didn't mind this because guard were easier to vs than his wolves, he eventually stopped the guard becase he was get beat a beat and went back to wolves, at this point my brother stopped using his eldar because they were getting beat aswell and started space marines. Again for me with my tau i have to vs wolves and marines again (my brother originally started 40k with Black Templars) and this ruined things for me because i have only ever beaten marines once and the was my friends space wolves and i wiped him on turn 2 ( never again though ) so for ages i had been putting up with the punishment of MEQ armies. My friend recently purchased a full necron army played that a few times, we had a small kill team tourney we my brother used his eldar again and our friend used necrons and i actually won that tourney using kroot agaist necron piriaha's ( sorry if spelt wrong ) and won in close combat and a crisis team against eldar. And now my brothers using Templars again and flogging the hell out of me and our friend started Daemonhunts and is flogging the hell out of his Templars.

Sorry for the life story but i thought a bit of background would help


I have yet to vs the Daemonhunters but i would greatly appriciate and tips or strategies that i could employ with Tau to beat them and those darn Templars, Space Wolves and Necrons.

Please i'm sick of getting pounded by MEQ's Help Me

That s alot of armies.

Necrons- Easy enough for a month or two before they are re-done. Railgun the monilithes, shoot the destroyers and stay away from the warriors. Only have an effective shooting range of 12' when they move.

Grey knights- I find the best thing with these guys is a squad of helios suits with marker light support. Add in a unit of plasma multitracker broadsides and they ll generally never make it to you.

Black Templars- I say try the same as grey knights if its infantry based. Focus fire on one unit at a time to stop them from using there extra movement rule. Piranha's might be useful to movement block as well.

Space Wolves- I haven t really found a counter to long fangs yet. Lots of long range shooting on them and stay in cover. Maybe use drones to stop instant deaths on your suits.

Honestly . . . Tau is the worst codex imo. You can try to make them good, but after the new Necron Codex coming, Tau are going to be the least powerful army.

Although against Black Templars, use Piranhas so that he has to chase them everytime you shoot him.

You should get a competive army preferably White dwarf sisters of battle or vampire counts note CSM are pretty broken to

rovian wrote:You should get a competive army preferably White dwarf sisters of battle or vampire counts note CSM are pretty broken to

Ummm I think this overused image sums up this post well:



White Dwarf Sisters aren't competitive at all, Vampire Counts aren't a 40k army and CSM aren't broken at all (not overpowered, but not garbage either).

Yeah it was a joke but also quite realistic in you will consitently lose to your opponents.

You're not making it very easy to help you.

Give us your list; chances are you're just not very good at building an army.

How do you generally deploy? When you look at your opponents army, what do you try to shoot at first?

What sort of list does your friend run? Are we talking heavy mech (10+ vehicles) or mostly footslogging? Does he take a large amount of long range anti-tank? When I say large amount, I mean 15+ Missile launchers.

Do you JSJ in and out of cover? Are you using Kroot/Gun Drones as infantry blockers? Are you taking Piranhas to block enemy tanks? Are you taking Pathfinders? If so, what do you prioritise your marklights on?

There is no secret silver bullet to fighting MEQ's, you just have to be a better player.

As a potential ThreadJack, I have problems with my tau vs fast moving, CC oriented units. Namely, Dark Eldar wyches in raiders (with enhanced aethersails coming in from reserves) and Beastmaster units (either fleeting across the table in large, wound allocated units or coming from webway portals). Other than kroot-wrap, are their any hard counters to these fast assault units that I'm just not seeing?

Tau deal best with MEQ's using massed pulse rifle fire, railguns, and plasma/fusion suits. If they're using transports err on the side of more railguns and make them footslog through your fire, if they're on foot volume of fire helps more than railguns.

AnomanderRake wrote:Tau deal best with MEQ's using massed pulse rifle fire, railguns, and plasma/fusion suits. If they're using transports err on the side of more railguns and make them footslog through your fire, if they're on foot volume of fire helps more than railguns.

This. Plus the fact that, funnily enough, at least half of these armies are more assault-oriented. That means you'll get to shoot them a bit until they come at you, but since Tau already have the worst CC abilities, all their CC upgrades will be overkill and pretty much worthless. You actually have a better chance of winning then you think.

Also remember, 'crons don't have transports (yet), so, as Anomander put it, volume of fire. SM's, however, would be insane not to take vehicles, so railgun them. Aaaaand good luck on your imminnt decimation!

OP, you can't help your cause unless you tell us what exactly do you have?

Best thing I can say from experience for MEQ's are pulse rifle missile pod suits. pulse rifle ensures that regular footsloggers get shot untill they're gone. I keep 3 units of 3 XV8's with plasma MP with 2 sasho's same build. You can inflict wounds from 36" and when they are in 24" some are sure to die, when they come within 12", massed fire from just one unit of 3 and sasho are enough to cripple a unit of MEQ's. the other 2 are to kill remainders / deter any others.

Use FOF, that is, 12 man FW in devil fish. I play meched up with MT's. it lets me move 12" and still fire, so I don't have to worry about someone popping my tanks. Sense most are CC related, keep this in mind. Scoot and shoot man. You can move the fish 12" and suits 6", fire into a squad, and 6" again behind the fish for cover. I ALWAYS take shield drones. they have proven so useful to me in every game I play.

I've fought wolves many times, mainly drop wolves. He drops in my face and what ever unit is dumb enough to drop in 18" of suits get anihilated with 6 BS4 plas shots and 2 BS5 plas shots. this cripples them than I move away 6" and make them come get me. if they take the bait then cool, blast the remaining 3 or 4, and move away. if they run to someone else, SMS launches shots on them or they're close enough to get MP shots into them.

AchillesFTW wrote:

Although against Black Templars, use Piranhas so that he has to chase them everytime you shoot him.

Won't work, he doesn't have to move at all.

As a potential ThreadJack, I have problems with my tau vs fast moving, CC oriented units. Namely, Dark Eldar wyches in raiders (with enhanced aethersails coming in from reserves) and Beastmaster units (either fleeting across the table in large, wound allocated units or coming from webway portals). Other than kroot-wrap, are their any hard counters to these fast assault units that I'm just not seeing?

This will sound a bit mad, but I use Farsight and when i m playing dark eldar I put him in my 3 broadside unit with shield drones. Incubi are pretty much the only unit that beat them in combat and if you let them near your broadsides you ve done something really wrong. The first time i played a portal (and i didn t know it even existed) it ended up 20' away from my broadsides and they got charged by 10-11 beasts and 4 masters and they kicked their ass over a few rounds of combat. And it wasn t fluke either, they should on average win just cause of the terminator armour + invunerable saves. And we all know how a long range heavy support fight between those two armies will end so the unit just rocks generally. However you do lose out on kroot bubble wrap.

rovian wrote:Yeah it was a joke but also quite realistic in you will consitently lose to your opponents.

haha figured as much

Abyssel wrote:OP, you can't help your cause unless you tell us what exactly do you have?

Answering questions is too hard, much easier to just start a thread. God forbid someone has to actually THINK rather than have everything given to them on a silver platter.

I say this because if we dont know what he has to work with, all we can tell him is "buy more suits and devilfish."

Had a sarcastic comment for a responder, decided better. Noob enough to not no how to delete post.

ok since i cannot multi-quote ( i don't know how ) to the guy the says Tau are the worst army, your wrong they are really good, you just have to know how to use them and since some people don't they lose a lot and people think Tau are bad, and i'm not saying i win every game but i win a few and its when i work my startergy well is when i win.

to the guy the want a list and said i cannot make a good one.
Tau Army List 1850 Points

HQ
Shas’el
Missile Pods
Plasma Rifle
Targeting Array
H-W Multi-Tracker
Bonding Knife
H-W Target Lock
Stimulant Injector
H-W Blacksun Filter
125 Points
^^^ the blacksun filter and stimulant injector are there cos i had and extra 15 or so points.


Troops
10 Fire Warriors
Pulse Rifles
Shas’ui Team Leader
Bonding Knife
Devilfish
Disruption Pod
200 Points

10 Fire Warriors
Pulse Rifles
Shas’ui Team Leader
Bonding Knife
Devilfish
Disruption Pod
200 Points

10 Fire Warriors
Pulse Rifles
Shas’ui Team Leader
Bonding Knife
Devilfish
Disruption Pod
200 Points

Elitesn

2 Crisis Suits
Twin-Linked Missile Pods
Targeting Array
116 Points

2 Crisis Suits
Plasma Rifles
Burst Cannons
Multi-Trackers
116 Points

2 Crisis Suits
Plasma Rifles
Missile Pods
Multi-Trackers
124 Points









Heavy Support
3 Broadsides
Twin-Linked Railguns
Smart Missile System
Targeting Array
Team Leader
H-W Drone Controller
2 Shield Drones
H-W Target Lock
Bonding Knife
285 Points

Hammerhead Gunship
Hammerhead Ion Cannon
Disruption Pods
Burst Cannons
Multi-Tracker
130 Points

Hammerhead Gunship
Hammerhead Ion Cannon
Disruption Pods
Burst Cannons
Multi-Tracker
130 Points

Fast Attack
4 Pathfinders
Pulse carbines
Marker Lights
Devilfish
Disruption Pod
Multi-Tracker
143 Points

Piranha
Fusion Blaster
Gun Drones
Disruption Pod
Targeting Array
80 Points

Total Points 1849

i fielded this agaist a grey knight army the other day, it was 1850 points size ground spear head deployment. i had him beat on turn two, only his assassin with the 2+ cover save and his grandmaster with 2 wounds left, survived till turn 6 ( we didn't get to continue cos didn't roll high enough ) i healdan objective and his assassin held the other one ( i was 8" from contesting range with my piranah), he was lucky to roll well enough to survive till turn six with those two guys.

reckon my Tau are the worst now and i can't make a good list. and to the guy who thinks there not competitive. i watch this army beat time and time again and come no where close to losing and in me eyes i beat him, but it was technically a draw. if we had a turn longer i would have one for sure.

I love it.

Out of curiosity, where in Aus are you?

Competitively, Tau suffer because of gakky troops that add very little to the army. Once Devilfish are cheaper, Fast and can take Ion Cannons they'll be better.
Your list still need improvement. Anytime you find yourself taking superfluous upgrades because 'you had spare points' indicates you're not building it properly.

Drop the Bonding Knife, Target Lock, Black Sun Filter and Stimulant Injector from the Shas'el.
Drop the Shas'ui upgrade the Bonding knife from your Fire Warriors.
Drop the Multitracker from the Devilfish.

Your Piranha is 75 points, not 80.
Give your Hammerheads Railguns instead of Ion Cannons. It's much cheaper to take Crisis Suits than Hammerheads.
Take more suits, and more missile pods.
Your Fire Warriors don't need to be 10 men, either go 9 or 12. Units take leadership checks at 25% casualties, going for 9/12 maximises the losses you can take before taking a check.
Increase the Pathfinders to atleast 6. That way, statistically, you can remove the cover save from one unit per turn. Not that they'll live beyond turn 2, but hey.
Take Kroot for bubblewrapping and objective games.

What sort of list does your opponent run? Like I said, the more information you can give, the better.

You can multi quote using the HTML quote commands [ quote ] and [ /quote ]

unbeliever87 wrote:Out of curiosity, where in Aus are you?

Competitively, Tau suffer because of gakky troops that add very little to the army. Once Devilfish are cheaper, Fast and can take Ion Cannons they'll be better.
Your list still need improvement. Anytime you find yourself taking superfluous upgrades because 'you had spare points' indicates you're not building it properly.

Drop the Bonding Knife, Target Lock, Black Sun Filter and Stimulant Injector from the Shas'el.
Drop the Shas'ui upgrade the Bonding knife from your Fire Warriors.
Drop the Multitracker from the Devilfish.

Your Piranha is 75 points, not 80.
Give your Hammerheads Railguns instead of Ion Cannons. It's much cheaper to take Crisis Suits than Hammerheads.
Take more suits, and more missile pods.
Your Fire Warriors don't need to be 10 men, either go 9 or 12. Units take leadership checks at 25% casualties, going for 9/12 maximises the losses you can take before taking a check.
Increase the Pathfinders to atleast 6. That way, statistically, you can remove the cover save from one unit per turn. Not that they'll live beyond turn 2, but hey.
Take Kroot for bubblewrapping and objective games.

What sort of list does your opponent run? Like I said, the more information you can give, the better.

You can multi quote using the HTML quote commands [ quote ] and [ /quote ]

I'm in the Newcastle area , NSW bit of distance between us
pretty sure he ran a grand master, vindicair assassin, two terminator squads in storm raven gunships and also two venerable dreadnoughts in the storm ravens aswell.
yeah there were a few errors i forgot to remove from the list, unlike every one i really like fire warriors they wound MEQ's on a 3+ and my opponent roles lots of ones with terminators , the more wounds the more chance of them failing

the bonding knife on the shas'el is because he went with the fireknife team and the target lock is because i generally have a need to split fire, when them is like one man left in the enemy unit. bonded fire warriors means regroups and since the objectives are on the edge of the table you can survive one fall back if your lucky, then you can regroup and get back on it. that multi tracker is there because i forgot to remove it, i removed them of the fire warriors devilfish.

yeah your right with the fire warriors squad numbers, but for some reason i prefer to have 10 man squads i don't know why lol. my pathfinders worked pretty well and survived the whole game, even though a dreadnought was trying to kill them kroot are good in jungle or woods, and we only use a small piece of jugle terrain :(

but i just started a Chaos Space Marine army yesterday so i may give my Tau a rest for a while they have played hard for 3 years now its

Blood For The Blood God !!!

to weigh in on the subject IXLoiero95XI

Necrons - only have two players out here (one i live with and have never lost to)
*note on MY Tau approach IM A PR CRISIS player so keep that in mind with my advice. its not the only way to play just the way i like

ok the fist thing is the dreaded WBB which can be denied by a few ways the most important for Tau is killing the entire squad at once (not as hard as it sounds). works the best against destroyers as once they are all dead even IF there is an orb they do not roll WBB unless there is a living model within 6in see FAQ in GW site for the full explanation. so the big thing is concentraited fire as much as you can.

the next point is monoliths one word RAILGUNS that pretty much it str 8 can only glance it so its not reliable in striking it just use your str 10 and slag that thing keeping in mind its a BIG target that you will be able to shoot from the begining.

dealing with there troops basicly you wont need to much of necrons will be standard infantry and are really easy to kill just concentrait fire limiting the WBB and you can grind them down before they are to close. DO NOT waist fire on tele lords unless you can completely wipe the squad out seeing as how its usually attacking a flank that can get tricky so watch out for their distractions from your over all objective of phasing them out.

finally target priority is whats its all about
Rails attack monliths
short range threats like flayed ones
long range fire power to destroyers (if they are in range)
then start scything down the troops


Black templars - Ive fought them the least and only thier mass land raider build has been tough

like all marines you start with their mobility rhinos ,razors ,and raider need to die quickly so your str 7 on up will be devoted there first

templars get an extra move if you wound them so keep that in mind you will need to fully kill whatever squad you fire on or it will get to move at the end of your turn (sometimes its best NOT to shoot your last shots against a full squad) so holding back outside of optimal range will help you.



Space wolves - over half our meta of marines are these guys

standard target priority for marines here fastest assault/transports need to die first
yes they can bring a TON of stuff into your face fast oh well its the nature of their dex so you will have to use everything to assist you
cover is something ive found useful when its in the center of the map JSJ around it shot the hell out of whatever is coming then back around it most players will barrel through the terrain at where you landed force tests and die rolls for inches stuff like this CAN buy you time so use them in conjuction with everything else like kroot/FW screans hell ive even used devilfish before generally with SW your gonna have to sac something to their advance.

another element of the wolves that is really tough are the cheap long fang squads these guys will chew up battle suits with ease the hardest part is dealing with them while DAMN NEAR the rest of the wolf army is speeding to you. for this you can try to DS something back there to attack them. however you will hurt yourself against they opening push as most of what you need to fight that will be the few units that can DS. your best bet is to use terrain to block line of sight personaly i dont play unless there is some cover to block line of sight. another approach is if your MP have done the job of popping open the trans ports and the damn wolf cavalry is dead move some of the big guns to the long fangs if they have small numbers if you can trim them down to two your drones can save you but its IF you mange to stop their advance.

after that its the same old kill the fastest/closest units till the game end


I hope that helps as i did not read anything to specific on parts of the fight that vex you and grats on your fight with grey knights, i love fighting them with my Tau they are cake to kill