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I recently decided to switch to a cc army since im bored of shooting n I was wondering what everyones opinion is for the best one?

at the moment im thinking a wych cult with lelith/haem/wyches/incubi/trueborn blaster/ravagers or just speed freak orks

I'd say orkies


but I'm slightly biased. GK's are kind of OP atm I hear.

cough nids cough

Da orks is made fer winnin'. 'Nuff said.

you run your orks into a almost limetless tide of gaunts and see where it gets you

Two words- Khorne Daemons

I refer to my previous statement

Run your daemons into an almost limitless tide of gaunts and see where it gets you, sorry but my CSM's beats khorne daemons in cc and nids beats my csm in cc... nids win

Tyranic Marta wrote:I refer to my previous statement

Run your daemons into an almost limitless tide of gaunts and see where it gets you, sorry but my CSM's beats khorne daemons in cc and nids beats my csm in cc... nids win

I see ur itty bitty bugs and raise you 500 gretchins!

Blood angels.

'nids are too heavily reliant on cc so are hit and miss.
Orks are great but actually do not have a real cc edge they just have numbers edge.
Gk purifer's list is just cheating.

waaaaghboss wrote:

Tyranic Marta wrote:I refer to my previous statement

Run your daemons into an almost limitless tide of gaunts and see where it gets you, sorry but my CSM's beats khorne daemons in cc and nids beats my csm in cc... nids win

I see ur itty bitty bugs and raise you 500 gretchins!

My itty bitty bugs walk all over your gretchins with I6 toxin sacs


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Honestly he asked for the best army in close combat that is nids, wether they an effective army or not is up to your skill as a player

Tyranic Marta wrote:Honestly he asked for the best army in close combat that is nids, wether they an effective army or not is up to your skill as a player

No, he didn't really, even if it was meant.

He asked which is the best/competitive cc army. Not best army in cc. We all know that if you get into cc against nids you will die. Yes, it is weird implication that gretchin can do anything, yes orks can kill in cc but even then you can not outswarm 'nids.

Tyranic Marta wrote:

waaaaghboss wrote:

Tyranic Marta wrote:I refer to my previous statement

Run your daemons into an almost limitless tide of gaunts and see where it gets you, sorry but my CSM's beats khorne daemons in cc and nids beats my csm in cc... nids win

I see ur itty bitty bugs and raise you 500 gretchins!

My itty bitty bugs walk all over your gretchins with I6 toxin sacs


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Honestly he asked for the best army in close combat that is nids, wether they an effective army or not is up to your skill as a player

GK Purifiers will kill them with cleansing flame before they even get a chance to strike.

Kylis wrote:GK Purifiers will kill them with cleansing flame before they even get a chance to strike.

Actually I think a crowe list vs. 'nids wound be interesting. Shadows of the warp vs. force weapon and cleansing fire. I think my money is on the nids purely based on the doom of M.

MFletch wrote:

Kylis wrote:GK Purifiers will kill them with cleansing flame before they even get a chance to strike.

Actually I think a crowe list vs. 'nids wound be interesting. Shadows of the warp vs. force weapon and cleansing fire. I think my money is on the nids purely based on the doom of M.

How many competitive 'nid armies really have Doom of Malanthai?

Kylis wrote:

MFletch wrote:

Kylis wrote:GK Purifiers will kill them with cleansing flame before they even get a chance to strike.

Actually I think a crowe list vs. 'nids wound be interesting. Shadows of the warp vs. force weapon and cleansing fire. I think my money is on the nids purely based on the doom of M.

How many competitive 'nid armies really have Doom of Malanthai?

How many competitive 'nid armies exist?

No consideration for an all deathwing (mass TH/SS) with Belial?
6 squads of Combat Terminators all scoring?

KilroyKiljoy wrote:

Kylis wrote:

MFletch wrote:

Kylis wrote:GK Purifiers will kill them with cleansing flame before they even get a chance to strike.

Actually I think a crowe list vs. 'nids wound be interesting. Shadows of the warp vs. force weapon and cleansing fire. I think my money is on the nids purely based on the doom of M.

How many competitive 'nid armies really have Doom of Malanthai?

How many competitive 'nid armies exist?

Touche'

Seriously though, Tyranids spam CC in an insane way.

GK being overpowered I'd want to agree with, but hardly the best in CC. They spam PW attacks, and have cheap upgrades for the Daemon Hammers, but PW's often don't matter to orks, who rarely depend on armor.

I'd suggest the Blood Angels Codex....a personal favorite.

Start with 2 Librarians w/jump packs, 2 Sanguinary Priests w/jump packs, and 2 assault squads of 10 w/2 meltas(and maybe an inferno pistol) and the sgt with a PW(or maybe PF).

Librarians use Unleash Rage. 36 or so attacks, reroll missed hits, the librarian and sgt attacks ignore armor, and the entire unit has furious charge and FNP. S5 I5 attacks, 27 of which are going to hit. Pretty nasty!

Orks do have a real CC edge, its not all about numbers.

Take for example Nob Bikers, turn 2 you're in assault.I tend to field 6 bikers, 1 painboy, and 5 power klaws in that squad - all nobz different however so the turbo boost 3+ cover save / 5+ invulnerable, FNP on top of that, will protect them, then they will kill what they assault with WS5 S9 hits (4 attacks each on charge)

And dont forget the warboss on bike accompanying them

Tough question.

IMO, best competitive CC army is GKs. For very simple reasons.

1. They do NOT rely on the charge. They have I6 halberds, hammerhand (that stacks!), and the icing on the cake, power weapons.

2. They have ridiculous amounts of ways to manipulate combat before it even starts. Psychotroke grenades, cleansing flame, and their psychic powers (hammerhand, might of the titans, and shrouding to keep you away.)

3. Two wound terminators... with FNP.... and I6.... and they score.

You all have great points, but sadly GKs trump most everything out there nowadays in CC. Think of it this way, the one army that beats GKs consistently is the one army that is the worst at CC, Tau.

Wych cult is not to be scoffed at by anyone. Fast, fast, fast.

GK's do field some impressive units, but they field less, and die like marines....expensive marines.

Orks have many ways of delivering CC. Slog with mass numbers, mechanized with trukks and battlewagons, and bikes!

They are a fun army to play. You can do the best conversions with orks too. Anything goes!

Orks also fight anything, if fluff means anything to you. I have issues fighting other Imperial forces with BA/Vanilla marines.

If Orks don't charge, they do not excel in combat. Maybe Nob bikers, but they're boys will not do much damage in return and die easily with their save.

GKs have transports, and every single GK can DS in if necessary.

I like orks, but I do not take them in a match up vs GKs. (pending lists and players of course)

MFletch wrote:Blood angels.

'nids are too heavily reliant on cc so are hit and miss.
Orks are great but actually do not have a real cc edge they just have numbers edge.
Gk purifer's list is just cheating.

So T4 and Four attacks is something without an edge?
I would agree that If we don't charge then we're going to have a hard time and Its tough when against Hordes since we might get locked up.

Anyway GK's If you want no friends.
BA If you want Hate.
Orks If you want fun and a challenge, same goes for Nids.
DE Is for you.

If you think you want Wyches get them, a gut instinct on an Army is always a good sign It means your going to like and stick with them.

Good luck and read some Tacticas, I think Dashofpepper made a good one.

Go the DE route, but think about Wracks and Grotesques. They are nasty now, not a lot of people consider them, but used correctly they will be devastating, mark my words.

Orkaswampa wrote:Orks do have a real CC edge, its not all about numbers.

Take for example Nob Bikers, turn 2 you're in assault.I tend to field 6 bikers, 1 painboy, and 5 power klaws in that squad - all nobz different however so the turbo boost 3+ cover save / 5+ invulnerable, FNP on top of that, will protect them, then they will kill what they assault with WS5 S9 hits (4 attacks each on charge)

And dont forget the warboss on bike accompanying them

Is it a S9 or S10 hit on a nob with powerclaw during assault? I thought the +1 str was added for the assault, then doubled for the PK? I'm a noob orkie btw.

waaaaghboss wrote:

Orkaswampa wrote:Orks do have a real CC edge, its not all about numbers.

Take for example Nob Bikers, turn 2 you're in assault.I tend to field 6 bikers, 1 painboy, and 5 power klaws in that squad - all nobz different however so the turbo boost 3+ cover save / 5+ invulnerable, FNP on top of that, will protect them, then they will kill what they assault with WS5 S9 hits (4 attacks each on charge)

And dont forget the warboss on bike accompanying them

Is it a S9 or S10 hit on a nob with powerclaw during assault? I thought the +1 str was added for the assault, then doubled for the PK? I'm a noob orkie btw.

S9, I had the same question a while back. It's doubled, then added. 2x+1, not 2(x+1). Init, on the other hand, stays at 1 no matter what.

Tyranic Marta wrote:I refer to my previous statement

Run your daemons into an almost limitless tide of gaunts and see where it gets you, sorry but my CSM's beats khorne daemons in cc and nids beats my csm in cc... nids win

Endless tide of Gaunts?

Suddenly, BLENDER DREAD.

Blender dreads vs limitless gaunts. That would tough to figure out the exact kill points earned.

I just wanted to add something to the GKs vs Orks discussion. Assuming that you're going with the elite Paladin/Purifier setup, Orks have an edge over you in CC due to S9 Powerklaws present in every Ork mob. I recently witnessed a 1750 match between these two armies consisting of the aforementioned Paladin/Purifier GKs supported by 2 Psyrifleman dreads vs a wagon spam with 2 mobs of Ork boyz and 1 squad of FNP diversified Nobz supported by 2 squads of Lootas.

In this case, the Ork player had each squad perfectly suited to each task. Purifiers can't do squat against 2 wound Nobz and Paladins fold like regular marines against a blob powerklaw. That 2+ save, FNP and 2 wounds mean absolutely nothing against a S9 save and FNP ignoring, insant-death attack.

GKs are a great army with lots of neat tricks, but against Orks I don't see how they can compete in CC.

racta wrote:Blender dreads vs limitless gaunts. That would tough to figure out the exact kill points earned.

Lols easy!! The answer must be and always is chuck norris!