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Hey everyone, recently my foot list experimentation hit a speedbump in the form of a trygon, amoung other crazy critters a nid player fielded against me.

I had a fairly stupid list in hindsight, i wasted points in my HQ and elite choices, but at the end of the day it was a friendly game, and really it was my slowed deployment and unfamiliarity with the mission and nids.

So a Trygon ate 185pts of power blob, and 200 pts of HQ, and only took 2 wounds one of which regenerated.

A tervigon i was shooting at took 5 wounds, 3 regenerated over the course of the game..

Not an MC but still super crazy was the Parasite with flying ripperswarms as guards. This thing is sick. It spawned 7 rippers and took out a power blob with minimal casualties.

Tyrannofex.. It was useless at shooting me, but it only took 2 wounds in the end.
Oh and 6 ymgarl genestealers ate my two artillery pieces by turn 3-4.

I had a reasonable 9 meltas, 2 plasmaguns 1 lascannon, 3 plasmacannons (on armoured sentinels), 4 flamers.. But still i couldnt enough shots on the big guys before they were in CC where there was nothing i could do. It was a 'fighting retreat' mission with diagonal table deployment.

What is the best way for IG foot lists to deal with MC's?

Buy Chimeras! lol no seriously I guess get more guns. Learn to use bubble wrap of throw away blobs strung out so he can't get a multi assault but will win combat so you can shot him. Really I can't see how foot ig can win against nids if he takes ymgarl and you're no using the SC that lets you outflank so you're not trying to play gunline and getting run over

During the battle around 60 gaunts were spawned too haha.. Well i think speedbump units would work, if only i then had something useful to shoot with waiting nearby..

And i admit my deployment was crap given i didnt realise what diagonal table split meant. The guy just came on the far corner very close to my left deployment. I deployed in alot of annoying terrain akong my whole front, and he came onto the board 95% on my left flank and got 2nd turn assault.. So was crap conditions to begin with. I didnt get to choose any of the battles, he assaulted what he wanted when he wanted. He is a very good player though, but i screwed up SO bad it almost made me sick seeing the game play out like that.

I think my 'proper' foot list with 7 lascannons and around 14 meltas would do better, with smarter deployment

kyranzor wrote:

I had a reasonable 9 meltas, 2 plasmaguns 1 lascannon, 3 plasmacannons (on armoured sentinels), 4 flamers.. But still i couldnt enough shots on the big guys before they were in CC where there was nothing i could do. It was a 'fighting retreat' mission with diagonal table deployment.

What is the best way for IG foot lists to deal with MC's?

Assuming we are talking about 1750-2000pts this really isn't very much firepower, that's maybe 1000pts of stuff right there. On foot you lose out on mobility and to some extent durability that transports give you, so you have to make up for it by having MORE firepower than an equivalent point mech list. Notably you need some more long ranged firepower, Autocannons and Missiles being the obvious ones, meltas aren't going to cut it when they are only going to be firing once before getting eaten.

I wasted points on a valkyrie, commander upgrades, lord commissar, stormtroopers, marbo, plasma sentinels, and ratlings. By dropping those i could have brought around 8 heavy weapon teams worth of missile launchers. Pretty sure 24 ML would have been more.effective than what i had. I wasted 760 points on crap which had absolutely no effect during the game except for the odd gaunt kill or maybe a warrior, or a few wounds on an MC.

I wish i got more time to play the guy more with a different list. Hehe. And yes it was 2000 points i am pretty sure of it

Ratling Snipers!!!
I kid I kid, AC and LC HWT with Bring it Down is probably the way to go.

you're lacking firepower

you don't want to deal with these in assault, though I dont see how a trygon managed to elminate a power blob, he's killing up to 6 men a turn, in the course of a game thats only 30 or so men if every single attack kills

-special weapon squads with melta and/or plasma are your friend, you can take tons of these things and hide them amongst your blobs, not to mention all your platoons should be led by a melta or plasma command squad, maybe grenade launchers if you want them to stay back a bit.

-autocannons are nice but if you are facing alot of mc's maybe lascannons or missle launchers are in order, I generally intermix autocannons into my blobs to get more men into close combat, that and my first shooting phase is usually a withering hail of lasgun and autocannon fire

-I dont know how you spent 200 points on an hq, im guessing a pumped out straken squad? thats a huge waist.
-stormtroopers are great, they give you deep striking melta/plasma, or I just infiltrate them out of the way and put out an annoying burst of hotshot las fire every turn, you can either devote fire to the little annoying squad, run out of the way to get them or let them pelt you
-lord commisars are required to babysit heavy weapon squads
-ratlings are bad

so yeah, you wasted tons of points there, if you play infantry guard you play them like orcs, remember only half your weapons will even hit, if you had every special weapon in your entire army fire at a trygon in one turn it wouldn't have even killed it, you need more firepower.
If your deployment is saturated with infantry, at that point consider al'harim.

I can whip up a quick infantry 2k list if you want.

No thanks Grundz, i can handle the lists usually, i was really just messing around and was the first time against nids in 3-4 years.

I appreciate the advice. I'll see how a 3 plasma special weapons team goes, at 80 points they are pretty cool. I dont quite have enough men or special weapons models to do a proper 2k points foot list, and i desperately need more plasmaguns. I'll have to model some i think. In my gallery you will see my converted meltagunners haha.

Supposedly using bring it down with two plasma spec wep sqds will be easily enough to kill a trygon. 12 twinlinked plasmagun shots is plenty.

Same deal goes with plasma vets on foot, but they are better when orders fail and surviving ranged fire. A 6 man special weapons team even with cover saves wont last long from shooting..

With 2k points i want to have 3 x 30 man melta blobs and 12-16 lascannons, and vets with camo cloak and x3 plasma as support. Most likely with creed and alrahim.

Edit:
Here is a list for 1500pts i made a week or two ago. To make it 2k points i'd put 3 minsized stormtrooper squads with plasma or melta, and 1-2 more lascannon/missile heavy weapon squads

you didnt post the list, XD

Anyways, remember that SWS squads have difficulty accepting orders with no commisar or vox, and no lord commisar standing around to give them high leadership, they can be problematic. so again, bring more firepower than you think you'll need just in case.

but yeah, at 2k points I'd be running at least 200 guardsmen, that leaves ~1000pts for upgrades there's something to be said for on turn 2 letting loose with first rank/2nd rank 600 lasgun shots and/or assaulting with dozens of creed-enhanced power weapons.

you can really, really stuff alot of guardsmen into a foot list which can be really really funny if your opponent is expecting a mech army and you are setting up with a tide of men that all his autocannons and lasplas is wasted against

Haha crazy, 200 men.

is that in 6 blobs of 30, with command units on top?

When i finish building the last of my guardsmen, i'll have only 130 regular men. I'm fairly vehicle-heavy though, with 9 chimera, 3 battletanks, 1 demolisher, 2 basilisks, and a manticore. I might do some kind of epic hybrid list at 2.5k points that uses my whole army, if possible!

kyranzor wrote:Haha crazy, 200 men.

is that in 6 blobs of 30, with command units on top?

When i finish building the last of my guardsmen, i'll have only 130 regular men. I'm fairly vehicle-heavy though, with 9 chimera, 3 battletanks, 1 demolisher, 2 basilisks, and a manticore. I might do some kind of epic hybrid list at 2.5k points that uses my whole army, if possible!

Well see, that is a mech army, not an infantry army

My Here I dug up the 2k list so you can bask in the insanity, lol
the idea of infantry guard is resliance, they carry a lot of guns, a decent amount of power weapons, and most players bring anti-vehicle weaponry to the game where you have nothing for them to shoot at.

HQ:
Command squad, Creed, sniper rifles or grenade launchers, vox -160

Troops:
Infantry blob A (mainstay force A) - 480pts 56 men
Command squad, 3 plasma, vox - 80

Commisar, power weapon - 45
Infantry A: power weapon, autocannon, vox - 75
Infantry B: power weapon, autocannon - 70
Infantry C: power weapon, autocannon - 70

Infantry D: lascannon - 70
Infantry E: lascannon - 70

Infantry blob B (mainstay force B) - 480pts 56 men
Command squad, 3 plasma, vox - 80

Commisar, power weapon - 45
Infantry A: power weapon, autocannon, vox - 75
Infantry B: power weapon, autocannon - 70
Infantry C: power weapon, autocannon - 70

Infantry D: lascannon - 70
Infantry E: lascannon - 70

Infantry blob B (mainstay force C) - 465pts 56 men
Command squad, 3 melta, vox - 65

Commisar, power weapon - 45
Infantry A: power weapon, autocannon, vox - 75
Infantry B: power weapon, autocannon - 70
Infantry C: power weapon, autocannon - 70

Infantry D: lascannon - 70
Infantry E: lascannon - 70


Infantry blob D (outflanking al'harim) - 525 - 51 men
Command squad: 3 melta, vox Al'Rahem -135

Commisar, power weapon - 45
Infantry A: power weapon, melta, vox - 75
Infantry B: power weapon, melta - 70
Infantry C: power weapon, melta - 70
SWS: 3 melta - 65
SWS: 3 melta - 65

with some points left over, probably another HQ squad

Notes:
No heavy weapon squads because ive found they aren't worth the babysitter, break too easy, and attract all the anti tank fire, with this i have 6 lascannons buried inside 60 wounds worth of guardsmen, in cover, if I took heavy weapon squads i'd make them autocannons and continue to hide lascannons in blobs, there's no army in the game that can do that many wounds to men in cover so I know i'll get at least 20 or so lascannon shots out of these squads a game
Creed is a mainstay, you can have your front lines of men be ordered to go to ground for a 5+ cover or 2+ in cover, making them into blobs of 30 terminators, creed can order them back into action at will with his high leadership, shared leadership, and rerolls for vox He can actually hide in plain sight with the number of guardsmen around him it is hard to draw line of sight
Autocannons are for the initial one or two shooting phases, the first turn whatever moves up will regularly eat about 200 lasgun 18ish autocannon and various special weapon fire, once soft armor targets are all destroyed the autocannons are no longer useful and move up with the blobs
15 meltaguns and 6 plasma is a decent amount of special weapons when supported by all the lascannons

at 2.5k i'd balloon out and get a lord commisar babysitting a huge parking lot of heavy weapon squads and support fire, you really dont need more than the 150 or so guardsmen moving up with a 5+/2+ cover save IMHO.

Have you painted this lot?!?!

Wow thats surely epic. At 2.5k have lord commissar and 4 x3 lascannon heavy weapon teams..
That is surely insane stuff right there.

Might go purge $100 or so on 100 men from the Wargames Factory's "greatcoats" plastic infantry. About $1 each is pretty mad!

I can see the epicness of such a huge army though. 20 power weapons is sick too..

You might consider putting autocannons in your power blobs.

Lots of people run them with no heavy weapons but the AC is cheap and gives you a decent shooting option for those games where your power blobs don't actually want to wind up in melee. Or you'd rather soften the enemy up with a turn or two of shooting before you get into melee. And it's a good all-opponents option even when you're not fighting nids.

Problem with autocannons is i am not in a very mech-heavy gaming group. I find Ac are useless as 90% of the things i shoot have good armour or cover. I'd prefer heavy bolters in all situations or a missile launcher.

kyranzor wrote:Problem with autocannons is i am not in a very mech-heavy gaming group. I find Ac are useless as 90% of the things i shoot have good armour or cover. I'd prefer heavy bolters in all situations or a missile launcher.

Even against non mech armies, I'd rather have 2 S7 shots than 3 S5 ones, ML is good, though BS3 means krak is sort of a let down. And ML cost more.

Target priority. A trygon that gets into CC with you with 1 wound is as dangerous as one with 4! Pick a target and then kill it before moving on to the next target. Shaving wounds of 2-3 MCs is not going to help you at all.

Yeah, i agree that if possible, i should have/would have focused entirely on the trygon, and then the parasite, and then the Prime.

Unfortunately for me, deployment was way off and he.came.at me from a flank where only 33% of my army was, and out of range/LOS from the rest.. Argh

Jamumools wrote:Have you painted this lot?!?!

well, im moving to a new house, but much of it is painted now, not well, but painted.

less - than- current recent pic of apoc deployment.. lol:


Wargamesfactory greatcoats are pretty nice for guardsmen, if you dont mind the detail (or lack thereov) they are a very reasonable alternative, as are mutant chronicles guys.
Not the greatest but passable if you need 200+ guys.

My blob list has Autocannons up the wazoo, with a 2nd course of Meltas in various command squads. Lascannons could definitely help, but they're pricey and not efficient against other targets.

odorofdeath wrote:My blob list has Autocannons up the wazoo, with a 2nd course of Meltas in various command squads. Lascannons could definitely help, but they're pricey and not efficient against other targets.

What is your recourse against an av 13/14 heavy list that doesn't rush you?

What is your recourse against an av 13/14 heavy list that doesn't rush you?

Very little. Honestly, I never won much with my foot lists and I didn't generally enjoy playing with them.

No one I play against uses anything close to AV14, so I didn't need any hardcore armor busting.

odorofdeath wrote:

What is your recourse against an av 13/14 heavy list that doesn't rush you?

Very little. Honestly, I never won much with my foot lists and I didn't generally enjoy playing with them.

No one I play against uses anything close to AV14, so I didn't need any hardcore armor busting.

In all honestly then man you probably shouldn't be giving pointers if you aren't sucessful with, and hate the army in question

Wait for tyhem to get reqasonably close.

"First Rank, FIRE! Second Rank, FIRE. Ranks 3 through 540, FIRE!"


Yous can neva' have too much dakka"- a very smart Big Mek.

Autocannon and Lascannon weapon teams are probably your best bet..

I just think I need to get a bit more plasma happening. I only have 3 plasmaguns, and when i can jam more than 20+ into a list, only 3 is a bit annoying! I have ~15 meltas though lol.