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I am a new player and am trying to understand the measurement rules especially WRT Imperial Guard orders. To begin, here's what the rules say about IG orders:

"To issue an order the officer must declare which order he is attempting to use and select a single friendly non-vehicle unit within his command radius to carry out the order." The unit then takes a leadership test to see if it carries out the order.

Also, the basic rule book on page 3 or so states (in the Measuring Distances section):

In general, players are not allowed to measure any distance except for when the rules call for it (e.g. after declaring an assault or firing at an enemy, to work out a rule's area of effect, when deploying their forces, etc.)

Now it seems to me that the Order rule is an area of effect rule which forces me to find out which units are in the command radius, then select one and order it. In talking to several experience local players, however, they seem to think this is pre-measuring; sort of like in the shooting phase. Is my Area of Effect interpretation correct?

You declare the usage of an order, then you select a target unit. Then you measure range. Out of range, nothing happens and the order is lost, in range you proceed as normal.

juraigamer wrote:You declare the usage of an order, then you select a target unit. Then you measure range. Out of range, nothing happens and the order is lost, in range you proceed as normal.

This is all made up.

First off, there is no rules for what to do if the target is outside the range(no statement of losing the order).

Second of all the rules tell you to target a unit in range; therefore you get to check range before attempting the order(as the target would not be a valid target, therefore not a valid attempt).

You follow the rules in the Codex: Declare the order, Declare the target unit that is in range, take the Ld test, if the Ld test is passed fulfill the order.

The Commanders all have a command radius and the rules for orders require the orders be given to valid units with their command range, therefore you may check the command range as soon as that officer's link in the chain of command comes up.

oloringrayhame wrote:

"To issue an order the officer must declare which order he is attempting to use and select a single friendly non-vehicle unit within his command radius to carry out the order." The unit then takes a leadership test to see if it carries out the order.

Also, the basic rule book on page 3 or so states (in the Measuring Distances section):

In general, players are not allowed to measure any distance except for when the rules call for it (e.g. after declaring an assault or firing at an enemy, to work out a rule's area of effect, when deploying their forces, etc.)

You have it right. You select a unit within the command radius. How do you select a unit from within the command radius without first checking the command radius?

Thanks all for the replies. I've asked this on several 40k forums and it's pretty evenly split between my interpretation and the "treat it like shooting/assaults" camp. Now what I'm looking for is a way to convince the 'shooting' camp that this is an area of effect which must be measured before the unit to be ordered can be selected. Can anyone think of any other area of effect type rules where this is more clear in the actual rules? The 'shooters' are understandable using that as an analogy, but if I can find a closer analogy which is actually correct I hope to avoid arguments and hurt feelings.

Many of the comments here have helped me greatly so far in developing my argument in a constructive sense. I'd just like a little more 'rules ammo' if it's out there. Thanks again to all!!

Olo

Maybe the sanguinary priest and his 6" FNP/FC bubble? There'd have to be odd times that gets measured which could help your argument...maybe...

Kommissar Kel wrote:

juraigamer wrote:You declare the usage of an order, then you select a target unit. Then you measure range. Out of range, nothing happens and the order is lost, in range you proceed as normal.

This is all made up.

Sadly the nothing happens part was the only issue.

The OP answered his own question, you can check range to work out an area of effect, since the rule works off a command radius. He quoted the rules regarding measuring, however the rule for giving orders doesn't expressively give you permission to check range, even though it states in the orders section that you select a single unit in your command range. The rules don't go either way really. However, you shouldn't really be having the issue playing guard, most of your stuff should be close together anyway. Just keep your models close, or stretch a few infantry back towards your commanding units.

Jurai - no, when youve been told you must pick someone within X, that is permission to measure right there.

Same as Lesser Daemons - you get to measure as you must appear within 6"

i was rather split on this issue until i reas what nosferatu wrote about the demons. that convinced me, being a long time chaos player and all. no one has ever questioned being able to measure the six inches before placing, so i think that would be your best bet for persuasion.