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as everyone knows nids are good at taking out tanks at close combat but besides that there are a couple of good ranged units. aginst DE with tank horde, the amount of high strength shots quickly wipes the board of all your quality units, what does anyone suggest for defeating them?

Good luck with that " defeating DE w/ Nids".. DE are the entire reason I sold my Nids, toughness does not mater vs poison 4+ weapons and blasters.

yeah hence why i need to ask, i can pretty much come up with my own way to winagainst most armies but DE are just something else. i did have a 2k list which does over 100 strenght 5 and some 6 shots but im not sure thats great.

... I'd like to see that list.

Well you're in for an uphill battle from the start, and I won't pretend to be an expert on 'nids but I'll give you what little advice I can offer.

Venom cannons aren't going to help you.

They're... really not remotely useful, so if you were planning on taking them, don't.

Hive Guard are nasty. They can do some dirty things, especially with LoS blocking terrain to keep them safe. They're shorter range than the DE weapons... but they're pretty nasty if you can get in firing range.

Adrenal glands on little things. Strength 4 can glance our vehicles, and a stunned result is lethal to a raider or venom. It may not kill it that turn, but next turn your whole horde is going to autohit it, and glance it into oblivion.

Genestealers are nasty, and they give you the benefit of board control if you outflank them. Your DE opponent will wanna avoid the board edges to prevent rending attacks from ripping up his vehicle swarm.

I'd avoid lots of MCs. Take a warrior prime for your HQ, avoid carnifexes. Those termagaunt spawning big guys are good for their psychic powers and for soaking up damage, but they're probably not going to do a whole lot of damage on account of how slow they are.

Sorry if that doesn't help much, DE is pretty unbalanced against 'nids

i sought of guessed but was hoping i was wrong in say that there shouldn't be many MC's.

rigeld 2, the list is
hive tyrant with wings 2 twin-linked devourers with brain-leech worms (12 s6 shots) and hive comand

tervigon onsluaght and toxic sacs (3 s5 shots)

tyranid prime with deathspitter in squad of 6 warriors with death spitters( 18 s5 shots)

6 hive guard (not in one squad) (12 s8 shots)

20 termaguants

3 ravener brood deathspitters (9 shots)

and then the heavy fire power which will last a turn before they die

3 trygon primes (54 shots)

its actualy 99 strenght 5 shots, but i cant find my original list so its different. it also has (not included in the 99) 12 strenght 8 shots so hopefully this would do something but its a faint hope and its not a competative list

Avoiding big bugs, and bringing as much Str 6+ ranged weaponry as you can manage. It's a super tough matchup for Nids, we're too fast and literally everything in our codex is good at killing and countering Nids.

the worst thing is that the most amount of shots comes from things like trygons, carnifexes and hive tyrants

newtoncain wrote:Good luck with that " defeating DE w/ Nids".. DE are the entire reason I sold my Nids, toughness does not mater vs poison 4+ weapons and blasters.

No, a slightly overcosted codex is why you sold your nids. Parking lots, the DE Codex and the GK Codex are just sprinkels on top.

I run two maxed out broods of stealers, two maxed out broods of hive guard, 1 brood of 2 venom with a prime, 2 troop tervigons with catalyst and gants.

Depending on how many points you're playing, I've found this to be a pretty solid core against the de I've seen so far. If you get first turn, fnp those stealers and conga line them in range of the venoms (if adequate cover isn't available). This makes them highly survivable, and gives you a good chance of multi assaulting all those skimmers with loads of rending attacks.

Of course everything is circumstantial, and depends in what your opponent us taking, what the mission and deployment is and who's going first, but hope this gives you some food for thought none the less.

my friend that plays runs about 10 tanks I believe in 1.5 k he had no foot slogging units. He also has wyches and lots of true born. He ends up with about 5 dark lances per tank

Yeah, this is what bugs me about GW, how unbalanced some codexes are. Like DE, against tyranids, its not an auto win, but it sure is pretty damn close. then you look at them VS deathrain suit spam tau, and its a joke. they hide behind their tanks turn 1, and then jump out and wipe out like 4 vehicles a turn. I am certainly not saying the DE are over powered, it just bugs me that they are so unbalanced.

If I know I am playing DE I have found a complete null deploy list works great. I usually take 2 groups of 3 Lictors, those str 6 shots into the back of a venom or ravager are great. Also lots of devilgaunts in pods. I know the Devourer is ap "-" but with the vehicles being open topped. Also if your lucky the pod will wreck the vehicle and the gaunts can blow away the small unit inside. Just think of everything as suicide units.

Niiai wrote:

newtoncain wrote:Good luck with that " defeating DE w/ Nids".. DE are the entire reason I sold my Nids, toughness does not mater vs poison 4+ weapons and blasters.

No, a slightly overcosted codex is why you sold your nids. Parking lots, the DE Codex and the GK Codex are just sprinkels on top.

No I sold them because of DE poison weapons up my arse. I played 20+ gave vs DE and lost most of them. GK didn't help either.

Dark Eldar, Space Wolves, and Grey Knights all have ridiculous advantages against Tyranids. Oddly enough, it seems like the biggest advantages are somewhat negated if Nids go for a staight-up swarm list.

Dark Eldar poison weapons are insane against your T6 MC's...not so much against 50 T3 models.
Grey Knight force weapons are great against your 4W and 6W MC's, but they won't really matter against swarms.
Space Wolves are a little trickier...They can still spam Frag missiles and Murderous Hurricane, but JotWW and krak missiles won't hurt as much.

All of the match-ups are still extremely lopsided but if you bring 100+ models to the table, you'll probably stand a better chance.

newtoncain wrote:

Niiai wrote:

newtoncain wrote:Good luck with that " defeating DE w/ Nids".. DE are the entire reason I sold my Nids, toughness does not mater vs poison 4+ weapons and blasters.

No, a slightly overcosted codex is why you sold your nids. Parking lots, the DE Codex and the GK Codex are just sprinkels on top.

No I sold them because of DE poison weapons up my arse. I played 20+ gave vs DE and lost most of them. GK didn't help either.

Dropping 5 points on the warriors, 20 on the carnifex and mawlock, give the lictor regular infiltrate, lovering tyrant guard to 55, not have venom cannons have -1 on the damadge chart, have shadow in the warp afect wheicles and people in them, moving pyrovores to heavy suport and droping the cost and other minor tweeks would have made you have a chance against DE.

Maybe try a Reserve-style list? I recently managed a close win against my DE buddy with one of those.

My original army was Dark Eldar, my current favorite to play is Nids, so I am informed on this.

Tyranids can beat any army book. When I mainly played DE I always thought Nids were insta win, and you know why? Because most people who play are not bothered to use their head (hence why mech trains are so popular). There is nothing wrong with that, this is a dice game after all, but if you want to pretend to be competitive then you can't just build lists full of things that work or awesome units. Why do you think they are awesome? Because you picture them doing things in your head. You see all the times they rock in great circumstances. You need to remember them at their worst. I always play Vect because even when his ride goes down turn one he is the champ. I play a T-Fex because even when I don't hit a target all game I know he is changing how my opponent is coming toward the game.

This is especially important for Tyranids. I could play with a Trygon, a maxed out squad of Hive Guard, and the Swarmlord but it would suck. They rock in the right circumstances, but if you don't have those right moments things will fall apart. Instead create synergy. DE may be able to rip you apart with 4+ psn venom spam, but you know what? Tyranids have THE BEST target priority screwing ability in the game. Mix that with the great synergy abilities and all of a sudden your entire army has cover, feel no pain, or is something they would rather not be shooting right now. Gargoyles are a great example of this. For 60 points you give them something they have to take care of or else deal with cover on your MC. Give them FNP and now they have some tough choices to make.

It is like what your coach said in high school, you are only as good as the worst member of the team.

Later today I am playing Nids against DE, and guess what, I'm going to win.




Edit-Fixing the gargoyle example.

L'Etat C'Est Moi wrote:Example, for 30 points you can get rippers to put in front of your gargoyle/termagant screen. No that rank has a 4+ save.

False. Swarms don't provide cover.

Seriously, the only way I have found to beat DE with Nids is Stealer spam and Venoms Spoded. You wouldn't belive how conforting it is to know that those wyches need Frag Grenades to strike at the same time as Stealers, or before those venom thropes. Take Parasite, for those outflanking units, and stick him with a bunch of Shrikes for protection. Put a Prime with Warriors for a synapse base. Mawlocs in HS.

Niiai wrote:

newtoncain wrote:Good luck with that " defeating DE w/ Nids".. DE are the entire reason I sold my Nids, toughness does not mater vs poison 4+ weapons and blasters.

No, a slightly overcosted codex is why you sold your nids. Parking lots, the DE Codex and the GK Codex are just sprinkels on top.

It's not like it's the last Codex the Nids will ever get. I haven't been using mine much, but you can always wait until a new Dex comes. Or just use my fandex.