Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Good question.

>>Zerlina Maxwell at Feministing comments on a distressing story from NPR
>>Zerlina Maxwell at Feministing
>>Feministing

Stopped reading after that point. That and I really don't care too much about celebrities thumping each other.

The title says they blame her but the article seemed to say they felt she was complicit in the incident, not solely to blame. It is an interesting article becuase I have heard other women say something similar, but never a man. They don't 'blame' her anymore then him, but, as I understood it, that she was essentially the Joker in the street telling him to hit her, and when he did we ended up where we are. I heard it from two different women from very different backgrounds so I am not sure what to make of it. One I got the impression just felt that the entire nature of the relationship needed to be looked at not just straight to hating the male, whereas the other may have just not wanted to think CB was such a bad guy. I don't think anyone excused his actions as much felt that she was exonerated to quickly from the situation. The idea that only a man can be abusive in a relationship is a bit outdated, but I don't think we have enough information to really make any more of call then was made i.e. him being arrested for assault.

On a related note, once Hitler started rapping, people started to realize that maybe he wasn't such a bad guy afterall.

Necroshea wrote:>>Zerlina Maxwell at Feministing comments on a distressing story from NPR
>>Zerlina Maxwell at Feministing
>>Feministing

Stopped reading after that point. That and I really don't care too much about celebrities thumping each other.

Ditto.

Wish I was popular.

FWIW, I agree with the article in that it's possible to divorce an artist's work from his personal life or personality. For example, my favourite musician, John Lennon, occasionally beat both his wives up (allegedly), and was generally quite unpleasant towards women. He also happened to be the greatest pop songwriter ever. At the end of the day, I'm buying his records, not sharing an apartment with him.

What about Pete Townshend? He was found with child porn on his computer. If he was convicted, would that have suddenly made the Who a terrible band?

It's all a moot point, mind you. Chris Brown's music is fething awful.

Look at the dancing monkeys! Shiny thing make it all better! Consume and discuss the lives of the banal pointless people you will never meet; who don't know you exist and wouldn't care even if they did.

This is like discussing the lives of the check out staff in a convenience store in a different country.

Who are these people you speak of?

I got rid of my TV 2 years ago because it was full of this crap.

Sonophos wrote:Look at the dancing monkeys!

Says the dancing monkey.

Sonophos wrote:Shiny thing make it all better! Consume and discuss the lives of the banal pointless people you will never meet; who don't know you exist and wouldn't care even if they did.

Says the dancing monkey who plays Warhammer and/or other hobby games.

Sonophos wrote:This is like discussing the lives of the check out staff in a convenience store in a different country.

Actually it is not like that at all.

Sonophos wrote:I got rid of my TV 2 years ago because it was full of this crap.

Sure you did. I completely believe you that haven't seen a television show of any kind in two years. Of course, since this is a discussion about domestic abuse and attitudes toward it involving musicians from an article posted on the internet and not a TV show, it doesn't really matter that you pretend not to have anything to do with television.

I read the first few sentences, and then read the title of the article.

I truly believe this a facepalm is the only correct response...

I understand that it is possible to distance an artist from his work and personal life, but unlike your example Albatross, Chris Brown didn't allegedly beat up Rihanna, he did beat up Rihanna. There is a big difference between being accused of an action and being proven of having taken that action (though in today's world, many people forget that).

The title is what I thought was the worst part of this story. "Why Do So Many Teens Still Blame Rihanna for Chris Brown's Violence?" Seriously? Why do they blame her? What was the sandwich not on time? Did she make more in album sales than he did?

The dude beat her, blame him not her.

@Ahtman

I have two points:

1. Domestic abuse is bad. It doesn't matter who it is. Why does it take the actions of a celbrity for you to discuss it?
2. I can't dance.

Sonophos wrote:@Ahtman

I have two points:

1. Domestic abuse is bad. It doesn't matter who it is. Why does it take the actions of a celbrity for you to discuss it?

That is a nice strawman you have under construction. You using union labor or scabs?

Sonophos wrote:2. I can't dance.

You are in the UK so I already knew that.

@Ahtman "That is a nice strawman you have under construction. You using union labor or scabs?"

What do you mean by "strawman"?

The context difference between the two pints perplexes me and I honestly don't understand what unions have to do with this?

on point two you have a point there are very few british guys noted for thier dancing.

My point would be that domestic abuse takes place everyday on men, women and children alike. Some performer (I still don't know who he is) commits an act of violence and it spurs people to discuss it.

In the last two years I have watched/had inflicted upon me about 8 hours of TV. This was whilst taking my kids to see my Dad. I honestly just read either for myself or to my kids when I am at home. I like P&M as a passtime as I don't have the space to build a submarine or giant robot.

I would like to bang Rihanna. But in a different kind of way.

Mrs Kilkrazy would be unimpressed, though. Plates would fly, I fear.

Sonophos wrote:@Ahtman "That is a nice strawman you have under construction. You using union labor or scabs?"

What do you mean by "strawman"?

A strawman is when you argue against a point no one made by misrepresenting the opponents argument. No one said that domestic abuse was good nor did any state they would only talk about it if celebrities were involved. The issue was your wrongheadedness in trying to claim some moral superiority over others becuase they had heard some off hand gossip or used a story to jump start a conversation about a social ills (which btw would make every Star Trek fan, writer, or producer one of those terrible people) makes them somehow inferior and going so far as to even remove their status of human by referring to them as another species. Not knowing that Russel Brand and Katy Perry are getting divorced doesn't make one superior to other people. And here is the rub, you now know that Russel Brand and Katy Perry are getting divorced, and found out in a similar way that I did and many others did, so I suppose that means you are no longer a human either and a dancing monkey, and you didn't even need a tv to find out.

There are women who like to try to provoke their boyfriends to see how far they can push them, and then talk smack to their female friends about how they've got him whipped, their is indeed a non-violent solution to the problem. Ignore the bitch. In public. In front of her friends, your friends and the media if applicable. Remember, living well is the best revenge.

@Ahtman You have a point. I do get on my high horse a bit but then again I just love a civil argument. I get a bit upset about this type of thing because my company has had to close a refuge recently and I really liked the manager there.

It gets my goat that people spend more time discussing the crap in Heat magazine and the X Factor than actually making a difference.

I know who Russell Brand is and I think that Katy Perry was a rather pretty girl from your side of the atlantic.

Last I checked I'm an ape not a monkey so I apologise on the morphological mistake.

If my opinion of Chris Brown and his fans could get any lower, this story would have done it.

Protip: If you're dating someone who you routinely want to hit, I suggest you break up with them. Also, seek immediate professional help.

If you actually think that it's okay for someone to beat up their chick to the point where she is hospitalized due to her being "mouthy and obstinate" please, and I'm being dead serious, kill yourself.

Sonophos wrote:I just love a civil argument

Then you probably shouldn't refer to other human beings as dancing monkeys. I agree that people get caught up in useless sensation from time to time, but having that attitude doesn't so anything to change it.

@warpcrafter I had a GF like this a few years back she tried everything to get me to beat her. In the end I paid the deposit on a flat for her pick up all her stuff and put her in it.

She then pushed me down a flight of stairs and told all my freinds I had beaten her anyway.

Monster Rain wrote:If my opinion of Chris Brown and his fans could get any lower, this story would have done it.

I don't think it stated everyone was a CB fan.

Monster Rain wrote:Protip: If you're dating someone who you routinely want to hit, I suggest you break up with them. Also, seek immediate professional help.

Agreed.

Monster Rain wrote:If you actually think that it's okay for someone to beat up their chick to the point where she is hospitalized due to her being "mouthy and obstinate" please, and I'm being dead serious, kill yourself.

Nowhere in the article or in the discussion did anyone say he didn't deserve to be arrested or say it was ok to hit another person.

Sonophos wrote:@warpcrafter I had a GF like this a few years back she tried everything to get me to beat her. In the end I paid the deposit on a flat for her pick up all her stuff and put her in it.

She then pushed me down a flight of stairs and told all my freinds I had beaten her anyway.

Can you sing?

Ahtman wrote:

Monster Rain wrote:If my opinion of Chris Brown and his fans could get any lower, this story would have done it.

I don't think it stated everyone was a CB fan.

Whether or not everyone was isn't really relevant to what I said, is it? Anyway, the story was about people interviewed outside of a Chris Brown concert, so saying that they might be fans isn't much of of a leap.

OP's Article wrote:...comments on a distressing story from NPR about how Chris Brown's fans have reconciled their fandom with the fact that he seriously beat up his then-girlfriend Rihanna two years ago: by blaming Rihanna.

Ahtman wrote:Nowhere in the article or in the discussion did anyone say he didn't deserve to be arrested or say it was ok to hit another person.

Jesus Christ, dude. They did say that Rhianna somehow deserved what happened to her.

@Albatross Only if you want to bring about the Zombie apocolypse.

I got lucky after her, I got together with the best woman ever who has given me two wonderful, bright and energetic children. So it all worked out for the best in the end.

Popularity cures all ills? What about the sickness that is celebrity culture?

Celebrity culture is the truest expression of democracy we currently possess. Discuss.

Or can you at least sing through an electronic filter?

Ahtman wrote:

Sonophos wrote:I just love a civil argument

Then you probably shouldn't refer to other human beings as dancing monkeys. I agree that people get caught up in useless sensation from time to time, but having that attitude doesn't so anything to change it.

The "dancing monkeys" is a metaphor not a direct referrence. It refers more to the fact that the culture of celebrity lowers the performer to the level of "dancing monkey" in the mind of the public.
The observer becomes divorced from the actual personality of the person performing and their entire life becomes spectacle.

Without the human contact actually required to make the celebrity a person in the mind of the observer they become fodder for a wheel of gossip and misrepresentation.

They become a distraction from people's real lives and an example of misplaced aspiration. By discussing issues based on their lives we demean ourselves and them.

At least when we indulge in office gossip we know the people personally.

Monster Rain wrote:Jesus Christ, dude. They did say that Rhianna somehow deserved what happened to her.

I'm sorry, the title of the article did say that, so I guess the author of the piece can be attributed to blaming her. The actual research piece the article referred to said "Obviously she played a part in getting beat, or whatever,", which is not the same as saying she deserved it. There is a difference between "everyone played a part in x incident" and "person y deserved to be beaten for x incident". The author inserted their take on the research. Essentially we are arguing the title of the article and not the content of it.

The article isn't even about whether domestic abuse is good or not, but on the phenomenon of why teenage girls would even give that kind of leeway in the first place instead of putting the entire blame on CB.

Ahtman wrote:

Monster Rain wrote:Jesus Christ, dude. They did say that Rhianna somehow deserved what happened to her.

I'm sorry, the title of the article did say that, so I guess the author of the piece can be attributed to blaming her. The actual research piece the article referred to said "Obviously she played a part in getting beat, or whatever,", which is not the same as saying she deserved it.

In reading the NPR article, what really stood out was that "Close to 50 percent of the young people we surveyed thought that Rihanna was actually responsible for the incident..." which is where my original sentiment came from.

Unless she came after him with a hammer or something I think it's frankly sick and pathetic to blame... ahem... the victim in such severe domestic violence cases. This was pretty extreme, dude. We aren't talking about a smack or two, which is also inexcusable mind, but he seriously beat the gak out her.