Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

For all you 40k players out there, you'll know what I'm talking about, but otherwise...

Should we introduce a rule to fantasy that means Tx2=S=instant kill?

And a rule that makes it immune to that rule.

E.G

S10 Cannon hits T5 Monster with 3 wounds.

2x5=10 so the toughness is half the Strength.

The moster is removed as a casualty.

BUT... A s8 spell hits Malekith, but he has the Invincible (yet to think of a better name), so he loses only one wound.

Kapiche?

Cannons would suddenly get even *better* against monsters and Ogres, and they're already fantastic against such. Really, this is giving a boost to something that doesn't *need* a boost.

I could not disagree more due to a couple of things.
1. It only affects multiple wound models like monsters that cannons munch on already.
2. Fantasy needs their characters alot more than 40k does, so instant death would really hurt your battle plan if someone slapped 1 S6 hit on your T3 general and just crumped him

Yeah, unfortunately they didn't set it up like that. Some stuff just has a zillion strength and it's okay to give it a zillion strength because it still has to roll to wound. It's just an easy way of saying armor doesn't help and it nearly always wounds.

But stuff like horde armies would get really weakened. Even poor Elf armies would suddenly see their elite infantry not so elite. The difference between T3 and T4 would become massive. Cuz there's a lot of stuff with S6 but not much with 8+.

Good Point. Maybe 3x?

No. Fantasy does not need nonsense like this. There's already enough one-hit kills out there in the new lores of magic.

Fantasy and 40k are so far different in games that an ID mechanic simply can't be lifted from one and dumped with almost no change into the other without crippling the game.

At X3, you're only talking about T1, 2, and 3 models, so it's a limited

It's an interesting idea, but the game is pretty balanced in this regard already.

Instant Death works in 40K because there's a whole lot more weapons with outrageously powerful weapons. Look back to 2nd ed and you had weapons doing 2D6 wounds, or weapon with sustained fire that also inflicted multiple wounds per hit. You ended up with a weird problem where late in 2nd ed they put Carnifex into the game with very high toughness and 10 wounds and assumed it'd shrug off heavy weapons fire and be the terror of everyone out there. They turned out to be very easy pickings though, because it was pretty common to have weapons capable of dealing massive numbers of wounds. It became impossible to represent a monster capable of surviving loads of hits from really powerful guns without giving it a wounds score that went past the characteristic limit of 10 (which'd be kind of silly). In short, something had to be done to reconcile the number of really powerful guns with the survivability of really big monsters, and in 40K that thing was removing wounds from guns and replacing it with Instant Death.

But WHFB doesn't have that problem. The amount of weapons that inflict multi-wounds are very rare, pretty much exclusive to war machines and characters, and the monsters and characters with multiple wounds only have a moderate amount, enough that basic attacks can still whittle them away.

DukeRustfield wrote:Yeah, unfortunately they didn't set it up like that. Some stuff just has a zillion strength and it's okay to give it a zillion strength because it still has to roll to wound. It's just an easy way of saying armor doesn't help and it nearly always wounds.

If it's like the 40K rule then you wouldn't auto wound, you'd still have to make a 2+ roll there, and beat any armour save and ward save. It's just that the characters wound total wouldn't matter, all saves were failed the target would just die from that one attack.

Wait, cannons aren't instant death enough for you?

NO!

if you're cannon isn't strong enough then get more cannons. if you introduce Instant Death then characters will get more abilities than to prevent Instant Death, they'll get things that help against the basic infantry as well.

do you even use cannons?

and if you make it 3x then only the elves will suffer because everything else with 2 wounds is at least T4.

Get your 40k out of my Fantasy plzthnx.

It's my fantasy too vampirate.Let me know how many points of fantasy you have HA HA! 2 Armies? You think that's good. EAT 12500 points of Dark Elves, 4000 points of HE, Beastmen and WoC!

I still don't see a reason for instant death based on strength. We have it in multi wound form and KB form. If anything, we're seeing it disappear slowly from heroes. I miss my tyrant being able to do d3 wounds. BRING BACK THE TENDERIZER!

All right. Get your 40K out of your Fantasy, then. It's unseemly and inappropriate. I think Dakka's made itself clear on this, unless you want to offer up something else to sway us?

DreadlordME! wrote:It's my fantasy too vampirate.Let me know how many points of fantasy you have HA HA! 2 Armies? You think that's good. EAT 12500 points of Dark Elves, 4000 points of HE, Beastmen and WoC!

This is entirely irrelevant.

Did you read or consider any of the responses given in this thread?

DreadlordME! wrote:It's my fantasy too vampirate.Let me know how many points of fantasy you have HA HA! 2 Armies? You think that's good. EAT 12500 points of Dark Elves, 4000 points of HE, Beastmen and WoC!

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FanDumb
See "King Customer". Funneling loads of money into GW's gaping maw gives you no more right to it than I have.

Hey, I rarely but from GW! Now let us stop tis silly argument before this becomes a Flame WAR! (which I would win)!

My black guard (LD9) would love to get some super instant death effect for just being the target of a mindrazor.
Wounding on 2+ with a -7 to armor save isn't good enough, I want to Instant Death ogres too!

-Matt

I think we can put this one to bed then eh ?