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After taking a few years out from gaming I'm back and wanted to collect an Imperial Guard army, which I've never previously tried. Going to start off with a nice sized 1000pt army list and then expand from that. Anyway let me know what you think, I based this on the idea of an Inquisitorial task force, maybe on a mission to exterminate a band of xenos scum Made up a new regiment for this with it's own back story which I might post later.

HQ
CCS -
Company Commander with power weapon and plasma pistol.
4 Vets equipped with 1 vox caster, 3lasguns and 1 plasma gun.
Entire squad equipped with carapace armour
110pts

TROOPS
1st Platoon

PCS -
Platoon Commander with laspistol and power fist.
4 guardsmen equipped with 1 vox caster, 1 flamer and 3 lasguns
55pts

Infantry squad 1 -
1 sergeant with bolt pistol.
9 guardsmen equipped with 1 vox caster, 1 grenade launcher, 1 autocannon and 6 lasguns
72pts

Infantry squad 2 -
1 sergeant with bolt pistol.
9 guardsmen equipped with 1 vox caster, 1 grenade launcher, 1 autocannon and 6 lasguns
72pts

Veterans squad -
1 Veteran Sergeant with power weapon.
9 Veterans armed with vox caster, 3 meltaguns and 6 lasguns.
Entire squad has carapace armour and Chimera transport with dozer blade and pintle-mounted storm bolter
220pts

Fast Attack -
Scout sentinel with autocannon, searchlight and hunter-killer missile
51pts

Heavy Support -
Leman Russ Battle Tank with hull mounted heavy bolter, sponson mounted heavy bolters, dozer blade and camo netting
Leman Russ Vanquisher with hull mounted lascannon, Knight Commander Pask and camo netting
420pts

Total - 1000pts

I realise that this army might be a little lacking in infantry, but I wanted to keep the idea of a small force of soldiers with armour support on a quick "search and destroy" type mission.
Also I know there isn't much love for the LR Vanquisher, but I really like the whole idea of a specialist "tank hunter".
Anyway any pointers would be greatly appreciated before I go out and buy my final force.

Cheers

you should replace falmers and grenade launchers with plasma/melta and autocannons with missile launchers.

You've got a lot of upgrades that are hard to justify at such low points.

CCS
-Carapace armour is rarely worth it. Your squad has no transport, so if you want them to live you have to plant them in cover. Therefore, camo cloaks is a much better buy.
-The one plasma gun isn't doing any good, if you're going for a stationary CCS anyway I would take a lascannon here. You can get it quite accurate with Bring it Down if you've got a spare order.
-Power weapons and plasma pistols are generally a waste of points. Leave power weapons to power blobs and plasma pistols to dedicated plasma squads.

Platoon
-Power fists are awful in a PCS. Because the unit is only 5 men, they are nearly always going to die before the fist gets to swing at i3. If you really want a guy with a power fist, I suggest putting it on either a veteran sergeant or your CO (if you've got a bodyguard)
-Bolt pistols? Really? I guess you had 4pts over from the searchlight, but I would still not take them because you'll have to remodel the sarges when you make a new list.
-Infantry platoons on foot and not in combined squads isn't really a top strategy. Should work alright in small games, but never did for me...

Veterans
-Carapace is a lot of points. Usually there's something better to spend it on.
-Dozer is a valid investment depending on how much terrain you play with. Usually I would say it's not worth it, and the storm bolter definitely isn't.

Sentinel
-Scout sentinels are awesome to use at low points because they cost almost nothing and can do a LOT. A bit of personal advice would be to exercise caution and restraint when gluing this one because nearly every setup works and you're going to want to experiment.

LRBT
-With 14/13/10 you'll be using this tank to screen the rest of your army, not the other way around (especially since you haven't enough hulls to cover it), therefore I would drop camo netting.
-Again the dozer is down to local terrain customs but probably drop it.
-I don't advocate sponsons on russes. Personally I would take this russ at 165pts with nothing but a hull lascannon, gives it some punch against rhinos and such.

LRVQ
-I wouldn't take pask or camo netting at just 1000pts. It's just 16% to hit with pask and usually you're using russes AS cover. Plus it can actually be hard to get them a cover save without some chimeras or more sentinels

POINTS
-PWx2
-PFx1
-PPx1
-PGx1
-BPx2
-SBx1
-carapace (CCS)
-grenadiers
-dozer x2
-camo nets x2
-pask
+camo cloaks (CCS)
+lascannon (CCS)
+lascannon (Russ)

Saves you around 200pts, unless my math is off, without really losing anything. I would use the points on sentinels or chimeras.

Thanks for your replies.

Ok Almarine I've taken your advice and made the necessary changes. Still to decide what to spend my other points on though.

Just a few questions as well:

What is your take on separate Heavy Weapons squads? I've read some very different views on this, some saying that they are very useful and others saying that heavy weapons are far more useful in regular infantry squads along with another special weapon.

Also, I've been reading a lot about PCS being quite handy in CC and that you should take them with 4 special weapons, usually flamers.

Thoughts?

Cheers

I have 2 PCS's in my list and run one with 4X flamers, usually in a vendetta, unless against hordes, then on foot. And the other with 4X meltas. Both are good options, just mkae sure that if you go the melta route that you mount them up so they can move and take our enemy armor. If the 4X flamer, remember you have very limited range and assaulting is not a great idea with them.

I would go a little further, and say drop the vanquisher for another LR. The vanquisher is ok, but you have a 50-50 chance of hitting, and thats not good enought o warrant a single shot tank imo.

HWS are good if you have guardsmen on foot charging forward. The HWS acts as covering fire trying to soften up enemies before being hit with your blob squad.

I would also drop voxs, unless you have bad luck with rolls. Blob your infantry squads and give them a commissar so they dont run. Keep them simple, PW, MB, MG's.

Use more penal legion, they are hilarious.

Warbear wrote:What is your take on separate Heavy Weapons squads? I've read some very different views on this, some saying that they are very useful and others saying that heavy weapons are far more useful in regular infantry squads along with another special weapon.

Also, I've been reading a lot about PCS being quite handy in CC and that you should take them with 4 special weapons, usually flamers.

Almarine gave you solid advice.

HWS are ok, but not played as often as they might be because IG vehicles are so good.
Compare a HWS with 3 lascannos to a Vendetta
Compare a HWS with 3 autocannons to a Hydra
etc.

HWS are not bad, it's just that they are fragile and not the best.

People tend to put flamers on the PCS because they are BS3. As a flamer delivery system, PCSs are great. 4 flamers for 50 points? You also have the option of throwing them in a chimera or vendetta.

Ok so with some tweaks here's what I have:

HQ
CCS -
Company Commander
4 Vets equipped with 2 lasguns and 1 lascannon
Entire squad fitted with camo cloaks
140pts

TROOPS
1st Platoon

PCS -
Platoon Commander
4 guardsmen equipped with 4 flamers
50pts

Infantry squad 1 -
1 sergeant
9 guardsmen equipped with 1 grenade launcher,
1 autocannon and 6 lasguns
65pts

Infantry squad 2 -
1 sergeant
9 guardsmen equipped with 1 grenade launcher,
1 autocannon and 6 lasguns
65pts

Veterans squad -
1 Veteran Sergeant
9 Veterans armed with 3 meltaguns and 6 lasguns.
Squad mounted in Chimera transport
155pts

Fast Attack -
Scout sentinel with autocannon, searchlight and hunter-killer missile
51pts

Heavy Support -
Leman Russ Battle Tank with hull mounted lascannon
165pts

Total 691pts

Means I've got a stationary CCS that issues orders and will be hard to shoot at. A counter charge PCS that can roast any unit that has killed one of my infantry squads in CC. Infantry squads that can set up a decent gun line. A squad of vets that can zoom towards the scariest looking tank and unleash their meltagun goodness. A sentinel for flanking and general harassment tactics. And a tank.

So what to spend my remaining 309pts on? Would I be best served by getting some more infantry or what about an ordnance battery or valkyrie?

Thanks for the helps folks

I'd still suggest dropping the scout sentinel from personal experience. I've found that the fact they can be killed by most basic troop weapons makes them a pointsink with little chance of return. I would also suggest throwing power weapons and meltabombs on the sergeants of the infantry squads, as well as adding a power weapon commissar to one of them. This way, you have a 21 strong unit that will pass its orders and isn't a pushover in combat. I also wouldn't suggest the hull lascannon on the russ, as the 3 HB shots at strength 5 are better than 1 strength 9 shot when its shooting at BS3. Besides, the russ is supposed to target infantry anyways. With the remaining points, I would suggest adding a vendetta to improve ranged anti-tank, which at this point is pretty scarce. After that, I might add another vet squad with either melta or plasma and a chimera to have a punch with the mech elements. With these suggestions, the final list could look something like this.

HQ
CCS - lascannon, camo cloaks
(140)

Troops
1st Platoon
PCS - 4xflamers
(50)
IS - grenade launcher, autocannon, sergeant w. power weapon, meltabombs, commissar w. power weapon
(125)
IS - grenade launcher, autocannon, sergeant w. power weapon, meltabombs
(80)
Veteran Squad - 3xmeltaguns, chimera w. ML/HF
(155)
Veteran Squad - 3xplasma, chimera w. ML/HF
(170)

Fast Attack
Vendetta
(130)

Heavy Support
Leman Russ
(150)

Total 1000pts

Orkboys list looks good, something to consider tho is what is the CCS doing? I fyou want them to sit and shoot, then thats a perfect setup. If you want them advancing with the IS's then maybe drop the LC and camo cloaks and given them melta or plasma guns.

Also consider putting the PCS int he vendetta unless they are going to be needed quickly than you thought, then they should walk.

But overall those are some great suggestions

Warbear wrote:
HQ
CCS -
Company Commander
4 Vets equipped with 2 lasguns and 1 lascannon
Entire squad fitted with camo cloaks
140pts

Your math is off here. Double check, then have fun with the extra points. Maybe trim some options and add a 3rd IS

Warbear wrote:What is your take on separate Heavy Weapons squads? I've read some very different views on this, some saying that they are very useful and others saying that heavy weapons are far more useful in regular infantry squads along with another special weapon.

Well, heavy weapons are a lot cheaper purely look at points in regular infantry squads, but if it's the weapons and not the squads that you're after then you're better off with HWS. 3ML costs you a minimum of 180pts on infantry squads, or 90pts in a HWS. It's a tradeoff like everything else, as you're not sacrificing the movement of 30 guys, but your firepower is a lot more vulnerable, decreasing by 33% every other wound and at ld7 too. Probably my favourite HWS is actually mortars, being dirt cheap scoring units that can hide behind a wall and still be sort of useful. Their pinning is about as reliable in an infantry squad though.

Warbear wrote:Also, I've been reading a lot about PCS being quite handy in CC and that you should take them with 4 special weapons, usually flamers.
Thoughts?

Yeah pretty much everyone does this, but it works better in a chimera. You can still hide them behind other squads and roast them after combat, but usually they will get a consolidate move and spread out to 2" coherency, plus it's easy to whittle the squad down even with a 4+ or even 3+ cover save. If I were going on foot I might rather take GLs or just nothing and basically enjoy the free order. I like a vox in a PCS so it can reroll its own order in a pinch.

orkboy232 wrote:I also wouldn't suggest the hull lascannon on the russ, as the 3 HB shots at strength 5 are better than 1 strength 9 shot when its shooting at BS3. Besides, the russ is supposed to target infantry anyways.

Well, not really. The large blast isn't very impressive against properly spaced infantry and it doesn't ignore cover. And we all know how good a single HB is at anti-infantry. Battlecannon+Lascannon isn't anything to sneeze at when you're a rhino or chimera and the HB doesn't help much against the one type of infantry a LRBT likes to shoot, which is unhorsed marine squads.

orkboy232 wrote:I'd still suggest dropping the scout sentinel from personal experience. I've found that the fact they can be killed by most basic troop weapons makes them a pointsink with little chance of return. ............

If you are putting them in the way of such things then you deserve to loose them.

AC Sents should be outflanking for side or rear shots on the odd vehicles you will find at 1000pts. They should also be taking as much advantage of their special cover rules as possible. I alway have 2 without HK missiles which are too steep at 10pts.

Brewing up thoese single Vindicators and dreadnoghts that you so often pay against with a "pansy" Sentinel is great fun. You can also threaten back field HQ/Support choices and objectives. Well worth 40pts.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That said, cock on the block and all that; here's my prefered 1000 point list.

HQ – CCS, Lascannon, 2x Plasmagun and a Master of the Ordnance.

Troop 1 – PCS, 4x Meltagun in a Chimera.
PIS, Power weapon, Commissar with power weapon,Autocannon,meltagun.
PIS, Power weapon,Autocannon, meltagun.

Troop 2 – PCS, 4x Flamer.
PIS, Power weapon, Commissar with power weapon, meltagun.
PIS, Power weapon, meltagun.

Fast Attack 1 – Scout Sentinal with Autocannon

Fast Attack 2 – Scout Sentinal with Autocannon

Heavy Support 1 – Leman Russ, hull Heavy Bolter.

Heavy Support 2 – Griffon, hull Heavy Bolter.

It's kind of hard to avoid putting scout sentinels in such a way that they can avoid pretty much everything That said, I can see how they can be effective if used properly.

Ok folks thanx for all the replies and help. I've decided to set up a small tournament with a few of my mates (tau, space marines and tyranid players respectively) and we're running 500pt lists. So I've stripped my list down and here's what I've got:

HQ

CCS - 2 plasma guns, 1 lascannon
100pts

Troops

PCS - powerfist, 4 flamers
65pts

Infantry Squad 1 - grenade launcher, autocannon
65pts

Infantry Squad 2 - grenade launcher, autocannon
65pts

Veteran Squad - 3 meltaguns in Chimera
155pts

Scout Sentinel - autocannon, searchlight and hunter-killer missile

501pts

Drop your searchlight and double everything you've got there and you have a 1000 point force. lol

haha I like that, just double it. kinda want some tanks though for my 1000pt force. This 500pt list will get me started then

Don't expect the infantry squads to last very long in the 500 point list. Most of the time if anything sneezes in their direction they get scared and run off. Either that or maybe my dice just hate me....

As cool as the Power Fist looks on the guy, it is Str 6 at Init 1 on a 5 man squad. The only real use for a close combat PCS (or CCS for that matter) is to counter-charge into a fight that is already going on, as by itself it will be destroyed. If that situation isn't going on, you have to ask yourself if the points could have been better spent elsewhere.

Use those special weapon slots and don't leave them empty... Flamers or Melta guns on BS 3 and Melta or Plasma guns on BS 4. Do not waste special weapon slots, as that is one of the main advantages of IG. It is to make up for the fact IG have lasguns as their basic weapon.

If you haven't noticed... blob, blob, blob. There is a reason why /everyone/ is suggesting this. Is it the only route? No. If you do it, properly kit out your blob with a Commissar, power weapons, melta guns, and melta bombs.

In fact, I am half suprised no one suggested getting 4 Chimeras and mounting the PCS, PISs and the CCS in them to make you a 'cheaper' version of Mech Guard. Melta guns are your friend in a list like that.

Heavy weapon squads can be fantastic, as they are scoring, cheap, and produce alot of long range firepower. If you do HWSs, you have to set yourself up for success in using them. Just like the mini-debate on the Scout Sentinel above, if the weapon is not used right it will work out poorly for you.

First off, HWSs /have/ to be in cover. Second, you want to help them Ld-wise for Orders and for Morale. The options for this are the following...

Regimental Banner - Gives you a Ld re-roll for morale and pinning tests. Unit needs at least one member within 12" of banner.

Kell - He counts as a Regimental Standard, but he allows the CCS to use the Commander's Ld for Orders instead of the Unit. Very expensive and best used with Creed.

Lord Commissar - This is the best option, in my opinion. You use his 'Aura of Discipline' and camp him naked or with a camo cloak in cover. All units within 6" are now Ld 10 for Morale, Orders, and pinning checks. If you wish to risk it (execution rule), he can join a HWS and make it Stubborn and if he has the Camo Cloak, give them a 3+ cover save. This is a good option if you have 3+ HWSs.

Worse comes to worse... you want the Lord with LC HWSs, as the multiple shots a AC HWS can get by without Orders.

As for the debate of HWSs vs Vehicles, the answer is Orders. If your CCS is attacking (Mech or Straken), then Vehicles are the best choice. If your CCS is sitting back due to a HWS or a MoO, then HWSs are probably going to be the better choice, because Orders makes them as good or better than their vehicle counterpart.

For my part on the Scout Sentinal debate... I do not want a vehicle that can be taken down by a Bolter. That 40+ pts can be 4 melta guns or a Commissar for your PISs or even go towards a HWS or a Chimera.

Good luck.

Just played my first game with my 500pts list against Tau player and I must say they performed very well!

CCS - PP, 2xPlasmaguns, Lascannon

PCS - PW, 4xflamers

IS - GL, Autocannon

IS - GL, Autocannon

Vets - 2xMeltaguns, GL in Chimera with multi-laser and heavy bolter, hunter - killer missile

Scout Sentinel - Autocannon

500pts


Tau player had:

Tau Commander Shas'o in battlesuit with 2 gun drones

2 units of 6 fire warriors, 2 gun drones each (1 embarked in devilfish)

3 stealth suits with 1 shield drone


Was an Annihilation game with Pitched Battle deployment.

Got CCS into some 4+ cover right away, held back infantry squads to give fire from autocannons, my chimera with vets raced off and destroyed his devilfish and my Scout sentinel did an excellent job harrying his stealth suits then assaulting them and keepin them locked in combat, making them unable to use their fusion blaster against my chimera. My PCS with flamers were then able to assault the stealth team from behind and wipe them out. I was more than happy to keep my squads back, giving them range superiority with my autocannons and pick off his fire warriors, he never moved them at all! Only problem I had was his commander using his jetpack to come out from cover, fire on CCS then assault move back away from line of sight from any of my guys, but TBH he was very unlucky with his rolls and I was able to utilize Incoming! order to really limit casualties.

End of game stats:

Kill points - IG = 345
TAU = 55

All in all it was an enjoyable first outing, maybe a little stale, don't think we both did everything tactically that we could have done. Can't wait to increase points to 750 and get me a leman russ.

Thanks for all help guys, cheers