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Had a wierd experience in my store today, although I'm certain I'm not the first to have this happen to them sadly. Skip to the conveniently placed TL;DR if you don't feel like reading a little story.

Walked in to grab the ork codex and look at ork prices (which are all over the place, but sadly, remind me of starting my IG army, I.E. heartbreaking) and was flipping through the codex at a table with the store owner and a guy I had never met before, but was apparently a regular. I was checking out the artwork, and made a comment about how the artwork was a lot more interesting than the IG codex .

The regular, who had been completely cool and chill up till then, seemed to do a 180 in regards to his mood. I don't know if he had a really nasty game against IG or if he just played against a jerk, but he went on a hate spiral about it for a good 5 minutes. It didn't help that I had identified myself as an IG player, and even though he wasn't leveling criticism directly at me, I could tell he wanted to. From the way he talked, he plays some sort of CC heavy army, because the majority of his anger seemed to stem from "they don't counter my army, they counter everything. You can't get close to them, you can't kill them, ever." He even went on to say he will never play against the army ever, even in tournaments, preferring the automatic loss instead.

I literally didn't know what to say. I just decided to flip through the ork codex and try to ignore him. We have some ruthless IG players at our store, so it wouldn't surprise me if he had a rough match against one (they are really tough to beat), but just how passionate he was about it really surprised me. I didn't want to argue with him, mainly because if he was this upset, obviously some new guy isn't going to sway his opinion. Plus, knowing me, I would've probably said something and just made him hate it more ("wait, they can get orders to help them shoot MORE!?!?!"... you get the idea) I think the store owner was even more confused than me, as he responded with "Really?" and then started rattling off all the ways he had beaten IG (he plays a lot of armies) I didn't stick around much longer after, I had to leave, so I grabbed my ork dex, and hit the road. What bugged me the most though, was that up until then, the dude was really cool and laid back. Had I said nothing of the IG, he probably would have been really cool the whole time, as we had been chatting for a bit up until then no problem.

TL;DR: What do you do when someone just lays into your army? I mean like they hate it so much they not only will not play against it, but refuse to even acknowledge it as a force, or go so far as to either insult you or dislike you as well? To the point where they'll forfeit a tournament match just to prove their point, or something else as extreme? Whether its a TFG, or a guy who in any other circumstance is really cool to be around, how do you handle it to either get them to chill out, or at least change the subject? I'd like to get an idea of how to better handle the situation, as I'm sure I'll see this guy again in the store sometimes, and without a doubt at tournaments (where this will be more of an issue) I'm not quitting IG anytime soon either, regardless of someone's experience with them, but I'd like to be able to show the guy that not all IG players are jerks.

Please realize I am not looking for a "poor me, my little IG army got ranted on" pity thread. I'm mainly looking for advice so I can be more prepared for dealing with guys like this in the future. This is a game and I like to play for fun. Having a guy get angry at the mere sight of my army is counterproductive to this.

I'd tell him to put down his purse and man up and learn to play his army. Every army pretty much stands a chance if you can list tailor to another army. The ONLY exception I can think of off hand is Daemons vs GK's who have probably the biggest uphill battle in 40k.

Well, if I was new to the game, it would be a very intimidating/awkward situation. But, having played since RT days and owning fairly complete and mostly painted armies from 9 different codices, I'd just laugh and shake my head.

While I am an "Ultramarine Player" and take a lot of crap for it, when I offer to instead, pull out my Tanith, or my Kroot Tau, or my Ravenwing, or my Space Wolves, or my Orks, or my Chaos Marines, or my Black Templars, or my Grey Knights, or my other SM Codex forces... people tend to cool down.

If it was in a friendly game, and some one insists they won't play whatever given army, I almost always have another list and force with me and just offer to pull that out instead.

However, they are being TFG. Its a game, people have spent money and time building their given army and should not be bullied or whined out of a game just because someone on a soapbox feels threatened by leafblower or Loganwing or whatever.

I'd recommend just politely saying, "sorry, this is the army I brought today, and its too bad you don't want to play a game". Its not what I'd do (they'd get a pretty severe lecture from me on common courtesy, common sense, having a pair, and realizing this is playing plastic army men), but it is what I recommend.

I have only gotten people in 40k to complain about my army after they have played me. Back before the recent sisters dex I had all kinds of people complain that my entire army "had stormshields for free and was rending". However whenever people complained about my sisters while the complaint was real it was normally someone I knew and in a much friendlier /joking manner. Never had a complete stranger start ripping on sisters. But that could very well be because sisters are such a rare army people don't have enough experience with them to complain with.

But I have had this kind of thing happen to me in certain video games i play. I am a huge fighting game fan, I have been playing games like Street fighter, Mortal Kombat, Soul Calibur and the like since I was old enough to hold a controller. I will use probably the most common example.

Street Fighter 2 came out and I played Chun Li. Grew to love the character. I actually skipped Street fighter 3 until 3rd Strike because none of the characters interested me since Chun wasn't in the game. Once Chun was in the game I started playing it a bit. While I didn't know this at the time Chun-Li is vastly considered the single best character in 3rd strike.

I would go to an arcade someone would want to play and when I picked Chun people would often get upset. I still remember one dude insulting me for about 10 minutes straight because he beat me after I picked a "top tier" character in a "friendly match"

Now im not sure if you know much about the arcade scene from back in the day. But even friendly matches you played to win. Because losing wastes your quarter and if there are multiple people waiting to play loser has to move back in the line if he wants another shot. So you can't even rechallenge the guy. And people often got quite upset when losing. Keep in mind that this is like 12 or 13 years ago and I was in like 6th grade. So having who I remember as a "full grown adult" (He was probably like 18-19) start cussing me out for no reason other than my character choice was beyond scary.

I had no idea how to handle that but luckily for me someone else intervened. While I don't play 3rd strike, I still play fighting games constantly. And just 2 weeks ago I once again had someone complain about me picking Chun li in an xbox lobby of SFxT. Now adays when people want to complain about my character choice or playstyle I try to explain ways for them to beat my own character. Or how to get past my move. After all I won't get better if I win all the time. So making sure other people can challenge me improves me as a player too.

The same thing works for 40k. When someone complained about my "free stormshields" I would explain "look, only the small squads can have those and you know which ones will have it before you dedicate your army against them. So by doing such and such I won't be able to use that to win all the time" It makes me a better general as I now have to adapt to changing tactics and it usually makes the other person feel much better about playing my army.

Cryage wrote:I'd tell him to put down his purse and man up and learn to play his army. Every army pretty much stands a chance if you can list tailor to another army. The ONLY exception I can think of off hand is Daemons vs GK's who have probably the biggest uphill battle in 40k.

Weirdly enough, one of our demon players likes playing Grey knights, as he claims its actually pretty skewed in his favor. I don't know if he's insane, or reading the wrong rulebook, but he's very good so it wouldn't surprise me if he could pull it off.

@Lobukia, yeah I'm fairly new, I've only been playing for about 4 to 5 months now, so I literally only have IG, and have only just now decided to dabble in orks. I am nowhere near the point where I can bring 2 armies just in case someone doesn't like the list I brought. Not to mention the fact that if someone hated IG, they probably won't like orks any better. It's also not like I can just get a ton more models for the orkz, as I've been putting off painting for far too long and really need to get what I've got painted up first.

The thing was though, this guy was completely cool and laid back until I brought up IG. It was like I pressed a button, or shot his dog this morning. He seemed like a completely cool guy otherwise, which led me to believe he's had a bad experience. I just wish there was a way to get people to chill out about this kind of thing, because seriously, we're playing a game with plastic army men. There's no reason to get all angry about it.

I use humor. "Im sorry if your super soldier is scard of my guys in flashlights and t shirts, guess you need to find some fluffy bunnies to fight. Watch out, i hear they give ferious hugs." Should do the trick.

Of course no one has actuallt complained like that about my IG army. Its just good natured grousing between friends.

The worst thing you can do, of course, is to exacerbate it. Instead, go for a diffusal (be self-depricating if required), and switch the topic to them. In this case, the easiest way out would probably be "Yeah, IG are good, but that hasn't stopped me from losing a bunch of games with them anyways. What army do you play?"

As you note, he probably had a bad experience or two. I still hold a grudge against tau for what they used to be able to do in 4th ed, and that was years ago. However, what you're talking about is a clearly bitter taste in the proverbial mouth that causes him to have a knee-jerk reaction. As they say, the worst flavor in the world is "unexpected". If it's true for chocolate-coated candies and jelly beans, it's certainly true for a 40k experience.

The best thing you can do in the future to make sure that you don't cause this kind of a problem in someone else is to be explicit, and clearly explain what everything does. Show your opponent your list, and make sure to point out stuff. For example, when I first started playing blob guard, I would inform my opponents that my infantry squads have stubborn, so they're harder to kill in close combat than you think. That way, there isn't some sort of unexpected shock, leading to things like "they can do THAT too!?"

Are you revealing some of the cards in your deck? Sure, but it's better that way. Either your opponents are going to understand what your army can do before the first time you play, or after the first time you play. Either case, you're only really getting a single win out of that, and if the only way that you're getting the win is by knowing your codex better than your opponent knows your codex, and that you need to hide things from your opponent in order for your army to be effective, then perhaps you deserve to be thought of poorly.

Not saying that you need to spell out exactly everything that you're going to do in advance (although I actually do that for younger players), but you and your army by extension are going to earn TFG points if you make a habit of suddenly springing special rules on your opponents to your advantage when they didn't even know to expect it, or that it was even possible.

The first 5th ed game I played was against an ork player right after their current codex came out. While I was still trying to get a feel for the new rules set, and for the new orks, sometime around turn 5 or 6, my opponent revealed that "oh, yeah, these nobz are actually a scoring unit". Having more or less ignored the nobz because I didn't know that his elites (or was it HQ) choice counted as scoring in his particular list came as a rude shock, and felt like he was trying to cheat to win. Not that he was, but it was still a pretty low thing to do.

Yes, I now know to ask my opponent which of his units are scoring in advance, but that left an enduring bitter taste against that particular player. Was it really worth it just to win that one game (which, by the way, he didn't)?

If someone started on about any subject in which I wasn't interested in listening to, I'd most likely wander off and focus my attention on something else.

Doubly so if they're popping off about what variety of plastic space manz I choose to play with.

I'd play Grey Knights just to hear the QQing. Nerdrage sustains me like a mewling babe to his mother's tit. And boiled brony blood. Which gives me neon colored gaks for a week. Try explaining that to your room mate when every time you go to the bathroom it's a lucky charms commercial.

I had one guy in a tournament completely ragging on my orks for being OP and 'broken' and 'unkillable'..

His main complaint was that there was no way to kill 180+ orks barrelling down-table at him before they got to swing in CC.

Oddly enough (and no offense to the OP..I don't mind IG) he was a Guard player, and his list was tailored heavily towards antihorde as we had several Nid and Ork horde armies at the time. Flamers and blasts and Pieplates oh my!

He basically ripped me a verbal new one for playing a broken-ass OP army all the time he was setting up, not even glancing at my list

He stopped mid-rant when i set up my mekbash force agaisnt him, consisting of 11 walkers, 2 BW and 2 KFF meks with Meganobz bodyguards.

He got rolled (literally ) as he hadn't invested in much anti-vehicle gear, and then whined at the TO about how KFF was broken as hell, and that 11 walkers PLUS tanks couldn't possibly be legal (despite the fact he had tanks and a bunch of sentinels.... )

If someone whines about your army, chances are they suck, and don't want their fragile ego to take the hit from being beaten Probably not really worth playng them either way.

Silly people taking the game too seriously should not be taken seriously.

^^^that. It's generous of the community to provide free therapy, though.

This is sirius bizness...

I put my titan on the table and say...

"Deal with it"

bibblles wrote:I put my titan on the table and say...

"Deal with it"

I'm pretty sure any army can tailor fit their list to take down any titan of the equivalent points worth.

*cough* pretty sure "Titan" is a euphemism in that instance... if not, it should be *cough*

Basically, feth that guy. If he's going to launch into a five minute nerd-rage because he's got an army focused down to one style of combat, and cries that he loses to an army that specializes in the perfect counter to that style then, well, them's the breaks. He's probably stupid, and possibly insane, as he apparently has taken his CC-focused army up against shooty-focused armies and gotten butt-spanked. If he is going to break into histrionics when your IG are on the table? Well, throw him a bone... roll up a buncha Russes, tankshock his troops, and then shoot them.

Hazardous Harry wrote:

bibblles wrote:I put my titan on the table and say...

"Deal with it"

I'm pretty sure any army can tailor fit their list to take down any titan of the equivalent points worth.

True, but a warlord titan on the table will end many a conversation.

When I talk to players, we say things like that against each other's armies out of good fun, you know, trash talk. But I've never really encountered anyone who straight up just doesn't play against someone's army and gets on someone's case for having said army. Though sometimes I'm a little reluctant to play against Grey Knights and Blood Angel players, only because I see them way too often.

Shadowbrand wrote:I'd play Grey Knights just to hear the QQing. Nerdrage sustains me like a mewling babe to his mother's tit. And boiled brony blood. Which gives me neon colored gaks for a week. Try explaining that to your room mate when every time you go to the bathroom it's a lucky charms commercial.

Man you made me laugh.

I tell them to learn to play better.

I offer to trade armies, sometimes.

It either shuts them up fast, or i get to try something new.

Most of the time people lose because:
1. The dice god showed them no favour
2. They got completely out classed by the opponent
3. They don't actually know how to play their own army

Reason three is the one a player can actually work on, A player can build strategies to deal with a range of army types, especially types like Loganwing armys, when facing an army like that you play against their weaknesses

To answer the OP if i had someone say that i would usually just laugh in the face, followed by 'you do know this is a game?'', but its very unlikely i would face this as i run a fluffy Relictors force.

To the OP, what you do for someone like that is play him, beat him, and knock him out and rob him... ok, maybe not the last two.


As a proud Dark Angel player, I get a lot of punishment too for playing what I like. It's no frigging business of this guy to criticize what you play unless you are an ungrateful winner or a cheat.

bibblles wrote:

Hazardous Harry wrote:

bibblles wrote:I put my titan on the table and say...

"Deal with it"

I'm pretty sure any army can tailor fit their list to take down any titan of the equivalent points worth.

True, but a warlord titan on the table will end many a conversation.

If you brought even a half-decent looking warlord titan to the FLGS, the conversation would end only because they are looking at you in awestruck worship.

I would go down to fisticuffs to pit my army against a lone warlord.
EDIT: As a gentlemen's offer, of course.

Really ? i see the IG as easy prey for my orks, take out da tanks and destroy the troops
lasguns do jacksh*t to t4

TechPr1est wrote:Really ? i see the IG as easy prey for my orks, take out da tanks and destroy the troops
lasguns do jacksh*t to t7+

Fix it for you. Lasguns are decent vs t4.

Ascalam wrote:I had one guy in a tournament completely ragging on my orks for being OP and 'broken' and 'unkillable'..

His main complaint was that there was no way to kill 180+ orks barrelling down-table at him before they got to swing in CC.

Oddly enough (and no offense to the OP..I don't mind IG) he was a Guard player, and his list was tailored heavily towards antihorde as we had several Nid and Ork horde armies at the time. Flamers and blasts and Pieplates oh my!

He basically ripped me a verbal new one for playing a broken-ass OP army all the time he was setting up, not even glancing at my list

He stopped mid-rant when i set up my mekbash force agaisnt him, consisting of 11 walkers, 2 BW and 2 KFF meks with Meganobz bodyguards.

He got rolled (literally ) as he hadn't invested in much anti-vehicle gear, and then whined at the TO about how KFF was broken as hell, and that 11 walkers PLUS tanks couldn't possibly be legal (despite the fact he had tanks and a bunch of sentinels.... )

If someone whines about your army, chances are they suck, and don't want their fragile ego to take the hit from being beaten Probably not really worth playng them either way.

\

How did you get 11 walkers?
2 BW = 2 Heavy support
3 killer kans = 1 HS
6 KK = 2 troops (due to the 2 meks)

Where did the other two walkers come from?
Did you have nobs?

He said 2 Big Mek with Meganobz bodyguard so:

2 Big Mek
Meganobz + BW
Meganobz + BW

3x Killa Kan
3x Killa Kan
3x Killa Kan

2 Deff Dread (troop choices because of big meks)

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Ascalam wrote:I had one guy in a tournament completely ragging on my orks for being OP and 'broken' and 'unkillable'..

His main complaint was that there was no way to kill 180+ orks barrelling down-table at him before they got to swing in CC.

Oddly enough (and no offense to the OP..I don't mind IG) he was a Guard player, and his list was tailored heavily towards antihorde as we had several Nid and Ork horde armies at the time. Flamers and blasts and Pieplates oh my!

He basically ripped me a verbal new one for playing a broken-ass OP army all the time he was setting up, not even glancing at my list

He stopped mid-rant when i set up my mekbash force agaisnt him, consisting of 11 walkers, 2 BW and 2 KFF meks with Meganobz bodyguards.

He got rolled (literally ) as he hadn't invested in much anti-vehicle gear, and then whined at the TO about how KFF was broken as hell, and that 11 walkers PLUS tanks couldn't possibly be legal (despite the fact he had tanks and a bunch of sentinels.... )

If someone whines about your army, chances are they suck, and don't want their fragile ego to take the hit from being beaten Probably not really worth playng them either way.

\

How did you get 11 walkers?
2 BW = 2 Heavy support
3 killer kans = 1 HS
6 KK = 2 troops (due to the 2 meks)

Where did the other two walkers come from?
Did you have nobs?

The two Deff Dreads would have been Troops due to the two Big Meks. The nine Killa Kans would have been Heavy Support. The two Battlewagons would have been dedicated transports for two units of Meganobz in Elites.

Ailaros wrote:(be self-depricating if required)

I disagree. While diffusal is always the preferred method of dealing with these types of situations, self deprecation does nothing other than show the individual that he can walk all over you and that you will do nothing about it. Do not apologize for yourself. Instead, apologize for the situation. Something like:

"I'm sorry that you had a bad experience with IG, but I will not tolerate being insulted when I did nothing wrong. If you wish, we can discuss methods and tactics to help you. If you continue to abuse me verbally, I will speak with the store manager.

Remember to always stay calm and speak with an even tone. Replying loudly or angrily will only escalate the situation.

If they were on a hardcore rant about me playing guard, I probably wouldn't offer to swap armies. You don't know them or what they might do(thinking back to the Baneblade incident with the juice drink and a pencil eraser).

Personally, I would tell him to come back and talk to me when his time of the month is over.

HTH

*edit for inappropriateness.

Thanks HH.

Inappropriate Nocturn, edit that out before it gets reported.