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I had this idea for a fun new dynamic of the game. If you could capture prisoners. I am sure that you could come up with fluffy reasons why each race would want to take someone alive at one time or another. Here is how the rule would work:
At the beginning of combat resolution a unit can elect to make a "capture attack." This is where the unit attempts to disarm and subdue there opponent and not kill them. When making a capture attack the all models in the unit attack with a penalty of -1 to Weapons skill, strength and initiative (the penalty of less than leathal force). Additionally any power/force/rending weapons/poison are deactivated. Additionally instant death does not result from capture attacks.
Any unit which is removed from the board that suffered more than 50% of its casualties due to capture attacks counts as 2 kill points, or results in double victory points in a non-kill point game.

So, basically, a way for assaulty armies to win even harder? The assault phase is already before the shooting phase, if pancake was right. The handicaps listed are not enough to stop any dedicated weighty assault unit from mulching through any number of free killpoints.

chrisrawr wrote:So, basically, a way for assaulty armies to win even harder? The assault phase is already before the shooting phase, if pancake was right. The handicaps listed are not enough to stop any dedicated weighty assault unit from mulching through any number of free killpoints.

The Pancake is a lie.

(I could not help it)

Heh. Still doesn't address the fact that this basically means the army with the biggest assaultyguys wins :C

Maybe there could be a rule for stunning or less than lethal range weapons. Like Tear Gas shots or rubber bullets.

The information regarding casualties in the rulebook indicates that they aren't necessarily dead, just out-of-action. I don't think special rules are really necessary to indicate that you've subdued rather than killed units. Simply use the existing kill point system to represent this, no modifications necessary.

That said, home-brew scenarios where opposing forces (or neutral parties) act as objectives when captured are a cool idea and one that I've seen implemented before. Dark Eldar capturing a civilian populace or resource creature while opposing forces try to stop them can be awesome to play.

Put 1d3+1 units of 1d6 civilian or creature models in 2" coherency on the table following the objective placement rules. At the beginning of the first player's turn, the first player chooses one independant unit and moves it 2d6" either randomly using the scatter die to represent crazed mobs or panicking animals; or towards the "friendly" table edge to represent allied forces ushering them to a staging area. You could even roll a die to determine if they stay still, move randomly, or towards a specifc table edge.

Depending on whether the units are civvies or animals determines how to deal with them. If they're intended for capture, they can act as either objectives or additional kill points for either army when subdued. If one side is supposed to be protecting them, they can give kill points to the "attacker" when they're subdued and to the "defender" if they make it to his/her table edge.

You can even weigh the kill points in favor of one army depending on what happens to them. If the independant units are, say, intelligence analysts, it may behoove the "defending" forces to kill them to keep them from enemy hands - giving 1 KP or objective - but allowing them to escape would be preferrable - counting as 2 KP or objectives.

Not exactly a change to the rules, but as a custom scenario it works well.

You can't exactly "capture" certain races or units either..

I'd imagine capturing any orks, crons or nids would be far too much of a hassle to be worth it.

It's not like you can just slap cuffs on them and hope they sit on the naughty stool while you go slaughter their friends.

Taking prisoners is a huge factor in war because you have to detain, house, feed, and monitor them. Getting them off an active battlefield would take extreme dedication.

The only way it would work is if the rule says that if you manage to completely subdue all models and still have atleast one model yourself then you remove your unit as well while they escort them to a prison or whatever. The enemy unit counts as 2Kp and you lose none for your unit. You don't get the unit back.

I like the concept but it's a little hard to incorporate in a normal game's given time span. Chances are slim any unit would surrender in the heat of battle with allies still fighting nearby.

Maybe instead of a squad getting wiped out after a sweeping advance they surrender on another morale check failure. Still seems like at least a portion of the victorious unit would need to escort the prisoners away from the action.

How about if a unit surrenders they stay in place and one model from the victorious unit remains with them. Any enemy unit within 24" of a surrendered unit tests at a -2 to any Leadership or Morale checks?

Zookie wrote:Maybe there could be a rule for stunning or less than lethal range weapons. Like Tear Gas shots or rubber bullets.

I'm sorry, but WHAT?

8|

Did you just SERIOUSLY propose rubber bullets in Warhammer 40,000?

I cannot 8| harder at you than I am doing now.

amanita wrote:I like the concept but it's a little hard to incorporate in a normal game's given time span. Chances are slim any unit would surrender in the heat of battle with allies still fighting nearby.

Maybe instead of a squad getting wiped out after a sweeping advance they surrender on another morale check failure. Still seems like at least a portion of the victorious unit would need to escort the prisoners away from the action.

How about if a unit surrenders they stay in place and one model from the victorious unit remains with them. Any enemy unit within 24" of a surrendered unit tests at a -2 to any Leadership or Morale checks?

But this gets really tricky now, because running away and surrendering to the enemy are different things entirely. Orks might make a run for it back to base, but they wouldn't ever surrender to anyone. Nids on instinctive behavior might scitter away to a safe place, but it wouldn't calmly stop fighting and put its hands-er, appendeges in the air. It works the other way as well. Gaurdmen might surrender to Tau, but no fool would surrender to Dark Eldar, unless you enjoy a life of extreme torture.

Oh I agree, it opens a few cans of worms. But if somebody wants to make it work it can be done; it just needs a little more thought. Just throwing out ideas.

Dark Eldar used to have a rule where you captured prisoners.

I think it was something like you roll a d6 for each succesful kill (or combat?) and each prisoner gave a bonus 50% victory points.

But personally, outside of say, a mission type, a universal rule like this doesnt make too much sense.

Though I'd like to see thr DE get a slave raidery rule back. :p

loota boy wrote:You can't exactly "capture" certain races or units either..
I'd imagine capturing any orks, crons or nids would be far too much of a hassle to be worth it.

Also add to the list: CSM, Daemons, SM and maybe kroot.
How may armies out is that already?

Daemonhammer wrote:

loota boy wrote:You can't exactly "capture" certain races or units either..
I'd imagine capturing any orks, crons or nids would be far too much of a hassle to be worth it.

Also add to the list: CSM, Daemons, SM and maybe kroot.
How may armies out is that already?

Yeah, the whole thing just doesn't really work in a world where we have no Geneva Convention to ensure good conditions for POW.. Most every faction would just torture you and kill you or perform god-aweful experiments on you... It's just a better option to fight to the death against most everyone except Tau..