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Was mooching though Ebay when I came across some old Slann Warriors with names like 'Itzadodyl', 'Pintamilkada' and 'Cupacocoa'. Ok, not belly laugh material but definitely made me smirk, and got me thinking 'has Games Workshop lost its sense of humour?'. In the late 80s and early 90s when I got into the hobby there seemed to be a real ability for GW to poke fun at itself. All of the stuff that comes out now [especially in 40k] seems to be 'nemesis doom weapon of death' and really takes itself too seriously.

The first reason why I think this is a problem is because some of the most creative things that have come out of GW have been when their toungue is firmly in cheek. For example noise marines - chaos rockers who can kill with power chords and strap their amps to their ears, BloodBowl [whole concept is funny], orks as Hell's Angels, Squats etc. These helped define the Warhammer universe but I can't see anything like that coming out now and the recent codexes were very straight laced [although I was pleasantly surprised to see Jokaero weapon smiths come back in the GK codex - despite all of the advances mankind has made they still rely on ginger apes for their superior technology ]

The second reason why I se this as a problem is because I think GW could avoid being such a hate figure if it had a better sense of humour. Despite the recent price increases [which are complete BS, don't get me wrong] Warhammer was always an expensive hobby. However I didn't feel so bad handing over my money when the things I was buying made me smile. A bit like having a friend who never has any money and always borrows from everyone, but you bring out anyway because they're a laugh.

So, nostalgia for better days from someone who is probably too old to be playing this, or does there need to be less grimness and darkness?

They went from guys in their basement designing silly stuff for a beer and pretzles game to developing a rich background about the grim dark future. You can see in the old Rogue trader an inquisitor named Sherlock Obiwan Clussoe and understand the type of game it was then. See also primarchs Angron the angry, Alpharius (the leader of the Alpha Legion), Ferrous Manus (leader of the Iron Hands) and so on... You can then read through the darker Horus Heresy books and see where it has progressed to.

I think this is a good thing. I like the current fluff much better.

Fantasy still has those things. The Lizardmen still have Tik-Taq-To after all.

I think most of those references have gone into the fluff instead of the rules of the game/codex.

And GW still insist on FERRUS MANUS being the primarch of the Iron Hands. If that isn't making fun of yourself, I don't know what is.

Read the fluff for the Marienburg Class Land Ship for fantasy

They still got a sense of humor (or at least FW does)

Read any Ork codex.

I think Finecast is insanely funny.

There's still humor, but a lot less sillyness (there's still some though)

I remember the older Ork dexes, for example, and the WD articles that went with them. Pages of Madboyz rules tables and Cybernetics, many of them very silly.

It depends to a degree on the writer, also. Most of the Mariine codexes, for example, take themselves WAY to seriously. Codex Orks, however, is a lot less so.

As a whole i like the current, darker feel, but i'd like it a lot better without the RETCON kneejerk every codex. Leave the existing fluff alone and write new stuff, GW. Leave the setting history alone

There is still some in there, it is generally just the more extreme examples (such as the examples sited in the OP) which have gone. For example, the Orc warboss who travelled backwards in time and killed himself so he could get a backup of his favourite gun. Or, Draigo travelling across the warp, killing Mortarion and then carving his name onto his heart (which was an obvious reference to the character Mac wanting to avenge his buddy Blaine in the movie Predator).

I would argue that the slightly dark humour is an essential part of the Grim-dark setting and of 40k itself. Anyone who is a fan of 2000AD will know that style was very similar to that of Rogue Trader - bleak, but with the essentially British streak of humour running through it.

I suppose their is a propensity for any fantasy universe, when exposed to sufficient time and enough of a fanbase, for people to start taking it far too seriously and almost behave as though they are quoting 'scripture'. Think of Lord of the Rings, which started off as a story for Tolkein's grandchildren, or Star Wars, which was an amusing swashbuckling Space adventure for the family. Twenty years later and people are changing their name by depole to 'Darth Vader' and crying blue murder on internet forums as to whether Han Solo was left or right handed. Really, the 40k universe is no different, and in fact there is an entire branch of GW (in the form of Black Library) dedicated to it. Who knows, maybe in 3000 years time, after civilisation has been destroyed and rebuilt again, we will all be worshipping at the cult of Luke Skywalker and praying for the force to take us when we die?

Perhaps there is a little less room in there for the more obvious jokes, but there will always be those of us who 'get' what the original conception of the 40k universe was, and will continue to call them 'Space Sharks'

@Pacific

It may have started out as a story for his grandchildren, but make no mistake, Tolkein took Middle Earth very, very seriously.

I agree generally though. There are fewer puns these days, but the whole 40K setting is a grim black comedy. It's a very dark, very dry joke, and it's at pretty much everyone's expense.

Ughhh on to the Grimdark again....

angel of ecstasy wrote:I think Finecast is insanely funny.

looool, made my day, +1

on another hand i think they have their funny parts and their serious parts, skaven, orks, decent enough tongue in cheek. but i also like the serious dark mature side that they are adopting. i like a bleak gakked up universe of war...where in one corner of this dark unforgiving brutal galaxy orks are spawning from slowed mold and bumping into street signs and scenery in general lol.

When an entire regiment of a hundred thousand guardsmen is posthumously sentenced to death for cowardice, you know there's still some humor going on in there. It's not as overt as it was, but there's still some dark, dry comedy in there. This is one of many reasons I love The Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer, which contains a blank page with the note to leave a certain space blank under penalty of death. There is no reason given, just this ridiculous footnote. I love it.

Some humor is still there. Like how a Space Wolf launched himself out of a Torpedo bay and boarded an enemy frigate.

I keep picturing a cartoon face with the Space Wolf going "YEAHYEAHYEAHYEAHYEAH!"

I'd say that the humor has involved. A lot of the 'early' stuff I've seen from GW (which, for me, means 3rd edition-ish 40k or the Necromunda book I have that is slightly older) has very overt puns and pop culture references. These don't, I think, age very well. Celebrity references, especially, get weird if the celebrity referenced does something embarrassing or controversial.

On the other hand, dry humor works very well to take the edge of a setting that is otherwise pretty miserable, and will probably age better.

I'm reminded of an article I read a few months ago about the writers behind 2000A.D. comics. They really never expected it to turn into a multiple-decade thing, so at first had no real concerns for continuity, building a world, etc. Now everything is part of a large canon of work and needs to be more consistent and fit the tone or it comes off as wrong. GW is in much the same situation. Heck, the very minimal 'in-character' writing I do for DP9 has the same problem, and that's me writing non-canon web material for a setting that only dates back to the 90s.

GW didn't enjoy it when I called the Imperial fist of the 5 movie mahreens for their games day board Sanjiheed

Guardsman Marbo?

Have you read Trazyn's letter to Valeria? Come on now, there's still plenty of humour in GW. Just not as many obvious puns.

Well, they have the Ultramarines for their poster boys.

Get it? Because they'e blue. And they're marines. And... yeah.

Read the Ork Codex.

Mag Urk Thraka.

Margaret Thatcher?

I also agree on Trazyn's letter, I found that simply hilarious.

TedNugent wrote:Read the Ork Codex.

Which is one book, when the argument is that GW used to have humor like that strewn about in all of their books. Your point?

Sidstyler wrote:

TedNugent wrote:Read the Ork Codex.

Which is one book, when the argument is that GW used to have humor like that strewn about in all of their books. Your point?

One of the oldest books still around, in fact.

Right now GW reminds me of a 14 year old goth punk, trying to be dark. I like the old, witty and well written books better.

Asherian Command wrote:Some humor is still there. Like how a Space Wolf launched himself out of a Torpedo bay and boarded an enemy frigate.

I keep picturing a cartoon face with the Space Wolf going "YEAHYEAHYEAHYEAHYEAH!"

Or...

The Ciaphas Cain series has plenty of puns and cultural nods, quick example "The Nuns of Gavarone" = The Guns of Navarone.

The humour is in there but its not as overt as it once once.

I think the Cain novels were written a bit back, but i could be wrong.

Holy Orb of Antioch.

Enough said.

And that book is even older than Orks.

Infantry mans manuel, most of the fluff books or other books can be a lot of fun

Nemesor Zhandrek - He alone is awesome. Imagine him sitting on his command barge going "WHAT? WHOSE THERE" all the time. senile old fart.

Ciaphus Cain books are always good for a laugh, the entire ork race is always fun. I mean they really tap into your inner 8-12 year old.

Another current example albeit from earlier times... the Skaven Doomwheel is basically a giant hamster wheel