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 alarmingrick wrote:

 azreal13 wrote:

 alarmingrick wrote:

 azreal13 wrote:
Oh, look, the ultimate Internet contrarian and the user least capable of walking away from a fight have encountered each other in a thread about a somewhat controversial update of a very popular army.

Awesome! Thanks for helping the situation out so much!

Holier than thou sniping is just as much of a annoyance as the "ultimate Internet contrarian and the user least capable of walking away from a fight "!

Wasn't talking about you dude, but this response, considering others I've seen from you too, is telling me that you are probably suffering a sense of humour failure and need to decompress a little?

You're correct. My apologizes.

All good, happens to the best of us!

 Paradigm wrote:

JeneralJoe117 wrote:
There seems to be a fair old amount of stuff missing from the new Imperial Guar..... sorry ASTRA MILITARUM section of the GW website. No Creed, no LC, but weirdly still Al'Rahem even though he's meant to be dropped. Kind of hoping it's just a balls up as they're moving stuff on the website around, but now I'm getting a little worried. I wanted the LC.

The LC is certainly gone, which is annoying, as I was planning on getting one this week (my only hope now is that the local GW store will still have one on the shelf next week). Stupidly, they've kept the old metal ones, but got rid of the newer, and in my opinion, best one.

I wish they'd give us a countdown before stuff like this happened. I keep missing out on models I've wanted for ages, but always delayed getting because they just pull them about a week before I have the money to buy them. Makes me a sad panda.

 alarmingrick wrote:

 krazynadechukr wrote:
What's the problem?

That's a Medusa, not a Griffon. Just sayin'.....

well, you get the point, just sayin'

 krazynadechukr wrote:

 alarmingrick wrote:

 krazynadechukr wrote:
What's the problem?

That's a Medusa, not a Griffon. Just sayin'.....

well, you get the point, just sayin'

Or...they could have just not cut out those units.

 krazynadechukr wrote:

 alarmingrick wrote:

 krazynadechukr wrote:
What's the problem?

That's a Medusa, not a Griffon. Just sayin'.....

well, you get the point, just sayin'

And you don't, clearly.
Would you want to take a beautifully painted model like you have pictured and rip it apart to ad a different barrel?
You do realize how asinine that proposition is, right?
Just continuing to say....

So, nobody cares for the ogryns/bullgryns with rumored power mauls and 5+ invul saves?

 Paradigm wrote:

JeneralJoe117 wrote:
There seems to be a fair old amount of stuff missing from the new Imperial Guar..... sorry ASTRA MILITARUM section of the GW website. No Creed, no LC, but weirdly still Al'Rahem even though he's meant to be dropped. Kind of hoping it's just a balls up as they're moving stuff on the website around, but now I'm getting a little worried. I wanted the LC.

The LC is certainly gone, which is annoying, as I was planning on getting one this week (my only hope now is that the local GW store will still have one on the shelf next week). Stupidly, they've kept the old metal ones, but got rid of the newer, and in my opinion, best one.

They are going to want people to buy the new commissar. Which is really annoying, seeing as the Lord Commissar in finecast was the best looking one and the new commissar is probably the worst looking one. (IMO)

Heafstaag wrote:
So, nobody cares for the ogryns/bullgryns with rumored power mauls and 5+ invul saves?

No.

Heafstaag wrote:
So, nobody cares for the ogryns/bullgryns with rumored power mauls and 5+ invul saves?

Well, they can get S8 on the charge, but a 5+ invul won't save them from much. Nice, but not 60 ppm nice.

 Happygrunt wrote:


They are going to want people to buy the new commissar. Which is really annoying, seeing as the Lord Commissar in finecast was the best looking one and the new commissar is probably the worst looking one. (IMO)

Yeah, the wife painted up a great LC for me, and I'll definitely try and rock some guys with him. Disappointing he's gone. The other commissar models are equally awesome; the one with the plasma pistol charging forward with the power sword is one of favourite models of all time.

The new commissar doesn't do anything for me. The sword freaks me out.

 Happygrunt wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:
So, nobody cares for the ogryns/bullgryns with rumored power mauls and 5+ invul saves?

Well, they can get S8 on the charge, but a 5+ invul won't save them from much. Nice, but not 60 ppm nice.

Exactly.

 Happygrunt wrote:


Well, they can get S8 on the charge, but a 5+ invul won't save them from much. Nice, but not 60 ppm nice.

Holy gak, 60ppm!? Yeesh.

 alarmingrick wrote:

 Happygrunt wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:
So, nobody cares for the ogryns/bullgryns with rumored power mauls and 5+ invul saves?

Well, they can get S8 on the charge, but a 5+ invul won't save them from much. Nice, but not 60 ppm nice.

Exactly.

How many points per model would you price them at?

 Blacksails wrote:

 Happygrunt wrote:


Well, they can get S8 on the charge, but a 5+ invul won't save them from much. Nice, but not 60 ppm nice.

Holy gak, 60ppm!? Yeesh.

I read that it was 45 ppm for bullgryn and 15 for the mace/shield.

Totally not worth it when allies are available.

Heafstaag wrote:


How many points per model would you price them at?

I'd start at no more than 30.

Ogryns aren't exactly great currently at 40ppm. If they were 30ppm with a 5++ and the ability to hit hard in CC, they might actually serve a purpose.

 Blacksails wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:


How many points per model would you price them at?

I'd start at no more than 30.

Ogryns aren't exactly great currently at 40ppm. If they were 30ppm with a 5++ and the ability to hit hard in CC, they might actually serve a purpose.

This.

30 points per model is about right, yeah. You have to consider the transport-tax and the fact that they probably won't be charging until turn 3 in the price, as well.

I want Mr. Omega to come back to the thread and rant about how much of a great tactical opportunity they are and how we're angry sheeple for not seeing it, though.

Heafstaag wrote:

 alarmingrick wrote:

 Happygrunt wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:
So, nobody cares for the ogryns/bullgryns with rumored power mauls and 5+ invul saves?

Well, they can get S8 on the charge, but a 5+ invul won't save them from much. Nice, but not 60 ppm nice.

Exactly.

How many points per model would you price them at?

Something that's not more expensive than a Grey Knight Paladin

Seriously though? With their crappy Ld? No more than 35ppm, probably 30.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
30 points per model is about right, yeah. You have to consider the transport-tax and the fact that they probably won't be charging until turn 3 in the price, as well.

Right, and there's another problem; transportation.

Are they very bulky, or just bulky?

If the former, they're useless; no transport can take a unit big enough to be worth it.

If the latter, it'd be doable, but nothing to right home about.

At least at 30ppm, with a constant 5++, they could serve as a wall for a blob of guardsmen.

 Blacksails wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:


How many points per model would you price them at?

I'd start at no more than 30.

Ogryns aren't exactly great currently at 40ppm. If they were 30ppm with a 5++ and the ability to hit hard in CC, they might actually serve a purpose.

30 points for str 5 t 5 w 3 with 5 invul and power mauls? That seems undercosted.

 BlaxicanX wrote:

I want Mr. Omega to come back to the thread and rant about how much of a great tactical opportunity they are and how we're angry sheeple for not seeing it, though.

Blacksails wrote:

 Happygrunt wrote:


They are going to want people to buy the new commissar. Which is really annoying, seeing as the Lord Commissar in finecast was the best looking one and the new commissar is probably the worst looking one. (IMO)

Yeah, the wife painted up a great LC for me, and I'll definitely try and rock some guys with him. Disappointing he's gone. The other commissar models are equally awesome; the one with the plasma pistol charging forward with the power sword is one of favourite models of all time.

The new commissar doesn't do anything for me. The sword freaks me out.

I actually just bought the running comissar to make sure I had one before the new one comes out. It's a shame I never got the other metal ones. I liked the powerfist commissar (the book one), just never had the funds to pick him up/ motivation to buy him.

Blacksails wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:


How many points per model would you price them at?

I'd start at no more than 30.

Ogryns aren't exactly great currently at 40ppm. If they were 30ppm with a 5++ and the ability to hit hard in CC, they might actually serve a purpose.

I would say 45-50 for the shield/mace, 40-45 for the walking shields and 30 for the standard ogryn.

Heafstaag wrote:


30 points for str 5 t 5 w 3 with 5 invul and power mauls? That seems undercosted.

How are they getting into CC?

When are they getting into CC?

What are they doing before getting into CC?

How hard are they hitting in the first round? Second round and onward?

Look at the current codices. Look at what they do, how they do it, and how efficiently its done.

Then tell me that Ogryn are going to be undercosted at 30ppm.

Heafstaag wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:


How many points per model would you price them at?

I'd start at no more than 30.

Ogryns aren't exactly great currently at 40ppm. If they were 30ppm with a 5++ and the ability to hit hard in CC, they might actually serve a purpose.

30 points for str 5 t 5 w 3 with 5 invul and power mauls? That seems undercosted.

And here is the balance. LD 6. They will run if you farted at them.

 Happygrunt wrote:

Blacksails wrote:

 Happygrunt wrote:


They are going to want people to buy the new commissar. Which is really annoying, seeing as the Lord Commissar in finecast was the best looking one and the new commissar is probably the worst looking one. (IMO)

Yeah, the wife painted up a great LC for me, and I'll definitely try and rock some guys with him. Disappointing he's gone. The other commissar models are equally awesome; the one with the plasma pistol charging forward with the power sword is one of favourite models of all time.

The new commissar doesn't do anything for me. The sword freaks me out.

I actually just bought the running comissar to make sure I had one before the new one comes out. It's a shame I never got the other metal ones. I liked the powerfist commissar (the book one), just never had the funds to pick him up/ motivation to buy him.

Blacksails wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:


How many points per model would you price them at?

I'd start at no more than 30.

Ogryns aren't exactly great currently at 40ppm. If they were 30ppm with a 5++ and the ability to hit hard in CC, they might actually serve a purpose.

I would say 45-50 for the shield/mace, 40-45 for the walking shields and 30 for the standard ogryn.

That seems more like it.

Yeah, the crappy Ld requiring babysitting by an HQ makes them very hampered units.

 Paradigm wrote:
Just a quick question: Are the Artillery rules/costs in IA1 identical to the ones in the old IG codex? Because if so, there's nothing stopping anyone just using the old codex rules and saying 'these are now FW, but the stats are the same, ok?'

Might save people some money on the IA book.

I suspect if you're playing people who'd block you from using them as they weren't in the new Guard codex,

they'd also be the sort of people who'd insist you have the appropriate IA book to show them or they'd refuse to play you anyway (if they 'allowed' forgeworld at all)

 Vaktathi wrote:
Yeah, the crappy Ld requiring babysitting by an HQ makes them very hampered units.

Which is why I'd put base Ogryn at ~25pts and the upgraded version at no more than 35pts.

There's so much in this edition and in their own rules/codex that is working against them, I can't see anything higher than that making them remotely usable.

Can we start a new thread for IG NEws etc? I just read 4 pages of whining and haven't learned anything else about the army.Mods? Hello? Bueller?

 Vaktathi wrote:
Yeah, the crappy Ld requiring babysitting by an HQ makes them very hampered units.

And with how commissars are rumored to work, your own HQ might be killing the ogryns for your opponent.