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Played my first game in 6th and with tyranids yesterday. We did 750pts just to get a feel for 6th. I faced an ork army with mekboy, deff dread, x number of ard boyz, allied with belial and deathwing terminator squad. i brought tervigon as hq, 2 zoanthorpes in spore, 10 termagants, 2x5 genestealer, and harpy with tl heavy venom cannon.

i nearly got wiped by the termies alone. 2+ with 3+ inv? how is a nid to deal with that? zoan's warp lance was just saved at 3+ repeatedly. i think i managed to kill 2 of 6 and had only harpy and zoan's left on table at end of game ...

i know i'm new to nids and 6th, so i'd appreciate any advice on how to deal with such a seemingly stupidly overpowered squad ...

Against terminators, what you need to do is just pour lots of wounds on them. Eventually they will fail some. Either kite them about with the gaunts, or push as many things as possible into CC with them at once.

Your opponent spent half his points on a close combat deathstar, you engaged it with MSU, the consequences are hardly a result of terminators being overpowered. If you aren't going to avoid or tie up the terminators, you need to counter it with an equivalent deathstar of your own. 20 stealers with toxin sacks costs the same as belial+deathwing and will defeat them in close combat.

Hell, I've nuked a TH/SS squad off the board with 10 stealers with toxin sacs. It's even easier now that fearless wounds don't own us in the face.

If you had both stealer units and the termagants (plus a squad or two of spawned ones) in the combat I bet you would've won.

Terminators are something that Nids have no problem with normaly. You just had a bad list for that type of unit. MCs, boneswords, rending claws (on a 6) and bioplasma all ignore that save and then you just have to deal with the much worse Invuln.
Best best with this list would have been to feed it spawned gaunts for a turn or two while the rest of your army dismantled the orks.

What was the mission? I only see 2 scoring troop choices on the other side. That means you should have won 5/6th of the missions if you killed the boys. Mek would have been anouther pt and getting a unit in his deployment anouther one.

SS/TH as they hit last you can out number them and pile hits before they can strike back. Else genestealers will hit first anyway, each dead termy is less dead stealers.

This is an interesting edition for 'nids is it not.

scimitar wrote:Your opponent spent half his points on a close combat deathstar, you engaged it with MSU, the consequences are hardly a result of terminators being overpowered. If you aren't going to avoid or tie up the terminators, you need to counter it with an equivalent deathstar of your own. 20 stealers with toxin sacks costs the same as belial+deathwing and will defeat them in close combat.

Assuming the 'stealers get the charge:
Round 1:
60 attacks, 40 hits, 6.6 rending wounds, 13.3 normal wounds, for 4.4 dead.
5.6 Termies strike back, killing 4.5, belial kills another 1 so that's 5.5 dead.
Assuming 'stealers pass at Ld9 (pretty likely).

Round 2:
14.5 stealers get 19 attacks, 12.6 hits, 2.1 rendings and 4.2 normal for 1.4 dead.
4.2 Termies get 8.4 attacks, 4.2 hits, 3.5 dead+1 from belial.

The stealers take a leadership at Ld 7, and if they fail they're most likely below half strength and dead (termies can't sweeping advance but they don't need to).
And if THEY get the charge on YOU (remember, fleet no longer gaurentees that you'll get the charge) then you're mincemeat.
So...I wouldn't bet on genestealers if I was you

That's 10 terminators. DA only take 5 man squads.

Then...ignore the above post.

If you can't remove the armor save, then screw it. Drown them in attacks that don't care about their 2+3++ save. 30 Hormagaunts will now get 90-120 attacks on the charge for only 180 points, and you can field many more than just 30 of the little guys. at the very worst, you're tying them up for several turns.

Devilgaunts....Devilgaunts eveywhere...

Genestealers are scary to termies. Or just swarm them with cheap gaunts.

Personal favorite is to just shoot the hell out of them with Devilgaunts. putting 30-90 shoots per brood in to them starts to slow them down.

Devourer cannon spam it kills terminators, I know.

30 of them actually kills most anything

Testify wrote:
The stealers take a leadership at Ld 7, and if they fail they're most likely below half strength and dead (termies can't sweeping advance but they don't need to).
And if THEY get the charge on YOU (remember, fleet no longer gaurentees that you'll get the charge) then you're mincemeat.
So...I wouldn't bet on genestealers if I was you

And if they are in Synapse stealers are Fearless like anything else in our army. They just don't have to take IB tests if out of Synapse.

captain collius wrote:Devourer cannon spam it kills terminators, I know.

30 of them actually kills most anything

Everything but Fateweaver...

Speaking from the perspective of a Nid player and a Deathwing player (I typically have at least 15-20 terminators on the board)
2 ways to kill termies: ignore armor or bucket of dice

Ignore armor:
Plasma Cannons, ignore armor and the termies die quickly, that is until they start bringing SS. To bad we can't take IG allies as genestealer cults to give us access to some plasma-toting vehicles
Boneswords: ignore armor, and the lashwhip can stop those pesky LCs from attacking at I4. but if you don't kill all the THs or PFs, prepare to die as the S8 will instakill you.

Bucket 'o dice: my personal favorite. Since the squad is only 5 + SCs, then it is pretty easy to overwhelm them. If you cause enought wounds, eventually they will start failing some saves.

As previously mentioned Devilguants are great, but they get ++++ times better if they have a Tyrant with the PE bubble helping them out.

genestealers: lots of attacks + rending is good against regular termies, but with the SS, it won't make a big impact

Hormaguants: with AG and TS = lots of attacks, lots of rerolls
try this also with Termaguants buffed by a Tervigon.



In one game I was ran over by nids. why? well 2 tervigons took almost no damage from ranged missiles thanks to venomthropes coversave (now cover is easier, so you don't need him, just be smart with covering the big'uns). What seemed like a billion termaguants spawned and just swarmed over my lines. with the tyrant with PE buble in the middle, they dealt some damage (now fearless doesn't take wounds for losing combat bonus for you). I eventually lost everyone because I just didn't have enought bullets or attacks.

oh yeah, use Paroxysm on any Deathstar and watch as the galaxies greatest warriors forget how to swing a sword! MUHAHAHAH!

Hormagaunts with adrenal glands. You need some. Stop running MSU genestealers. Also a monsterous creature to charge into the terminators does wonders.

juraigamer wrote:Hormagaunts with adrenal glands. You need some. Stop running MSU genestealers. Also a monsterous creature to charge into the terminators does wonders.

I'd say correct on all accounts except the MC idea. Charging a MC into a group of TH/SS terminators is the dumbest thing ever. And if they aren't TH/SS, well then it is closer, but not a guaranteed win. Why?
MCs do ignore armor, well a SS 3+ save will still stop most of the attacks. and then the THs will tear you apart. One MC simply does not have enough attacks to make it through 3+ invulsaves.

A balanced list is a balanced list. If your nid list doesn't have some MC, then how do you plan to deal with all enemies? Either time your attack to not go through terrain or let them come to you.

And yes, one single MC, a single carnifex with dual sets of scything talons will wreck more than you think. Then add 2 more. With frag spines.

juraigamer wrote:A balanced list is a balanced list. If your nid list doesn't have some MC, then how do you plan to deal with all enemies? Either time your attack to not go through terrain or let them come to you.

And yes, one single MC, a single carnifex with dual sets of scything talons will wreck more than you think. Then add 2 more. With frag spines.

i'm not saying 3 carnifexes won't destroy everything, but an army that includes a triplefex squad isn't exactly balanced.

When you have suckes with 3x carnifexes at games over 1500 point I do not know what lists your oponents are running. Honestly.

It looks to me like the Doom of Malan'tai was made to kill termies. At the very least, they'll probably have to spend a bit of time killing your 90 point model.