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Played a game recently and my opponent was playing Eldar with Dark Eldar allies. He claimed because the avatar was on the board it made all units fearless. I have now read his specific rules and it says all eldar units within 12" become fearless. So my question is would that pass on to dark eldar as well or are eldar and dark elder different for these purposes?

It's the same for rules that say "all blood angels in X range", it refers to the units from that army in the fluff DE are eldar but not codex eldar.

In the same way that DA and ultramarines are space marines but not all c:sm.

Check the Allied section of the rule book, see if DE and Eldar can use each other's rules.

However for his rule, Dark Eldar are in fact Eldar, just dark ones. Unless there's a faq somewheres

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:
Check the Allied section of the rule book, see if DE and Eldar can use each other's rules.

However for his rule, Dark Eldar are in fact Eldar, just dark ones. Unless there's a faq somewheres

Based on?

And please don't say 'fluff' or 'they have 'Eldar' in their name.

Happyjew wrote:
And please don't say 'fluff' or 'they have 'Eldar' in their name.

Do Dark Eldar even worship Khaine?

 Testify wrote:

Happyjew wrote:
And please don't say 'fluff' or 'they have 'Eldar' in their name.

Do Dark Eldar even worship Khaine?

Sounds like a guy who doesn't know his rules.

All codex specific abilites have been restricted by FAQ's, but there was no mention of this in the eldar FAQ.

However, eldar units are units from the eldar codex, not from the DE codex.

To be fair, the rulebook does suggest that Dark Eldar are (as far as the rules are concerned) a type of Eldar on p45, but this is still a pretty tenuous argument.

I think the Dark Eldar at least acknowledge Khaine, but I'm at work and away from my books and cannot verify.

The Incubi have shrines devoted to Khaine, at least

Found it. Bottom of page 6, "Gods and Monsters"

Khaine is still held in high regard in Commorragh...

Who cares. Not same codex, not Eldar.

It's a grey area, without a doubt. My guess is that Dark Eldar do count as Eldar. With the SM FAQ's, they all specified that abilities would only affect units from that same codex. Dark Eldar are Eldar. The Eldar codex are Craftworld Eldar. Forgeworld has Corsair Eldar. Different sects of the same race. Just like Space Wolves and Blood Angels and Black Templars. If GW didn't want the Avatar to affect Dark Eldar, then they would have made an FAQ entry specifying that it only makes units from Codex: Eldar fearless.

Only issue with letting Dark Eldar count as Eldar is if you let things that affect Eldar affect Dark Eldar, you would have to let Special issue ammunition affect Storm Bolters and Heavy Bolters...

 DeathReaper wrote:
Only issue with letting Dark Eldar count as Eldar is if you let things that affect Eldar affect Dark Eldar, you would have to let Special issue ammunition affect Storm Bolters and Heavy Bolters...

I'd gladly allow that, since all special ammo is S4 Rapid all over.

 HoverBoy wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Only issue with letting Dark Eldar count as Eldar is if you let things that affect Eldar affect Dark Eldar, you would have to let Special issue ammunition affect Storm Bolters and Heavy Bolters...

I'd gladly allow that, since all special ammo is S4 Rapid all over.

Only S4 if Hellfire rounds are not used.

But alas it is not RAW.

This is the exact same arugment on guiding DE. Simply put, DE != Eldar in rules.

Some people argue that they are rules wise becuase of the word Eldar in Dark Eldar. This is like saying that Space Wolves and Space Marines are the same thing because they have the word "space" in their name.

The other argument is that fluff says they're the same race. But we all know fluff != rules (With the exception of the plasma syphon whos rules say it does. This is a special exception).

These are the only two arguments that have any sort of validity, and yet they are still incorrect.

Dark Eldar are not Eldar, just like heavy flamers are not heavy weapons, fire dragons are not dragons...

Happyjew wrote:
Dark Eldar are not Eldar, just like heavy flamers are not heavy weapons, fire dragons are not dragons...

Have to agree with this. I remember playing games and stuff with other people, where they will try and bluff their way to making their army better than it actually is.
In future ask to see where it says that 'Allied Units' are affected and if it doesn't say that tell them to shut up.

Eldar and Dark Eldar are battle brothers on the alliance chart. Therefore benefits from one Codex's leader will affect models from the other codex. I base this upon the Sisters of Battle FAQ that says that says that allies who join or are joined by a unit that is affected by a blessing also affects the joining model(s).

Leo_the_Rat wrote:
Eldar and Dark Eldar are battle brothers on the alliance chart. Therefore benefits from one Codex's leader will affect models from the other codex.

Unless the codex states otherwise, which this does:

"All Eldar units within 12" are Fearless..."

Notice capitalisation on "Eldar", this specifically refers to something - as it is a Proper Noun. Meaning that only units from Codex: Eldar benefit from the Special Rule.

Iranna.

If they're brothers in arms or whatever the allies section in BRB calls it, then they have access to their allies special rule. It depends on the level of trust between them.

Fluffwise, the DE codex says ... The Dark Eldar have long given up the worship of their fallen gods, seeing them as weak and the reason behind the fall. Instead they [look up to / not quite worship / hold in high regard] the dark muses, beings that are said to have mastered their craft beyond all others.

So no, I don't think they would worship Khaine (given that the worship of any but ones self is unheard of in Commorragh), other than the quote that Happyjew found, which is news to me. Seems to conflict with the codex if you ask me.

To be honest, RAI wise I think Eldar is supposed to be able to target Dark Eldar Units.

The Eldar Book was written so long ago that this wasn't something that was expected.

Who knows maybe we'll get a patch that says treat Dark Eldar as Eldar Units or something like that.

RAW wise NO. This has been discussed a lot already, Dark Eldar are not Eldar game wise.

Unlike other faqs, it lacks the "from the codex eldar" and as such, the argument for has a leg to stand on. Intent, probably not. But it lacks the verbiage to properly define what eldar. Say you used the detachment to include a fourth unit of harlequins, for a fluffy harlequin army using the archon as its solitare or something. They are not dark eldar but are from the DE codex. They should get it, yet your argument would prevent it and no rule or faq states that they shouldn't get it. Since it says eldar, cap or not, its all friendly eldar.

Well Raw and Rai dont factor in since they are not part of the over all rules written by the games maker. That being said hsi power affects Eldar so Dasrk eldar cant benefit from it. IMHO

Lungpickle wrote:
Well Raw and Rai dont factor in since they are not part of the over all rules written by the games maker. That being said hsi power affects Eldar so Dasrk eldar cant benefit from it. IMHO

I'm sorry but this is what you wrote:

"Raw...don't factor in since they are not part of the overall rules..."

Care to elaborate?

Iranna.

 DeathReaper wrote:
Only issue with letting Dark Eldar count as Eldar is if you let things that affect Eldar affect Dark Eldar, you would have to let Special issue ammunition affect Storm Bolters and Heavy Bolters...

No, Boltguns are Boltguns. Stormbolters are NOT Boltguns.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Only issue with letting Dark Eldar count as Eldar is if you let things that affect Eldar affect Dark Eldar, you would have to let Special issue ammunition affect Storm Bolters and Heavy Bolters...

No, Boltguns are Boltguns. Stormbolters are NOT Boltguns.

I know that, I was just pointing the absurdity of Dark Eldar being Eldar.

They are two different things.

No they're not.

Eldar are Eldar are Eldar.



The fact they did not say "This ability only effects units from Codex: Eldar" when they did just that for every other ability in every other codex suggests they wanted the Avatar to buff Dark Eldar too.

It doesn't even say "friendly eldar units become fearless", so it even works on enemy Eldar.