Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello, all.

I'm certainly not a WAAC player. I've only played a dozen or so friendly games at home with my wife's brother. Although I'm not a WAAC player, I don't necessarily enjoy getting atomized without at least giving some competition.

So, on to my question. Do I HAVE to take vehicles w/o expecting to be crushed? I run Blood Angels, Chaos Space Marines, starting up Vanilla Marines, and still deciding on what Xenos I want to run (thinking Dark Eldar or Tyranids).

I just don't enjoy anything about vehicles. I hate the price, I hate putting them together, I hate painting them, and I don't find the idea of loading my plastic dudesmen in a tank so they can survive long enough to drive down the table fun.

Thoughts? Can I still give a little competition w/o any vehicles, or should I just drink the kool-aid and drop the dough for some rhinos?

As a side note, I do have a Rhino for my Khorne Berzerkers (but only because it came in the box set the wifey gave me for my bday).

http://www.megahobby.com/citypoliceplaysetbaggedbybmc.aspx?gclid=CLm_vqO-_LECFYUWMgodP34AEw

There's a little apc in there that's sorta rhino like. Allot cheaper and no construction time. Spray paint it red and detail.

Most armies give you an option to use almost no vehicles and still be plenty competitive. Not all armies give you the chance to play with literally no vehicles and still come out ahead.

Basically, you need to have good infantry-based support options in order to not bring any vehicles. Vanilla marines are fine, for example, because they have devestators, and blood angels can DoA without drop pods just fine. Horde armies just got a lot tougher to run completely vehicle free, however, and old codices like tau and eldar are likewise somewhat limited.

If you don't want vehicles then don't play DE, they need them to survive.

Actually I don't think the DE vehicles bother me. They remind me of cyberpunk or something... maybe I just hate tanks? I dunno...

Saw a a 1750 pts game today, SM guy had a single storm talon.

He won vs the necrons.

Edit: On the other hand, Mech IG crushed Mechdars.

I'm starting up an Eldar force (I was going to do an all foot Dark Eldar force, but changed my mind) for the challenge.

It will be all-foot. No vehicles.

I ran an all foot CSM force and wiped the table with them.

The advantage is you will end up with extra wounds for an enemy to take out. The disadvantage is you will be under pressure to move forward early to take objectives.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Shredder wrote:
If you don't want vehicles then don't play DE, they need them to survive.

Admittedly the vehicle based DE is primary and probably the best but you can do on-foot. Just I would recommend 3 haemonculi with 3 WWP.

Orks do fine vehicle-less, as do daemons and some Eldar builds. Tau can manage without also.

DE really are better off with vehicles, but can be used without (you'll die a lot, and rarely win, but hey..)

SM can do vehicle-less armies, secure in the knowledge that their amrour will turn most guns with ease. Vehicles do help though.

 Thorn678 wrote:
I run Blood Angels... ...should I just drink the kool-aid and drop the dough for some rhinos?

Shouldn't they all be wearing jump-packs?

I feel your pain....

I hate assembling and painting tanks too. Every single BA infantry model in my 7000+ points collection is fully painted. Out of my 7 tanks.......5 are still only basecoated red!

I rarely use tanks in my BA forces, maybe a Baal Pred for extra firepower or a LR to protect a nasty CC unit but most of the time I footslog.

Same with 'Nids (obviously) and my Tau.

My Nids don't run a single vehicle.

 -Loki- wrote:
My Nids don't run a single vehicle.

Makes me sad.

Vehicles have a place in a 40k army - from the tactical point of view:
Moving units towards an objective or into the enemy deployment zone,
protecting embarked shooty units from being shot,
bringing units into the thickest melee,
maneuvering with the awesome flyers.

I think you are looking at tanks the wrong way (at least where your Chaos is concerned) Being Chaos, your tanks give you a LOT of room for conversion and creativity.

You can turn your Chaos Rhino's into an amazing centerpiece for your army. (when I finish mine I can post them as an example)

Vehicales are not always required. They just offer really thick armor and big guns along side your more numerous infantry.

Its possible to win with just infantry but bring plenty of Anti armor weapons should you face armor (and run as fast as you can get into range the big guns often carry long ranges)

Yeah Dark Eldar don't use tanks they use ships and planes~

But I think to be competitive you have to have at least some vehicles, footslogging is just slow...

Maybe some armies might work with foot slogging but I doubt that's going to be the majority of the competitive lists.

You don't need vehicles for most of the armies you listed (with the exception of Dark Eldar) and can generally do alright without them. Your Marines will probably do better by driving up in Rhinos and Land Raiders, but you can do alright without them. They're not required, but the mobility and survivability they grant is really helpful.

I'm not a fan of the METAL BAWKSES of the Space Marines. The Eldar/Dark Eldar ships though, are a thing of beauty. From the Dark Eldar perspective, try the Jet Bikes. Very elegant and deadly and they look good to boot. They're fast and they support both Anti-Tank (heat lances) and Anti-Infantry (turbo-boost bladevaining). On the Eldar side, Jet Bikes are scoring too!

DE need vehicles because they simply don't have the mobility or durability to operate as needed without them, though as noted DE vehicles also have a much different visual than the boxy SM vehicles so lots of them don't look quite as boring.

That said, other armies can manage largely fine without them, especially in 6th where vehicles and tanks die faster and easier than they ever have in any other edition and have less ability to impact the win conditions than ever. Many Space Marine armies in particular can do well without them, or with at most a few Drop Pods.

 Thorn678 wrote:
I run Blood Angels.

A little party of Death Company (with that crazy character that lets them reroll missed hits and failed wounds, I forget the name) in a Stormraven Gunship is so ridiculously good that my friend painted his Stormraven black with a large red cross on it.
Other than that, he doesn't use any vehicles and is quite competetive.

You don't need vehicles unless you're playing DE, otherwise you can play and win easily without vehicles.

Transport spam was dumb in 5th, and still is in 6th.

No you don't. but they do help a lot.

Also DE without vehicles really doesn't work.

Grey Knight Paladins, Deathwing, DoA Blood Angels, various biker armies (ofc), Orks (Green Tide + Loota Fire Support), Wraithguard, IG Infantry Horde can all be competitive at least in casual games without using vehicles.

Do you dislike walkers?

CSMs do not need Rhinos in 6th Ed.. Unlike in 5th, when they were a requirement if you even wanted to see turn 4.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
PS- Rhinos hinder 'zerkers. They need a Land Raider.

For all of you saying Dark Eldar NEED vehicles - this is wrong.

walk 30 Grotesques and 60 Wracks across the table, with a whole ton of Scourges and / or Reavers for heavy fire support.

Or 150 Warriors (6x20 Kabalite + 3x10 Trueborn) with the afforementioned Scourges / Reavers. and/or Beastpacks.

I'm fairly sure that 120 Wyches (90 Wyches + 30 Blood Brides) would be fairly scary. (though I don't tend to use wyches myself)

If you REALLY want, you can have enough bodies on the floor to scare the pants off most opponents, and you can still take a large number of lances / blasters.

I'm currently working towards maxed-out Grotesque/Wrack and Warrior foot lists, and while it won't be as quick as mech DE, it'll certainly be different, interesting, and hopefully scary as hell.

 Purifier wrote:

A little party of Death Company (with that crazy character that lets them reroll missed hits and failed wounds, I forget the name) in a Stormraven Gunship is so ridiculously good that my friend painted his Stormraven black with a large red cross on it.
Other than that, he doesn't use any vehicles and is quite competetive.

That just sounds like a lot of expensive eggs in one flying basket.

Yeah, walk 120 Wyches across the table with their t3 and 6+ save. The only reason Orks can get away with that is that they are t4 and 60% the price of a Wych.

 Amaya wrote:
Yeah, walk 120 Wyches across the table with their t3 and 6+ save. The only reason Orks can get away with that is that they are t4 and 60% the price of a Wych.

And KFF.

Simple solution, if you hate the price, sell your minis and play solitaire, its nice and cheap.

Who would buy 60 wracks?

Oh, I forgot, other people actually have money. -.-