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http://www.frontlinegaming.org/2012/10/09/chaos-double-header-1750/

In this bat rep, we bust out the new Chaos against Tau and against another Chaos army! Frankie is trying out his Epidemus list and you can see the huge difference in effectiveness vs. shooty Mech list (Tau) and an infantry based melee army (Khorne Chaos). Enjoy!

Good reports, if a bit quick.

It's worth noting that a Daemon of Khorne does not have the Mark of Khorne and so can't take the Axe of Blinding Fury.

Awesome reports there Reece. Man Frankie had a super bad match up against that Tau it was way too much shooting. Once the Obliterators were knocked out that was pretty much it since he can just zip around the board shooting at will. The second match up was clearly better however I think your list didnt have all that much long range support which would be needed against Frankie's list. All in all it seems like Frankie's list is just going to be one of those lists where you either win big or youre going to get smoked based on the match ups. So is the BAO going to 1750? If so I need to start preparing for that.

Great batreps! Yeah, the Tau can shoot ya to death!

Damn Chaos must be a difficult army to play. I've only seen them lose. The only time I saw them win was a Chaos vs. Chaos game

Don't be down on pure Khorne, they are really really good.

If you want to stick with a theme, you can mark any unit now. khorme marked Raptors with the Icon of Wrath with a Blind Fury lord attached is scary as hell. Kharn is fantastic. With forgeworld, you have access to Blood Slaughters which have 2 + D3 additional attacks on the charge.

As far as Deamon Princes go, take the Black Mace. You are a monstrous creature, so the Mace becomes AP2. I ran that at a local tournament, would crush whatever challenge I was in, then watch the unit start melting to toughness tests.

In the second game, how was that Nurgle unit able to ignore armor saves in close combat?

That seems incredibly over-powered unless their initiative is low or they are a very expensive unit.

 DeathwingCrusader wrote:
In the second game, how was that Nurgle unit able to ignore armor saves in close combat?

That seems incredibly over-powered unless their initiative is low or they are a very expensive unit.

It's Epedimius' Nurgle Tally that once he has a certain number of kills anything with the Mark Of Nurgle will get that plus some other abilities.

Hey guys, sorry I didn't respond sooner, been stupid busy.

Yeah, Khorne can work, that was just a super bad match-up. Kharn is a beast!

What are you guys thinking on Berzerkers? I am not loving them much. Raptors are pretty boss, and taking a unit of 15 with a Character is brutal. I would certainly use that.

@Deathwing

Yeah, it is bananas if the tally gets up against a infantry based army.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And yes, the BAO will for sure be at 1750pts

Very nice stuff..

Raptors are super tasty as far as points go.

If you want my advice, if you're even *considering* raptors in the first place... You'd be silly not to take advantage of their low points. Keep them cheap, and they will do what you design them to. They can still take double special weapons at 5man so consider that before upping their numbers.

If you do run 15 or so, keep them cheap and consider Nurgle with Meltas. Durable and able to provide a Scalpel role for your army while remaining cheap. T5 means that you dont have to feel like you wasted them in combat, should you be charged or decide to charge.

As for the zerkers it comes down to whether the 4 pt/model gap is worth +1 WS, Fearless, and Furious Charge.

I'm also convinced that without some sort of movement bonus or delivery system a solely assault unit isnt worth its points.

@Brometheus

I agree. I was thinking MoS or no mark, with a Nurgle Lord as I think that would be most points efficient.

Plus, the new models are gorgeous! I really want to paint some up for my Night Lords.

@Tarrasq

I agree. Point for point, the Zerker does give you more hitting power. We did the math on it and they are very slightly superior in combat to Chosen or CSM with MoK.

However, they are pricey, I would rather have bolters and more bodies.

And totally agreed, without a Land Raider, they struggle. And with a Land Raider they now have a big price tag for a unit that really doesn't hit that hard.

Reece, the benefit of the Berzerkers (or any cult unit) is Fearless. That is the best rule hands down, especially with 6th edition removing the negatives like extra wounds from combat res.

Chaos Marines always seem to either break or get swept at the worst possible time, and that Fearless character can't be in every squad at once.

And actually, I really think the Noise Marines are some of the winners in this edition. They are really cheap for i5 Fearless marines, and get a sweet doom siren. The i5 used to be a big boon for Berzerkers on the charge, but 6th ed took that away, so I really think Noise Marines are where its at, especially to someone like me who's never had special weapons in my troop squads anyway (World Eaters FOR LIFE!).

So I'd still run Berzerkers over CSM's anyway, I'll just be upset that they aren't A2 anymore.

Just to answer your question about the Warlord traits, no your Prince cannot be the Warlord and roll.

BRB pg. 111 says the Warlord is always the model with the highest LD. Kharn is a 10, the Daemon Prince is only a 9.

I'm actually thinking of doing a Nurgle-Epidemius CSM army kind of like Frankie's. You know what I think is a good value? CSM troops with the Mark of Nurgle. Thats T5 troops for only 16pts. You can then add a Nurgle Lord on Palaquin or better yet, Typhus, to make that a respectable foot-slogging unit screened by some zombie cultists.

@Whitedragon

Yeah, they are fearless and they are point for point more efficient in combat by a small margin than either Chosen or CSM's with MoK.

They're just too expensive for what you get, IMO. They simply lack either the punch or mobility that other comparably priced assault units give you.

@Emp.

Yes, you are correct, thanks. I was just assuming a DP was still a 10.

@Jy2

I agree, and if you are using the units as a shooting unit, then great. My only issue with them is that they aren't Fearless and if they lose an assault, they're likely to get run down.

That's why I am leaning towards Cultsits as troops. Little 5 man units for 50 points. Then, take a few aggressive scoring units that are fearless either by being cult troops or because of an attached Lord, and use them to go and take objectives.

I think if you are sticking with pure Khorne, you have to do "first wave"/"second wave" with them, and constantly threat assaults. A jump Chaos Lord with the Blind Fury Axe in a unit of 15 Raptors (to get the sacred number of course) going balls out after some boots on the ground is a terrifying thing. Let the Raptor sergent take issue the challenge and let the Lord butcher whole units.

For Beserkers, I would honestly run a unit with Kharn in a Land Raider, or take units of 16 on foot.

This codex did throw away the old notions of playing god specific, means you have to play this particular way. Havocs exist and can be marked. Oblits exist and can be mark, granted some are better then others, but you can build a balanced list and still fit a theme. My rule is if I am building "god specific" that I either take that mark or no mark. Some units it isn't beneficial, but that does allow me to maintain theme without wasting points on needless upgrades.

Cultists as cheap back field scorers and cult or csm troops out front is how I think the codex is designed. Mix in decent ranged and credible assault threats, and you have an army that covers the bases.

I think you are right. I don't trap myself into a theme at the loss of playability. For example, giving MoK to Havocs, like you pointed out, would be silly.

I agree that you do need waves. Mono Khorne is viable I think, just can't be done relying on Zerkers completely.

I think Spawn, Raptors, Bikers, and Cultists are what you need. Kharn in a unit of 35 Cultists is no joke. Like you pointed out, let their Champion make, accept challenges and Kharn does his thing. plus, it's a big scoring unit that will tar-pit the hell out of things and soak wounds.

The issue I am having with this book though, is that most of the good builds I am seeing (or at least that look good so far) have few to no actual Chaos Space Marines! Haha

Which is funny because my buddy leant me his Codex and I was tinkering around with a list and it actually does not have ANY Chaos Space Marines which is pretty sad...

 Reecius wrote:

The issue I am having with this book though, is that most of the good builds I am seeing (or at least that look good so far) have few to no actual Chaos Space Marines! Haha

QFT man.

Very enjoyable report. Haven't played Tau with my CSM's yet so you've given me something to think about.

 Reecius wrote:
I think you are right. I don't trap myself into a theme at the loss of playability. For example, giving MoK to Havocs, like you pointed out, would be silly.

I agree that you do need waves. Mono Khorne is viable I think, just can't be done relying on Zerkers completely.

I think Spawn, Raptors, Bikers, and Cultists are what you need. Kharn in a unit of 35 Cultists is no joke. Like you pointed out, let their Champion make, accept challenges and Kharn does his thing. plus, it's a big scoring unit that will tar-pit the hell out of things and soak wounds.

The issue I am having with this book though, is that most of the good builds I am seeing (or at least that look good so far) have few to no actual Chaos Space Marines! Haha

Ain't that the truth. For my 1500 my list has 8 Chaos Terminators and then 7 Chaos Bikes and a Chaos Lord. The rest is cultists and a bunch of other stuff that isn't exactly Chaos Space Marines. I like it though, since I used to play the old "Lost and the Damned" lists.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Just run with a Lost and the Damned style army.

Yeah, so did I. I always try to keep my Daemons deployed in units that match each CG's sacred number. Doesn't always work that way, but I do my best.

Yeah, I try to hit the sacred number too, if I can, but it doesn't always work out, particularly with Tzeentch units! haha