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2013/05/01 18:54:06
Subject: Battlefoam threatens legal action (C&D) against Blood of Kittens,BoK filed for declaratory judgement
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Badass "Sister Sin"
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http://bloodofkittens.com/blog/2013/05/01/network-news-battlefoam-v-blood-kittens/ , and Mr. Hayden filed for declaratory Tastytaste wrote:This is the official announcement by Blood of Kittens that Battlefoam LLC has taken legal action against this site over a post made in March.
Everything in that post I believe is true, gathered from sources and material available from the Internet, and since being threatened with legal action, I have done subsequent research and gotten sworn statements from witnesses that further prove its truth. For the time being, while certain aspects of the case are pending, the original post in question has been taken down.
However, it will be back up as soon as possible, and in no way should the fact that I took it down be viewed as an admission of any wrong doing. I took it down to try and facilitate a constructive dialogue with the party who made the legal threat, Romeo Filip of Battlefoam. It has not seemed to help, but I don’t want it to be said that I did not try everything in my power to maintain the high ground. Romeo and Battlefoam seem to insist upon forcing me to prove my statements were true, in a court of law. Once I do, not only will I put the article back up, but I will put the judgment there too, as the ultimate proof of the truth of my statements.
To better understand what is going on here is Battlefoam’s original C&D and my legal response to it.
Battlefoam C&D Full
Blood of Kittens Battlefoam Response
These documents are matter of public record and because lawyers are now involved, I cannot go into as much detail as I would like, but let these documents reflect exactly what this case is about.
Blood of Kittens takes its ability to present hard hitting news and information very importantly, and this site will continue to do so for as long as possible.
I was lucky enough to procure a pro-bono defense, but that didn’t stop me from incurring a sizable amount of legal costs. The money I would normally use for the hosting Blood of Kittens has been effected. In order for Blood of Kittens to operate I have to do something I thought I would never need to do, and ask the community for help with donations.
In light of a completely unrelated site take downs, I think it is essential, more than ever, to keep on doing what this site does, be it rumors, news, or blunt commentary about all aspects within our community. So, if you like to support that continuation please donate whatever you can, I don’t expect the donations to reach the level to pay back the money I have invested, but anything will help.
Your Donation Amount:
Your total amount is : 0.00 (Currency: USD)
If by some miracle I get donations exceeding the funds lost, the overage will go to the organization that made it possible for me to get the amazing lawyers defending the site today.
The Online Media Legal Network.
OMLN provides an invaluable legal referral service, with their main goal to find pro-bono or reduce rate lawyers to defend online journalists and bloggers. So, if you don’t like Blood of Kittens at least consider donating to them, because defending journalism and freedom of speech is something everyone can get behind.
Discussion is limited to the specifics of pending litigation, and check your emotional baggage at the door. Slinging mud at specific individuals based on nothing but heresay will result in action
Remember the rules and stick to them people. MT11   
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/02 02:18:36
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2013/05/01 18:56:12
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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[ARTICLE MOD]
Fixture of Dakka
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Nice. Good to see GW's industry leading practices are making their way through the rest of the hobby.
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2013/05/01 18:58:09
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Badass "Sister Sin"
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 Redbeard wrote:Nice. Good to see GW's industry leading practices are making their way through the rest of the hobby.
Hasn't BF been sue happy well before the recent spat of GW legal fun?
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2013/05/01 18:58:38
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Legendary Master of the Chapter
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What was the original post about?
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 Unit1126PLL wrote: Scott-S6 wrote:And yet another thread is hijacked for Unit to ask for the same advice, receive the same answers and make the same excuses.
Oh my god I'm becoming martel.
Send help!
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2013/05/01 18:58:43
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Old Sourpuss
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Anyone got a copy of the post in question? Edit: The C&D from Battle Foam's attorney may have it. Edit: While he said it to me at AdeptiCon, it's nice to see "official" and "legal" documents saying that he owns Outlaw Miniatures 
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/01 19:01:38
DR:80+S++G+M+B+I+Pwmhd11#++D++A++++/sWD-R++++T(S)DM+
 
Ask me about Brushfire or Endless: Fantasy Tactics |
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2013/05/01 18:59:32
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Fixture of Dakka
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So this is a slander case? This should be fun for the armchair lawyers to talk about.
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My Models:  Ork Army: Waaagh 'Az-ard -  Chibi Dungeon RPG Models! -  My Workblog!
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
RULE OF COOL: When converting models, there is only one rule: "The better your model looks, the less people will complain about it."
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
MODELING FOR ADVANTAGE TEST: rigeld2: "Easy test - are you willing to play the model as a stock one? No? MFA." |
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2013/05/01 19:00:26
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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what was the post about that made battlefoam grumpy? Was it just general anti battlefoam postings?
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DT:80S+++G+++M+B++I+Pw40k00+D++A(WTF)/areWD100R+++++T(T)DM+ |
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2013/05/01 19:01:24
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Badass "Sister Sin"
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Someone could use a web archive to look at this page:
http://bloodofkittens.com/blog/2013/03/07/meat-meta-bad-battlefoam-practices/
It has since been pulled down and archivers are blocked for me at work.
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2013/05/01 19:07:49
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle
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Mh... the title is wrong..... Blood Of Kittens has sue Battlefoam, not the other way.
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2013/05/01 19:09:35
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Mohoc wrote:Mh... the title is wrong..... Blood Of Kittens has sue Battlefoam, not the other way.
? I don't think you're reading it correctly. "Battlefoam LLC has taken legal action against this site over a post made in March" and "I was lucky enough to procure a pro-bono defense" among other things.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/01 19:10:44
DA:70S+G+M+B++I++Pw40k08+D++A++/fWD-R+T(M)DM+
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2013/05/01 19:10:47
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut
Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S
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The article in question has been taken down, does anybody know of the contents of the pulled article?
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Fatum Iustum Stultorum
Fiat justitia ruat caelum
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2013/05/01 19:12:54
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Badass "Sister Sin"
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 BrookM wrote:The article in question has been taken down, does anybody know of the contents of the pulled article?
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2013/05/01 19:13:04
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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nkelsch wrote:So this is a slander case? This should be fun for the armchair lawyers to talk about.
Not really. From what I understand it is a pretty darn cut and dry situation. Defamation is going to be very hard to prove in this case, and I expect that it will get tossed pre-trial with little fuss. True statements are true, and the First Amendment is pretty powerful in the US.
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Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
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2013/05/01 19:13:05
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Sword-Bearing Inquisitorial Crusader
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Redbeard wrote:Nice. Good to see GW's industry leading practices are making their way through the rest of the hobby.
This hardly seems the same.
If it is true that BoK posted articles in such a manner as described, then he had it coming. It's one thing to not like a business, and another to publically lie about them. That said, if the claims provided by battlefoam are false, why take down the article if he intended to fight it anyways?
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2013/05/01 19:13:31
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle
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 kronk wrote:Mohoc wrote:Mh... the title is wrong..... Blood Of Kittens has sue Battlefoam, not the other way.
? I don't think you're reading it correctly.
"Battlefoam LLC has taken legal action against this site over a post made in March" and "I was lucky enough to procure a pro-bono defense" among other things.
No, I am not reading it wrong. TastyTaste got a C&D letter from Battle Foam and turned around and filed a lawsuit against them.
Here is the C&D:
http://bloodofkittens.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Battlefoam-CD-Full.pdf
Here is the lawsuit TastyTaste filed:
http://bloodofkittens.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Blood-of-Kittens-Battlefoam-Response.pdf
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2013/05/01 19:16:38
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Badass "Sister Sin"
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Looks like the original post is not in Google Cache or Wayback.
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2013/05/01 19:21:57
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut
Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S
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Exactly.
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Fatum Iustum Stultorum
Fiat justitia ruat caelum
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2013/05/01 19:23:01
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Rogue Daemonhunter fueled by Chaos
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Mohoc is actually right. While Battle Foam threatened legal action, BoK actually filed the complaint.
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2013/05/01 19:23:14
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Fixture of Dakka
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I remember seeing the article during the Outlaw Miniatures Kickstarter, everything in it seemed true.
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2013/05/01 19:26:19
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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 Cyporiean wrote:I remember seeing the article during the Outlaw Miniatures Kickstarter, everything in it seemed true.
Can't anyone paraphrase what it said? There seems to be no way to currently see the original article.
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Las Vegas Open Head Judge
I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings or pride, but your credentials matter. Even on the internet.
"If you do not have the knowledge, you do not have the right to the opinion." -Plato
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2013/05/01 19:26:20
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Badass "Sister Sin"
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Finding tidbits:
"Then you have the case of Romeo promising a lifetime discount for anyone tattooing Battlefoam on their body. Well one sad individual did such a thing and Romeo denied ever making the offer. So, with email trail in hand the tattooed man got into a haggling argument over the percentage of the discount, with I think a final agreement settling at 30% off."
“BE WARNED. Outlaw Minatures is actually Battlefoam. Be warned in case if you were buying into their Kickstarter. ”
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/01 19:31:08
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2013/05/01 19:28:15
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Ruthless Rafkin
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Those two deserve each other.
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-Loki- wrote:
40k is about slamming two slegdehammers together and hoping the other breaks first. Malifaux is about fighting with scalpels trying to hit select areas and hoping you connect more. |
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2013/05/01 19:28:37
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Grumpy Longbeard
New York
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While I'm no big fan of legal bullying, it's hard to feel sympathy for TastyTaste with all of the gak-slinging that he does on his site. Perhaps he'll learn a valuable lesson about inventing controversy.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/01 19:29:25
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2013/05/01 19:29:20
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Stubborn Hammerer
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weeble1000 wrote:nkelsch wrote:So this is a slander case? This should be fun for the armchair lawyers to talk about.
Not really. From what I understand it is a pretty darn cut and dry situation. Defamation is going to be very hard to prove in this case, and I expect that it will get tossed pre-trial with little fuss. True statements are true, and the First Amendment is pretty powerful in the US.
Romeo does a great job of Defamation on himself, met this dude at Empire Games plenty of times.
Walking DB syndrome.
Throws lawsuits at everyone, Karma will catch up to him sometime just wait. His rip off gaming store "saloon" is a joke.
booo
But thats enough out of me, he might try to sue me too.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/01 19:31:21
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2013/05/01 19:31:34
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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 Polonius wrote: Mohoc is actually right. While Battle Foam threatened legal action, BoK actually filed the complaint.
Yea, but it is a DJ action. Battlefoam threatened legal action, and Mr. Hayden filed for declaratory judgment, which I suspect will be granted. It is a put-up-or-shut-up sort of thing. You threaten to sue me, I go to the court and say that you have no basis to file a lawsuit against me. If the Court finds that you don't, you can't follow through on your threat. It may be technically true that Mr. Hayden filed the complaint, but it is an entirely appropriate response to Battlefoam's Cease and Desist letter, which threatened legal action. You can't threaten a lawsuit without having a legitimate basis to do so. That's why sending out a bunch of C&D letters is not always a good idea...
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/01 19:33:46
Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
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2013/05/01 19:31:41
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Zealous Sin-Eater
Chico, CA
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Polonius wrote:
Mohoc is actually right. While Battle Foam threatened legal action, BoK actually filed the complaint.
If you lived in CA would you want to fight it in AZ. He just making sure the fight is were he lives.
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Peter: As we all know, Christmas is that mystical time of year when the ghost of Jesus rises from the grave to feast on the flesh of the living! So we all sing Christmas Carols to lull him back to sleep.
Bob: Outrageous, How dare he say such blasphemy. I've got to do something.
Man #1: Bob, there's nothing you can do.
Bob: Well, I guess I'll just have to develop a sense of humor. |
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2013/05/01 19:35:49
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Myrmidon Officer
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Wow, hot on the tails of the recent GW C&D on blogs comes the most recent Romeo Rage.
I wonder if he threatened to physically beat up the Blood of Kittens owner like he did during the Infinity Podcast Romeo Rage incident.
Does anyone else remember when he sent something along the lines of a C&D to Sabol warning them that even though they pretty much founded the miniatures foam idea, that they shouldn't copy the Battlefoams?
Romeo is scum yet his rages are entertaining. It's disappointing that people actually get harmed in the process.
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2013/05/01 19:36:54
Subject: Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Noir wrote: Polonius wrote:
Mohoc is actually right. While Battle Foam threatened legal action, BoK actually filed the complaint.
If you lived in CA would you want to fight it in AZ. He just making sure the fight is were he lives.
That is an excellent point.
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Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."
AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
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2013/05/01 19:37:53
Subject: Re:Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Joined the Military for Authentic Experience
On an Express Elevator to Hell!!
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Was going to mention the Infinity business before. At this risk of getting sued (or beaten up), I'll just say that I don't think this guy helps to sell his products..
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2013/05/01 19:40:35
Subject: Re:Battlefoam sues Blood of Kittens
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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 Pacific wrote:Was going to mention the Infinity business before. At this risk of getting sued (or beaten up), I'll just say that I don't think this guy helps to sell his products..
Which is too bad because I actually like his products a lot.
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Las Vegas Open Head Judge
I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings or pride, but your credentials matter. Even on the internet.
"If you do not have the knowledge, you do not have the right to the opinion." -Plato
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