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wanted to try Vaul's DCanons, despite the huge cost for just 4 wounds.

Was going to hide them behind waveserpents and use the transport as a mini los blocking tool.

But of course I got a tyranid horde player.

Don't think I will take Vaul's DCanons again

To be fair, I rolled a heck of a game and he did not.

After his hive tyrant and 5 of his 7 guard made it into combat, the banshees with the aid of a warlock and autarch killed all but 2 of the tyrant guard. He finally smited the last banshee and slaughtered the warlock and the autarch fled with 1 wound.

On my last turn I toasted 2 of the guard, the hive tyrant, 22 or so termagaunts, and the big monster that regens 10 termaguants a round. My fusion guns, and EML plus smite finally pulled them all down, then everything ran into the 22 guants and killed 9 and with no hive node another 10 fled.

After a full game of on my heels, the elder had a great round and almost cleared the board!

The Banshees had a good show with fortune. Normally I would save that for the WW but the only thing that wore me down was the Exocrine and the mortal wounds from the 3 biovores.
The genestealers were rough and the ripperswarms, but the swooping hawks made a nice sacrifice to rip a big whole. Only the Genestealer Brood Leader was a pain.

The Dark Reapers were made to kill the 8 man Tyranid warrior squad.
this is the first game that my War Walkers did not kill their points.

Again the Wave Serpents were champ and 1 finally died on his last turn.

Even though the Fusion Guns were a game winner, I think I will stick with the WraithGuard. I Will also eliminate the War Walkers and go with 2 more Wave Serpents.

Now to get some storm guardians and fusion guns painted.
What else is good in the Serpents?
Wraithguard, banshees, storm guardians, and?

 admironheart wrote:
What else is good in the Serpents?
Wraithguard, banshees, storm guardians, and?

Guardian Defenders are pretty good. 80 Points for a squad that can jump out at close range to put out 20 shots (should get at least 2 6s on the wound rolls) or grab an objective late game.

Dragons are good but not really necessary if you are taking Wraithguard.
Dark Reapers are good if you start off in the Serpent for Turn 1 protection. They always hit on 3s, even if they move which is handy.

The unit with the 8 storm guardians has a 3 unit reaper squad with a shuriken cannon for the exarch and that still leaves room for a warlock

Finding that its important to take at least 2 warlocks so you have ample coverage for deny the witch rolls

 admironheart wrote:


After his hive tyrant and 5 of his 7 guard made it into combat, the banshees with the aid of a warlock and autarch killed all but 2 of the tyrant guard. He finally smited the last banshee and slaughtered the warlock and the autarch fled with 1 wound.

Why did the autarch run?

Wraithguard, banshees, storm guardians, and?

Wraithblades with swords. Cutting bloody path through peasants the easy way.

xmbk wrote:

 admironheart wrote:


After his hive tyrant and 5 of his 7 guard made it into combat, the banshees with the aid of a warlock and autarch killed all but 2 of the tyrant guard. He finally smited the last banshee and slaughtered the warlock and the autarch fled with 1 wound.

Why did the autarch run?

I'm going to guess he fell back, so he wouldn't surrender Warlord, and let his army mop up the guard with shooting.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Did a tournament today, we had a Dark Eldar player, a Ynarri player using Craftworld Wraiths, and my regular Craftworld Eldar.

Due to a systematic problem of pure gak dice, I got waxed the first two games. When they finally started rolling like average, I tabled my third opponent in 4 rounds (Death Guard).

The Ynarri player was running 3 flamer Guard in Serpents, a Wraith Knight, Eldrad and an Autarch. He went 1 - 2 as well, being paired up against 2 knight armies, and just getting waxed both times.

The Dark Eldar player though, had a good mix of Harlequins in there, and he cleaned house. 3 for 3, and took second.

The all Wraith army didn't impress me to much. I felt my list would have dealt with it very easily. Granted, his pairings sucked. He ended up against 4 knights in game 2, and got tabled. Game 3, he fought 3 Knights and Magnus, and again got tabled.

I didn't get a good look at the Dark Eldar list, but he crushed a Knight army, a Tempestus Scion with Calgar army, and punted a tank heavy Tau army.

I had the Scion army in round one, and even with horrible rolling, I managed to crush half of his army, but in the end it just wasn't enough to hold onto the necessary objectives. Round 2 I got the Knight/Magnus army. Tabled in 3... Round 3 I addressed above.

Storm Guardians are considered good now??

 Kouzuki wrote:
Storm Guardians are considered good now??

I like them for a cheap unit of troops + fusion guns x2 Normally the enemy is too busy shooting the good units and you can leave the 2 fusion guns to die last so your bound to get 2 rounds of shooting out of them. So far the unit has killed its points everytime.

My new list:

As much as I love my 3 warwalkers, the last battle vs the nids I could not take any objectives til the last turn just to stay alive from the swarm. My Reapers killed way over their points but I had to change my whole plan to keep them and the walkers alive.

So I think the Eldar will have to stay with the quick mobile force we are supposed to be.

Battalion
HQ Autarch w/Warp Jump +FusionPistol+ WebofSkulls (AvengerCatapult/PowerSword)
HQ Warlock Singing Spear +Enhance/Drain
T 1 Exarch + DireSword, 4 Dire Avengers
T 10 Defender Guardians + Shuriken Canon Support Platform
T 9 Storm Guardians +3 Chainswords
Hvy 1 Exarch +Shuriken Canon, 2 Dark Reapers w'Reaper Launchers
Trans Wave Serpent Twin Linked EML +Shuriken Canon + Spirit Stones
Trans Wave Serpent Twin Linked EML +Shuriken Canon + Spirit Stones
Trans Wave Serpent Twin Linked Shuriken Cannons +Shuriken Canon + Spirit Stones +SuperCharged
Trans Wave Serpent Twin Linked ScatterLasers +Shuriken Canon + CTM
Trans Wave Serpent Twin Linked BrightLances +Shuriken Canon + Spirit Stones

Command
HQ 1 Farseer with Witch Blade + Doom +Fortune
HQ 1 Warlock with Witch Blade +Enhance/Drain
HQ 1 Warlock with Witch Blade + Conceal/Reveal

Vanguard
HQ 1 SpiritSeer with Witch Staff Conceal/Reveal
E 5 WraithGuard with WraithCanons
E 1 Exarch and 6 Howling Banshees with PowerSwords
E 1 Exarch + FirePike and 4 Fire Dragons with Fusion Guns


8 CP and 2000 points

I wanted to take the WraithBlades and the Storm Guardians with Fusion Guns. I could not fit them into a battalion or I could not fit all the units into the 5 WS.
I did not want to take the Dire Avengers, but troop choices to squeeze into a Battalion and the Wave Serpents are limited.

Interesting list. Definitely making the most of the 12 man transport capacity of the wave serpents.

I'd go another guardian defender squad over the dire avengers. Even without a heavy weapon platform if needed.

And yes would be worth finding points for the fusion guns on the storm guardians. Can you drop the wraithguard to wraithboades Judy with the swords? That's a bit cheaper at least. Also can you find points for a tempest launcher on your dark reaper exarch. The shuri cannon seems the weakest of 3 weapon options and he is really good with the other 2.

I'd consider downgrading some wave serpent configs to save some points. Twin cannons is on par with twin scatter laser statistically (or close enough) and will save you 10 points as you don't need ctm. I'd try get ctm on all the 2 shot heavy weapons. Hitting on 3s is bad enough, 4s is hardly worth it imo. Maybe downgrade one of the aml to shuriken cannons. You have access to doom so cannons are surprisingly effective against big targets en masse. Or trim some of the extras from them. The extra vehicle upgrades are good but the tanks are pretty survivable on their own. The spirit stones and extras is an extra squad of dudes almost.

That could give you enough points to optimise the squads a bit.

Hey guys. I looked arround to catch up my 2k Army.
Now Iam at the last Point. Flyer !
Iam not sure about the Type of a Flyer.
At the Last few Sites the diskuss betwenn the Hunter and the Hemlock.
The Hemlock is the Winner but whats about the Phoenix and the Nightwing? Points are a bit Different but in the same scale .
So whats about them ?
So far the rules of the Phoenix:
http://pro.bols.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/eldar-phoenix.jpg

They are all good and better per point than prisms, spinners, falcons, war walkers, vypers and so on.
Nightwing for 145 pts brings 2 lances and 2 shuriken cannons - with 5++ or 2+ BS against land units I think it's a bargain. The closest contender is wave serpent with twin bright lance and shuriken cannon at 159 points. For example, for a Vyper to come even close just by carrying same armament it must be 40 points per model, not how it's now (and it would still be worse due to being more fragile and not having Matrix).
Phoenix packs all that and better, more wounds, and also a swarm of D2 damage missiles - that's around 1.5 star cannons or something similar for a marginal points increase.
Crimson Hunter is basically las predator but better. Take it as if you would take one.
Hemlock is just good although most interesting when you have units it can cover with Conceal. But even solo or in groups it's great unit.

So really, pick anything you have points for - 8th edition is about flyers, partially at least.

 Kouzuki wrote:
Storm Guardians are considered good now??

no, not really. they suck.

There's no way we can toss Reapers in an open topped transport is there? I suppose 48" and -1 to hit is a pretty good defense but I feel like they're going to get vaporized so fast after turn 1.

Even so, having a large squad of them shooting twice (word of the Phoenix) isn't the worst thing

 luke1705 wrote:
There's no way we can toss Reapers in an open topped transport is there? I suppose 48" and -1 to hit is a pretty good defense but I feel like they're going to get vaporized so fast after turn 1.

Even so, having a large squad of them shooting twice (word of the Phoenix) isn't the worst thing

Not unless Raiders now say they can transport <Aeldari/Asuryani> infantry.

...no they don't. Tbh I'm surprised that Eldar don't have any open topped transports

EDIT: sadly it looks like even as Ynnari, they don't have any open topped Eldar options

Well, Dragons/Reapers in open-topped transports with -1 to hit and in-built invul would probably outright destroy whole meta, so these restrictions are reasonable.

MY Reapers have survived every game.

I did have to place them in some obscure corner with LOS blocking terrain to cover half the opponents army.

Only a Gene Stealer Brood Lord and an Imperial Fighter ever got close enough to attack them.

You have 48" range for a reason.....make the best use of it!

 admironheart wrote:
MY Reapers have survived every game.

I did have to place them in some obscure corner with LOS blocking terrain to cover half the opponents army.

Only a Gene Stealer Brood Lord and an Imperial Fighter ever got close enough to attack them.

You have 48" range for a reason.....make the best use of it!

Indeed. A canny opponent will do his utmost to get rid of them but by god can they lay the smack down. They are all but custom built to clean up Primaris marines. With Guide and Word of the Pheonix in play, one round of shooting will change a game. Played a game sunday night, took my opponents Intercessors and Hellblasters off the table in turn one.

I am a fan of the Hemlock as well. That thing can be a force of nature if it gets hot Smite rolls.

I have yet to get my Yncarne on the table though, hows it working for you guys?

Question for the Eldar guys here:

From the FAQ:
Q. If a model is equipped with two chainswords, do they get to make 2 extra close combat attacks?
A. Yes (though both must be made with a chainsword)

Does this apply to Wraithblade Ghostswords? The weapon in the Index states: GhostswordS, but the profile states 'THIS' weapon gains an extra attack.

(Meaning 5 attacks each for the Wraithblades in the charge)

No you wont.

If you look into the sword profile each model is equiped with ghostswords, and when you read it, the reference is in plural, so it is already taken into account that you are carrying 2, thus the extra attack compared to the axe.

Cheers. Not played them yet, but having read the FAQ on the Marines, my brain got finkin'....!

good thing to point out though

Wes

The only thing that bothers me about returning to play this edition with my 6 Jes Goodwin designed old school wave serpents is the fact that there are quite a few snob nose comments about the design of the 80's/90's vehicles from epic.

Personally I read that the 1997/8 Falcon/WaveSerpent was stolen from a mid 90's video game design.

I always liked that the old elder titans/vehicles were true alien psycho-plastic constructs. Then came the exhaust vents, plumbing and electrical conduits, etc that made elder vehicles very much like human vehicles just with weird shapes. I LIKE THE ALIEN LOOK of the first dozen years of the hobby.

If someone likes the 'horseshoe' shape tanks go for it. I like my old "iron-style" tanks. There are 20+ players that show up most nites and almost none of them have even a primered army. My force is completely tournament ready painted as that is how I like to play the game with as much 'thematic' feel as possible. A bunch of gray plastics/resin figs look lame compared to painted old metal minis IMO. I think it would be terribly rude/poor sportsmanship to call players out on an unpainted army despite my opinion.
Conversely when I see players 'rag' on the older stuff where 80% of all the lore, units and such were created, I think they are showing their age AND their maturity.


Rant over lol

 admironheart wrote:
good thing to point out though

Wes

The only thing that bothers me about returning to play this edition with my 6 Jes Goodwin designed old school wave serpents is the fact that there are quite a few snob nose comments about the design of the 80's/90's vehicles from epic.

Personally I read that the 1997/8 Falcon/WaveSerpent was stolen from a mid 90's video game design.

I always liked that the old elder titans/vehicles were true alien psycho-plastic constructs. Then came the exhaust vents, plumbing and electrical conduits, etc that made elder vehicles very much like human vehicles just with weird shapes. I LIKE THE ALIEN LOOK of the first dozen years of the hobby.

If someone likes the 'horseshoe' shape tanks go for it. I like my old "iron-style" tanks. There are 20+ players that show up most nites and almost none of them have even a primered army. My force is completely tournament ready painted as that is how I like to play the game with as much 'thematic' feel as possible. A bunch of gray plastics/resin figs look lame compared to painted old metal minis IMO. I think it would be terribly rude/poor sportsmanship to call players out on an unpainted army despite my opinion.
Conversely when I see players 'rag' on the older stuff where 80% of all the lore, units and such were created, I think they are showing their age AND their maturity.


Rant over lol

I used the "iron" Wave Serpent one time against my friends. That stupid paper Serpent Shield was the most fiddly thing ever and, after I shot it once, no one would let me use it again. I miss my old Armorcast Tempest grav tank though. It was far manlier than the Scorpion.

I haven't decided if I want to use the Tempest as a Scorpion or a Lynx.

I have 3 Tempests to form my BattleGroup, Much like my 2 Revenant Scout titans travel in pairs as the epic game had them fielded.

The Scorpion is a bit larger than the Tempest. Is there a FW flyer that is equivalent? One with Hover mode. Just never use the flyer rule and stay with hover and that could be a good equivalent.

 admironheart wrote:

The Scorpion is a bit larger than the Tempest. Is there a FW flyer that is equivalent? One with Hover mode. Just never use the flyer rule and stay with hover and that could be a good equivalent.

The Tempest is bigger than a Lynx and smaller than a Scorpion.

Looking at the current rules for 8th. The scorpion is extremely good. It's gun is insane.

The lynx is sadly not in the same boat. The lance variant may be the better option. but the Lynx pulsar is garbage for the cost. So sad, I wanted a pair of lynx for the longest time, and not really worth it right now.

The list of things that a scorpion doesn't one-shot is pretty small. I think it's broken to the point that it can't realistically be taken in any remotely friendly game. I like the sonic lance lynx. It's not worth the points, but I think it's much better than a Deathshroud Wraithknight for less than half the cost. The pulsar lynx is terribad. The cobra is probably too niche to be competitive, but it's appropriately costed.

The Scorpion is a prime example why I stay the hell away from Forge World. It's stupidly brokenly good and it can delete any unit in the base rules in a single shot. The exceptions are swarm units, but it'll still take out ~10 models per turn *before morale checks*.

To be that hard to kill and that universally deadly at that price point is absurd.

 Deathypoo wrote:

To be that hard to kill and that universally deadly at that price point is absurd.

What price point would you suggest?