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I wouldnt build a Talos right now until we see the Codex, I really hope the Cronos gets better too, I really like the model.

It could be a good flamer platform if it gets S4 on their weapons and the range improvement.j



On a side note, I've just seen the last week SkaredCast 2k point Drukhari vs Newcrons (feat. Silent King) and I'm pretty impressed with what Drukhari can achieve with a good pilot even vs a new codex. Of course, none of the lists were refined, and the game was crazy on the RNG, but it makes me optimistic that with the correct tweaks and buffs we can remain being a good (and FUN) army

 Denegaar wrote:
I wouldnt build a Talos right now until we see the Codex, I really hope the Cronos gets better too, I really like the model.

It could be a good flamer platform if it gets S4 on their weapons and the range improvement.j



On a side note, I've just seen the last week SkaredCast 2k point Drukhari vs Newcrons (feat. Silent King) and I'm pretty impressed with what Drukhari can achieve with a good pilot even vs a new codex. Of course, none of the lists were refined, and the game was crazy on the RNG, but it makes me optimistic that with the correct tweaks and buffs we can remain being a good (and FUN) army

Yeah, Skari has shown some great stuff with the Drukhari. Paired with the Death Guard changes and how finely tuned they got the Necron codex dialed in I'm feeling pretty positive about the upcoming codex.

And fair point on the Talos. I signed up to do a painting oath for Black Templars out of the Indomitus box so that'll keep me busy until the codex drops and I get some time to dissect it and decided where to take my army.

Talking about Skari, he's playing Lelith lately, and it looks quite fun. Why is people not playing her? Red grief not worth? S3? Just not bothering with Cults?

Hope we see the new model this Friday.

 Denegaar wrote:
Talking about Skari, he's playing Lelith lately, and it looks quite fun. Why is people not playing her? Red grief not worth? S3? Just not bothering with Cults?

Hope we see the new model this Friday.

She is Cult of Strife, not Red Grief.

I made a list including her, but never got to play cos of COVID. I was interested as to whether their 'shoot again' strategem might be useful with Reapers and Tanatalus officially available to Wych Cult.

 Denegaar wrote:
Talking about Skari, he's playing Lelith lately, and it looks quite fun. Why is people not playing her? Red grief not worth? S3? Just not bothering with Cults?

Hope we see the new model this Friday.

B.c she is bad and has a bad trait. A wych unit out preforms her easily for the same points, heck a Succubus out preforms her most the time. But its Skari, he can make anything work.

Maybe the problem with her is that she is designed to be a Character Killer, but nowadays all HQs have 4++ or 5++, meaning that even if she hits and wounds with all of their penetrating attacks, she's not able to kill anyone.

I'm fine with her being a one vs one monster at 80 pts, but she should utterly destroy them. Maybe avoiding invulnerable saves, causing mortal wounds... IDK.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/12/25/christmas-preview-hedonites-habits-and-hekatarii/

For the most part I like new lelith but gw seems to often have issues sculpting women's faces right now. Maybe it's just how gw paints their models. Maybe super angry or sad faces tend to look ugly in general. I dunno. In this case I oddly find the palatines facial expressions much better.

Aside from that I much prefer this reimagined lelith to revamped drazhar. Drazhar needed to keep the praying Mantis look imo. That's part of what drew me to him in the first place.

Photos and paintjob don't do her any favor. But it is true that she's thicker and angrier, and maybe a lot of people doesn't like that.

I do like the new model better than the old one, but I see why people generally doesn't like it.

I'm pretty sure the unpainted model in 360º will look way better. And we need to see those rules to see if she's worth the effort! I will buy her anyway because I have all the plastic characters.

I thought Drazhar was OK.... If anything, GW was too conservative in sculpting him; he is basically just a slightly fancier Klaivex, rather than someone unique.

The only bits I really dislike are the stupid scenic base, and the hair which is very thick, ropy and flat. I'm a bit frustrated that the new Leith seems to have similar detail-poor hair.

The funny bit is i'm on a drukhari facebook page and the players are split between being ok with it or not. Personally my only big issue is the awful face. GW seriously needs to look at the lore, get some female models to pose for them and then make that into an figurine. I mean really i've seen them do better. Just like all women don't need to be scarlet johansen not all women have to be an MMA fighter esp. where it doesn't make any sense. Personally i prefer escapism and realism not to be pushed so hard because if it was we wouldn't get undead and soulless robots, elves in space with psychic powers, chaos gods and so on. Just let 40k be fun and stupidly over the top again. I want an ork that straps 20 guns, flamers and melee weapons onto his mega armor because it's over the top and fun. Sorry for the rant.

I'm betting a lot of the divisiveness surrounding the new Lelith is down to paint job and photo angle.

Citadel always goes overboard with edge and accent highlighting because they want to accentuate all the details of the miniature. Sometimes this works, sometimes it doesn't. Personally I hate the Citadel painting style, but I understand why they do it.

The photo angle can really mess with the perception of a miniature, sometimes its really hard to capture the awesomeness of a 3 dimensional object through a 2 dimensional medium. For example, I didn't like the new Harlequins until I saw them in person, the photo of them on the box art does them no justice. It's just the way it is sometimes.

Do I think the new Lelith is amazing? No, I still prefer the old one. But I think it will be much better in person.

It looks that the acceptance of the new model depends on where do you ask. Drukhari Reddit users prefer the new one, for example.

I guess that actual people that play with the minis prefer the plastic version to the finecast one and, in general, people is happy that GW releases more plastic models for our small army.

I also agree that is going to look better in person.

Here's hoping.

I might well buy a Succubus kit at the same time, and see if they can be kitbashed together.

 Denegaar wrote:
It looks that the acceptance of the new model depends on where do you ask. Drukhari Reddit users prefer the new one, for example.

I guess that actual people that play with the minis prefer the plastic version to the finecast one and, in general, people is happy that GW releases more plastic models for our small army.

I also agree that is going to look better in person.

I have 5th Metal one and I will for sure still be using it, the new one is ugly AF IMO.

I busted out the Dark Eldar last night in a game against a friend.

He brought Salamanders with a giant unit of 10 Terminators. These guys are really hard to shift with 30 wounds now. All Storm Bolters and 2 Assault Cannons deep striking into my back lines. Took out 1 Ravager with shooting and managed to make the charge into my other and destroy it. It really put me on my defensive and changed the entire game. It shattered my line. It swung the game from a loss on his part to a tie. I'm confident if he knew his army better (new army for him) he would have pulled out a win.

I suicide charged Drazhar and 5 Incubi into the Terminators and managed to kill all 10 of them. I used the Onslaught strat and their new Klaive profiles. These guys are absolute monsters. It's unreal the amount of damage only 5 Incubi can produce. Just don't get charged. They still can't take a hit.

Raiders and Ravagers seemed slow. It's weird to say, But strongly believe they should have their movement increased to 16 or even 18".

Voidraven Bomber is gak. The Void mine is a waste of time in a game of 2 wound marines. Dark Scythes are also bad.

Splinter Weapons are still just bad.

Archon is bad. Im tired of having his Shadowfield generator short out on the second hit. 2++ on a toughness 3 model with 5 wounds is not game breaking, and I'm tired of acting like it is. This guys need a complete overhaul with the new rules.

Good to hear incubi are good. Hopefully more will get better with the announced codex.

That bering said how awesome is it to be facing terminators in 2020! I love this edition so much!

 Brutus_Apex wrote:
I busted out the Dark Eldar last night in a game against a friend.

He brought Salamanders with a giant unit of 10 Terminators. These guys are really hard to shift with 30 wounds now. All Storm Bolters and 2 Assault Cannons deep striking into my back lines. Took out 1 Ravager with shooting and managed to make the charge into my other and destroy it. It really put me on my defensive and changed the entire game. It shattered my line. It swung the game from a loss on his part to a tie. I'm confident if he knew his army better (new army for him) he would have pulled out a win.

I suicide charged Drazhar and 5 Incubi into the Terminators and managed to kill all 10 of them. I used the Onslaught strat and their new Klaive profiles. These guys are absolute monsters. It's unreal the amount of damage only 5 Incubi can produce. Just don't get charged. They still can't take a hit.

Raiders and Ravagers seemed slow. It's weird to say, But strongly believe they should have their movement increased to 16 or even 18".

Voidraven Bomber is gak. The Void mine is a waste of time in a game of 2 wound marines. Dark Scythes are also bad.

Splinter Weapons are still just bad.

Archon is bad. Im tired of having his Shadowfield generator short out on the second hit. 2++ on a toughness 3 model with 5 wounds is not game breaking, and I'm tired of acting like it is. This guys need a complete overhaul with the new rules.

We used to move 18" back in the day (24" if you don't shoot or disembark), honestly all DE vehicles should be up to 18" again.

Our flyers and Poison is just bad right now, honestly how 9th is, flyers didn't need the huge increase in points as no one wants many of them anyways.

I played two games this month with Incubi vs BA, one with tho old and one with the new profile. The change is obscene, if our other units receive half that improvement in lethality, we are going to be fine killing stuff. Of course we need other buffs in mobility, for example.

So 10 point Reavers, that sounds like a mistake

If you have them glued and no covid19 in your arria I would greatly advice you to play with them before the week is over.

You can fit 36 Reavers in an Outrider Detachment for "friendly" 500 pts games now.

 warmaster21 wrote:
So 10 point Reavers, that sounds like a mistake

10pt reavers and 17pt hellions, I have a hunch someone mixed them up lol. Wonder if that'll make it into the codex.

I'm guessing the major points overhaul we're seeing here for drukhari and not other factions is due to the upcoming codex. I see:

Drazar: +30 XD
Archon: +5 if he has the Huskblade
Succubus: +5, no wargear options anymore (unless they're free I guess)
Lelith: +5
Urien: +5
Haemie: the same but no wargear (again, unless they're free)

Kabs: -1, Shredder and Blaster -5
Wyches: -1
Wracks: -4 damn son

Beastmaster: -5
Sslyth: -3
Grots: -5 and they get 5pt liquifiers instead of 10pt now
Reavers: probably -3
Hellions: Probably -4 (assuming 10pts is intended for them)
Ravager: -5
Raider: -5
Talos: -15 damn, also stinger and twin splinter and haywire and heat appear to be same cost?
Mandrakes: -2
Fiends: -10
Khymera: -2
Razorwing Flock: -2
Scourges: -2
Razorwing Fighter: -20

That's what I see, anyone else spot any other changes?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
My guess is, our HQs are going to be getting some major stat improvements particularly to their 'signature weapons' and they're going to be chopping away their optionsto what you get in the plastic kit. So every archon will be splinter or blaster, venom or husk, and every succubus will be agonizer+Glaive, and every Haemie will be Tools+Stinger+Injector.

Scourges are 12 down from 15, so -3.
Also the weapons got improvements for them, both Blaster Scourges or Shredder Scourges got extra 5 pts cheaper.
35 points less for a MSU Scourge squad of Blasters is pretty good.

Fire and Fade into transports is good too.

Wracks taken in squads of 20 is good too.

Wracks just broke the game. 6x20 wracks in PoF with the stratagem..... Reavers and Hellions most likely got mixed up.

 Amishprn86 wrote:
Wracks just broke the game. 6x20 wracks in PoF with the stratagem..... Reavers and Hellions most likely got mixed up.

*assuming that they retain the same statline etc as they have now, and PoF is unchanged, I agree.

the_scotsman wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:
Wracks just broke the game. 6x20 wracks in PoF with the stratagem..... Reavers and Hellions most likely got mixed up.

*assuming that they retain the same statline etc as they have now, and PoF is unchanged, I agree.

We don't have a new codex for at least 2 months, so until then its op.

the_scotsman wrote:
10pt reavers and 17pt hellions, I have a hunch someone mixed them up lol. Wonder if that'll make it into the codex.

Needing to publish a FAQ/errata for the FAQ/errata is peak GW.

My guess is, our HQs are going to be getting some major stat improvements particularly to their 'signature weapons' and they're going to be chopping away their optionsto what you get in the plastic kit. So every archon will be splinter or blaster, venom or husk, and every succubus will be agonizer+Glaive, and every Haemie will be Tools+Stinger+Injector.

Succubi really need a Damage D3 or Damage 2 weapon. For characters who are fluffed as gladiators, they're really terrible at duelling other HQs.

 Denegaar wrote:
Fire and Fade into transports is good too.

Where are you seeing this?

.

"OUT OF PHASE RULES AND EMBARKING
ON TRANSPORTS
We wish to add an example to explain how the Out of Phase rules
apply to units. When a unit uses a rule to make a move as if it
were the Movement phase, all the normal rules that would apply in
the Movement phase apply when making that move. For example,
models in that unit cannot finish that move within Engagement
Range of any enemy models, and if every model in that unit
finishes that move wholly within 3" of a friendly Transport model,
they can embark within that Transport model following the
normal Movement phase rules regarding embarkation."

Main rulebook FAQ.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also of note for Drukhari:

"*Page 210 – Embark
Change the second sentence of the second paragraph to read:
‘Unless specifically stated, other units’ abilities have no effect on
units while they are embarked, and Stratagems cannot be used to
affect units while they are embarked.’"

it is now "OTHER MODELS abiliites" and not ALL abiliites. So abilities that the embarked unit has now work again, for those rules-purists who really thought it was RAI for stuff like Flayed Skull trait to no longer function.

 Niiai wrote:
If you have them glued and no covid19 in your arria I would greatly advice you to play with them before the week is over.

However, buying additional Reavers specifically to take advantage of this might not be the wisest long-term investment.