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I know their have been a lot of discussions about the mawloc's 'terror from the deep' ability, but I still don't know how tournament judges deal with this. I've never used Mawloc's before but I do now and I want to make sure I'am using them correctly at the next tournament.

For example:



I dropped a sporepod with termaguants and move them around a dreadnought. After that I drop the mawloc on top of the dreadnought and score a hit. When it has to move outside the template the shortest distance it will move on top of the guants or the tanks. So does it counts as destroyed? I want to use this ability to take down a wave serpent list with 6 wave serpents and 3 fire prisms so dont judge me..

It cannot move, so would be destroyed.

Surely it would just be moved to the other side (as in right or left) of the gants, as that is the shortest distance possible whilst not being within 1" of an enemy model?

Find permission to move through an enemy model.

Yep, that's one dead Dreadnought.

The fact that you can deploy 6 inch out of a mycitic spore really benefits this.

But how about the models inside a transport? And flyers/swooping MC's? the also have to move the shortest distance but can the be destroyed because their base still counts as being on top/within an enemy/friendly model?

From memory the FAQ addresses that fliers dont get caught in this, but please double check.

Page 79 states to find out where an embarked unit is, to measure to the hull of the vehicle. Thus if the vehicle would be destroyed so would the contents.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
From memory the FAQ addresses that fliers dont get caught in this, but please double check.

Page 79 states to find out where an embarked unit is, to measure to the hull of the vehicle. Thus if the vehicle would be destroyed so would the contents.

Well, flyers don't suffer a hit but still have to move one inch out of range from the mawloc (tyranid FAQ). But what if the cant? If the just simply keep on moving the shortest distance until the can place their base then that means a tyranid player could move a flyer around if he wanted to. Or do the rest of the units (friendly or enemy) have to make room for the flyer.

my head hurts...

The flyer is the only one allowed to move, and has allowed to have their base effectively ignored - so move the flier the minimum distance . Yes this means you could screw with someones positioning, important for most fliers!

So if it was a vehicle, would the embarked troops deploy 6" from the destroyed vehicle?

No, for a start you never disembark 6" when a vehicle is destroyed, it is 3", and the vehicle is not wrecked or exploded - just removed from play

As I said, the occupants are ALSO unable to move out of the markers area, as the vehicle cannot - and by page 79 they are where the vehicle is. So they would also be destroyed.

Obviously I'm not there, but it looks like the Dread could be moved to the left between the gants and the tank.

rigeld2 wrote:
Obviously I'm not there, but it looks like the Dread could be moved to the left between the gants and the tank.

I disagree, if you remember that the TFtD forces any models, not destroyed by the initial impact to move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid any enemy models. There's no way, that after placing the Mawloc the dreadnought can move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid both the gants and Mawloc.

Dead dread... For flyers? RAW says that you can't place models within an inch of an enemy model....while the initial impact cannot effect the flyer (based on flyer rules) but the flyer still has to avoid the Mawloc. If the flyer is in the exact same positioning as the dread in the OP flyer is dead.

From a rough estimate it doesnt look like it could get through the gap without getting within 1" of the gaunts, as it cannot move the chimera.

roxor08 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
Obviously I'm not there, but it looks like the Dread could be moved to the left between the gants and the tank.

I disagree, if you remember that the TFtD forces any models, not destroyed by the initial impact to move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid any enemy models. There's no way, that after placing the Mawloc the dreadnought can move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid both the gants and Mawloc.

If he fits, the minimum distance would be outside the circle formed by the gants and chimeras.

nosferatu1001 wrote:From a rough estimate it doesnt look like it could get through the gap without getting within 1" of the gaunts, as it cannot move the chimera.

There's no restriction on staying 1" away from the gants - indeed, since he only must end 1" away this isn't a normal move.

rigeld2 wrote:

roxor08 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
Obviously I'm not there, but it looks like the Dread could be moved to the left between the gants and the tank.

I disagree, if you remember that the TFtD forces any models, not destroyed by the initial impact to move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid any enemy models. There's no way, that after placing the Mawloc the dreadnought can move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid both the gants and Mawloc.

If he fits, the minimum distance would be outside the circle formed by the gants and chimeras.

nosferatu1001 wrote:From a rough estimate it doesnt look like it could get through the gap without getting within 1" of the gaunts, as it cannot move the chimera.

There's no restriction on staying 1" away from the gants - indeed, since he only must end 1" away this isn't a normal move.

No, you have to move the minimum distance outside the large blast marker and if you cannot do this your destroyed (tyranid codex mawloc rules).

The separate Tyranid FAQ let us know that flyers must move/evade 1 inch from the mawloc.

rigeld2 wrote:

roxor08 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
Obviously I'm not there, but it looks like the Dread could be moved to the left between the gants and the tank.

I disagree, if you remember that the TFtD forces any models, not destroyed by the initial impact to move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid any enemy models. There's no way, that after placing the Mawloc the dreadnought can move THE MINIMUM distance to avoid both the gants and Mawloc.

If he fits, the minimum distance would be outside the circle formed by the gants and chimeras.

nosferatu1001 wrote:From a rough estimate it doesnt look like it could get through the gap without getting within 1" of the gaunts, as it cannot move the chimera.

There's no restriction on staying 1" away from the gants - indeed, since he only must end 1" away this isn't a normal move.

I thought the nid codex stated it WAS a move, similar to a tank shock forced move

It isnt a usual move, but I ddint see any allowance in there to break the prohibition on moving within 1" of an enemy model, or indeed of moving through other models. If it is indeed a "move" it would still follow these rules, otherwise it is more like a "placement"

Its is a move and they cannot be moved within 1" of enemy models. That is stated right in the Mawloc's rule.

I was thinking more tank-shock rules. My mistake.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
The flyer is the only one allowed to move, and has allowed to have their base effectively ignored - so move the flier the minimum distance . Yes this means you could screw with someones positioning, important for most fliers!

No, the flyer has to evade/move 1 inch from the mawloc and you cannot ignore the flyers base. The flyers base cannot be placed upon models so cannot be ignored.

You can ignore its base when moving, so you do not trigger the 1" rule, however the base as you say cannot be placed on models when it finishes moving. So you dont get to kill flyers with this, but you CAN move them

nosferatu1001 wrote:
You can ignore its base when moving, so you do not trigger the 1" rule, however the base as you say cannot be placed on models when it finishes moving. So you dont get to kill flyers with this, but you CAN move them

Where does it say that you can ignore its base? It's not in the Tyranid FAQ and as far as i know not in the rulebook. I do think that RAI you cannot kill a flyer like this but its still not clear what will happen if a flyer cannot move 1 inch from the mawlock? I also assume you move the flyer out of the way but their not any rules backing this up.

In the rulebook it defines when you care about the base for skimmers and flyers. This isnt one of those cases where you care about the base of a flyer

This means you can *always* move it 1" away, assuming there is any space on the board at all...

Flyers (base)cannot move within 1 inch of an enemy model. If there are (enemy) models around the flyer model, for example: swap the dreadnought with a flyer in the example picture, you still got this problem. A flyers base only ignores terrain but not models. So why do you think that this "isn't one of those cases"?

edited because this post was wrong.

Because the rule actually does say that any model that cannot be moved out of the way is destroyed.

So the flyer is also destroyed?

Provided the chimeras fit under the flyer it would be ok. Its only enemy models that have to stay 1" away. Flyers and other models section of p80.

Also for both skimmers and flyers they are permitted to move over friendly and enemy troops, its just at the end of the move their base has to be more than 1" from enemy models. Indeed with skimmers if you are forced to stop over enemy or friendly troops you need to move the minimum such that you are out of the 1"no go zone.

So the dreadnought might be toast, but any fliers or skimmers will only have to be shifted.

You can fly over a model but still cannot put the flyers base unto another model (friendly or enemy). Their no rules for when you get "forced" to move and thats the whole issue.

shogun wrote:
You can fly over a model but still cannot put the flyers base unto another model (friendly or enemy). Their no rules for when you get "forced" to move and thats the whole issue.

Skimmers do have a specific rule regarding forced movement and flyers have a specific rule allowing them to finish their move over friendly units.