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So I was in a Ork & Eldar vs. Tau & Necron 4000pt game this past Sunday @ 2000/player (which was pretty much my definition of hell going up against Tau and Necrons). While we pulled out a last minute victory by securing the objective last turn in a last ditch effort the battle seemed pretty one-sided IMO. My Eldar ally was doing nicely but I felt like my Orks were lacking a bit. (Dawn of War deployment and we were doing a "Catch the Psyker" friendly game where we'd gain D3 VPs if we controlled the Psyker at the end of a turn. Psyker would then scatter 3D6 to be up for grabs again)

List I ran:

Ghaz
Big Mek W/ SAG
14 Lootas
4 Nob Bikers (1 is a Painboy)
3 squads of 21 Shoota Boyz (one has a Nob, I put another with Ghaz)
1 squad of Big Gunz (Kannon)
2 Looted Wagons with BoomGunz
1 Squad of 3 DeffKoptas
2 DakkaJets (3 Supa Shoootas, Ace, FlyBoss)


We had second go. Deployment wasn't bad. Lootas in the ruins. Gunz and SAG covered by a hill to offer fire support. Koptas hiding behind ruins to survive first turn shooting. Boys footslogging it. Bikers going across to munch on some Tau. Looted Wagons to tie up vehicles. I was trying something new by running 60 boyz, 2 Looted Wagons, and 2 DakkaJets since I wanted to show off my new jet model that I'd just completed. Annnnyway...

T1: Nothing special. A couple of guys on both sides drop. Psyker contested, No Points.
T2: Bikers made it across the field, avoiding the Necron Wraiths, to engage the Tau Fire Warriors in CC. They Lost (Yeah... you read that right). Painboy fails morale and heads for the hills. Boyz start dropping like flies. Deffkoptas bite the dust. little done to opposition. Necrons laugh at my feeble attempts to pen AV13 with Lootas, Gunz, SAG, and BoomGunz... :( At least we managed to get the Psyker this turn. 1 Dakkajet gets in to eat the Necron Flying Croissant for breakfast.
T3: DakkaJet 2 enters. We get the Psyker this turn thanks to a favorable scatter. Looted Wagon 1 dies to Wraithlord flying over with chariot. Necrons continue to laugh. Huge Tau walker starts eating at one of my Jets thanks to "Ignores Cover" rules so I can't even evade... (bawr). Ghaz and boys flee from Wraiths. It's not looking good.
T4: Wraithlord's chariot gets popped. Ghaz and boys eat Wraithlord for lunch. DakkaJet 1 shot down (at least it took some Necron Warriors with it). Lootas continuing to pour fire into Necron Arks. Grots inept along with the Big Mek and his SAG. Only redeeming factor is that when the wraiths charge the gunz, the Grots managed to tie them up. One survived the assault and got insane heroism on the morale check. Go Grot! Psyker controlled by the opposition.
T5: Pretty much firing for effect here now. Gunz and Big Mek are gone by our turn. I have no clue what's going on over on the Eldar side except for that he's in the face of the Tau and popping tanks. Huge mess in the center as we all go for the psyker. DakkaJet 2 pops Tau Walker. Lootas finally down a Ghost Ark leaving us in control of the Psyker. Two squads of boyz decimated and heading off the board. Ghaz and two boyz in the fight have gone to ground and cant do anything against the remaining 2 wraiths and their Necron lord.


Post Mortem:

Downside: Gunz and the SAG were pretty much worthless this game thanks to lousy rolls. While the SAG was hitting, it wasn't doing much due to low STR rolls. Grots couldn't hit the broad side of an Ark even after stuffing Ammo Runts down the barrels and firing. Looted Wagons just seemed to draw fire. Their Boomgunz just were not hitting and the Big Shootas on them couldn't do anything against AV13 on the Necron Arks. Footslogging was a really bad idea I should've known better than to try it.

Upside: DakkaJets and Lootas were the stars of the show. Even after losing one jet, the other made up for it by downing the Tau walker. The Ignores Cover rule that the Tau have on their weapons was the bane of their existence.


Thoughts:

I finally got my hands on IA8 and started looking through it. I'm getting a lot of ideas but wanted to bounce them off of you all. For example: The Lifta Wagon. Has anyone used a Lifta Droppa yet?

I'm wondering how Ork Bikers would do against Tau. I hear they ignore cover alot... but I don't know just how much 'alot' is.

As for Forgeworld stuff, Orks benefit enormously from IA;8 to the extent that I'd say they need it to be on even remotely even footing with the other armies.

The Lifta Droppa has been updated twice since its entry in that book. You can find the new rules if you ask the right people, certain individuals who are knowledgeable about such things and make posts explaining how they work. Suffice to say the new one is GARBAGE and should be avoided like the plague.

You can and should use forgeworld for your boyz, especially for fun games like 4k doubles (doubles is by far the best way to play IMO). The Painboss is amazing for footslogging lists.

Big Trakks w/ Supa Kannon are like a Boomgun wagon, but slightly more expensive and far, far (far) better. Still not up to the level of everyone elses massive artillery tanks but by god its a start.

Grot Bomm Launchas are our version of Imperial Barrage weapons. I use them to hard counter such things (S8 ordnance TL barrage large blast = very good chance to waste or at least shake a Manticore or Basilisk) and to force my opponent to mess around with spaced deployment and gak. Let them know how it feels to have to waste time and effort with that for once. Again, updated in IAA:2nd E, essentially +5 points and a shoota attached with no other differences.

By allying in Dread Mob (which you can do as Battle Brothers as per the FAQ) you can get yourself free slots. This can be great to get a Painboss or Big Mek, and then to add a 4th unit of Lootas and another Fast slot to take Grot Bomms

Whats the best way to get grunts into CC ?

@ Scommy: Probably Battlewagons and Trukks is best to get them up to the fighting.

@ Dakkamite: Aw man... they nerfed the Lifta Droppa from IA8? That sucks. Here I was getting excited at using it in my upcoming Apoc game this Sunday.

I'll have to look at the FW Boyz here. I've only glanced through the infantry choices. I went straight for the vehicles!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Addendum: I found the updated rules...

Spacecat @ the-waaagh.com wrote:

Now, big caveat: I am not sure I am allowed to post this. It is the newer rules for the lifta-droppa as per apocalypse second edition, which is more recent than the IA8 rules, (those were meant for 5th edition). I -think- I can get away with posting this because A: forge world really should've put an errata out for IA8 but they don't. And B: This is pretty useless without the vehicle stat sheet, which is in a forge world book, so I'm not infringing on much rights, right?
If I'm wrong, please, by all means, have a moderator shut down this topic and give me a stern talking to. If I'm right, my well-meaning is simply for IA8 and stompa owners to have an updated lifta-droppa.

Lifta Droppa speshul rulez!
-Target a nonflyer, nonsuperheavy vehicle within 48"
-Roll D6, on a 4+ the target is caught in the traktor ray. On a 2-3 the beam misses. On a 1, roll on the lifta-droppa Mishaps! table.
-If a target is caught in the beam, roll a scatter dice. On a 'hit' the target is smashed up and down in place and suffers D3 penetrating hits. If an arrow is rolled, the target is flung 4D6" in the direction of the arrow, ignoring intervening models and terrain, suffering D6 glancing hits as it lands. Any unit the flung vehicle lands on takes 2D6 wounds (armor saved allowed, distributed like shooting hits) if infantry. If a vehicle or building is hit by the flung vehicle, they take D6 glancing hits if the flung vehicle is 'tank' or 'heavy' type, D3 glancing hits otherwise.
-Cover saves and invulnerable saves may be taken against lifta-droppa hits where relevant, but power fields and void shields are ignored.
-A dropped vehicle always ends up facing in the direction of the arrow on the scatter dice.
-Dropped vehicles may not be placed in impassable terrain or flung off the table. If this would happen, move them backwards until they can be 'safely' placed.
-After the damage is resovled, place the dropped vehicle and anything it landed on 1" apart, superheavies, gargantuans and buildings don't move, the flung vehicle moves instead.

Lifta-droppa mishaps! table (on D6)
1-Boom! The lifta wagon suffers a 'vehicle explodes' damage result.
2-Aaagh, it's glowin'! The lifta wagon suffers a penetrating hit and all models in D6" of the vehicle hull suffer a S2 AP3 hit (and glow in the dark a bit)
3-4 Fizzz! The lifta wagon suffers a glancing hit
5 Flying! Resolve the effects of the lifta droppa attack on the lifta wagon itself.
6 Outta control! The opposing player picks a new target the for the lifta droppa's attack (selecing range and LOS as normal) and the attack is rolled for again, treating a new result of 1 as a failed shot.

Atom-Smasha Overload (apocalypse only)
Once a game, in an apoc game, the ork player can 'overload' the lifta droppa. It fires at 48" range, S, AP1, Heavy 10" blast. And if a roll of 1 is rolled to hit while using the overload, the lifta wagon is immediately destroyed in an apocalyptic explosion.

Of course there'd have to be a freaking mishap table for a REALLY cool weapon now...

AFAIK There was an update after that, making it even worse. I thinks it's in the most recent apoc book which also brought the 6th edition apoc rules (IA Apocalypse Second edition didn't).

Yep, its even crappier than that. I went through a lot of effort to build one, got one game with its original rules, then found out about the old new ones and never used it again. Almost want to throw it away now with the new new rules.

Essentially its now;

~Hits on Ork BS of 5+
~Can target any vehicle with 4 or less hull points. No rule about not targeting flyers
~If you hit you roll a dice.
~1 is a very bad mishap table, 2-5 is 1d6" movement of vehicle and 1d3 hull points, 6 is outright destruction of target and scatter the wreck 2d6
~Scattered vehciles always stop 1" from anything

They sucked the fun right out of it, and its also terribly weak with a whopping 5+ to hit on a 225 point model. Its like a mek with a kustom megablasta - half as likely to kill itself as it is anything else.

seriously? what the crap why'd they nerf it THAT bad? thats unusable status now since i'd be surprised if you even hit before it explodes since its bound to still be a high priority target

The heck. That's worth like 20 points as a big gun upgrade for the battlewagon, but not a whooping 135 points plus crippling any transport capacity.

OMG... that's even worse... Yeah, definitely not worth taking now.

Sheesh... everytime we get a really cool new toy (that would make us gods on the field) someone has to go and nerf it...

that would make us gods on the field

I'd argue that a 225pt model with a 4+ chance of hitting, no ability whatsoever against troops or flyers, and a really, really bad Gets Hot! certainly doesn't make us Gods. As it was it was barely worth using. As it is now it's better employed as an overly ornate doorstop.

 Dakkamite wrote:

that would make us gods on the field

I'd argue that a 225pt model with a 4+ chance of hitting, no ability whatsoever against troops or flyers, and a really, really bad Gets Hot! certainly doesn't make us Gods. As it was it was barely worth using. As it is now it's better employed as an overly ornate doorstop.

Sorry, I should've been more clearer in my rant there. I was referring to the original IA8 rules regarding the Lifta Droppa prior to them nerfing it. The original RAW just would've been freakin awesome to use since it was practically autohit, move your choice of enemy vehicle up 24" in the direction of the scatter, and drop it on whatever other enemy unit you wanted to should one be in the way. It probably did well for a lot of Ork players when it first came out, people probably complained, and thus the nerf came down. Who knows. Ah well...

Well, it still seems to have the ridiculously broken overload. I once had an apoc game where me and two other ork player fielded all our battlewagons as lifta-droppas and overloaded them turn one. The enemy side had nothing but two baneblades and a bio-titan left for their first turn.
15 10" destroyer blasts pretty much auto-table any army.

 Jidmah wrote:
Well, it still seems to have the ridiculously broken overload. I once had an apoc game where me and two other ork player fielded all our battlewagons as lifta-droppas and overloaded them turn one. The enemy side had nothing but two baneblades and a bio-titan left for their first turn.
15 10" destroyer blasts pretty much auto-table any army.

I bet that was fun to do! Nice job!