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So I was wondering what would be the better long range support for a biker list at around 150pts for the unit. I want them to be able to scratch high Armor values though, And I already know the Rifleman is good!

My ideas as follows:

5 man Devastator squad w/ 4 lascannons (DA price @ 150pts) Here we get 1 bs 2 lascannon and 3 others, putting out a nice amount of shots on Tanks while not being that expensive, but it is kinda fragile and can't take that many wounds. Mostly this will be in cover.

2 Typhoon speeders (DA price @ 150pts) four missiles on a very mobile platform, plus 3 heavy bolters to boot! Although I run them by themselves, they hardly seem to do much damage on thier own. Would pairing them up be better?

1 Predator Annihilator (2 lascannon sponsors, one TL lascannon. @ 140pts for DA) 10 less points then the rest, and comes with one less lascannon than devs. But, one is twin linked. Armor thirteen says this might stand a bigger chance!

Dreadnaught w/ TL Autocannon and TL lascannon (DA price @ 140pts) nice amount of dakka and one lascannon for those hard to reach Armor values.


What do you guys think?

Try 10 Devs with Las. Yes, its pricier, but it's needed. With T5 bikers, opponents will go after vulnerable targets. And 5 PA bodies are vulnerable...

Typhoon speeders mostly as it stays with a RW theme and typhoon LS can be very survivable if you dance at ~48" range.

I vote the speeders out of the options given, but have you thought about a MOTF with conversion beamer on a bike? Good attack for both foot sloggers and AV alike. Another point, depending on how you tool out your bike army to begin with, you could avoid this question all together, say, if you used a bike squad with meltagun and a multimelta attack bike.

I would do the biker squad with meltas, but I need something to cover them first two turns.

And Should I run the speeders together?

Use melta on bikes to deal with heavy armor.

Typhoon speeders can spam enough MLs to deal with light/medium armor, and fit the theme of the list.

If you have the spare FA slots, run single. Squadron up if you need to, it's not that bad.

I like plasma on bikes and MM on attack bikes.

Although it doesn't scratch armour, I'd very strongly recommend a Whirlwind if you don't have one already.

With the rise in highly effective Xenos armies (particularly Tau, Eldar and Necrons), being able to hit their lighter troops from out of LoS is extremely useful, and can force them to come out of their castling positions where your bikes can engage on more favourable terms. And for only 65 points you can't really complain!

I would go for the speeders from that list. But the suggestion for the whirlwind is pretty good, I have had some pretty good success with it especially against those xenos.

Ignore cover is money in 6th.

At 150 pts for a unit with Tank busting capability, I'd probably go with the Annihilator. AV13 on the front with a lot of range and damage potential. It has to stay stationary, but none of those is moving around too much.

I don't like the Landspeeders due to surivability, though if you can get them cover there is something to be said for having 2 Str8 shots and 3 S5 shots at 36 inches. It would eat light vehicles alive and have a decent chance of doing damage to heavier vehicles.

Also, your answer is probably dependent on what chapter tactics you're using in the new book. In the new SM codex, IF Devs have Tank Hunters, while IH vehicles have IWND. Obviously if you're running the former go Devs, tankhunting S9 lascannons is amazingly deadly, while if you're IH take the Predator, IWND makes it really tough to kill while you're pumping out tons of Lascannon shots.

The thing is, if you're running Bikes, you might be running White Scars (and why not, 4+ jink saves and +1 str HoW, mmmmhmmm), so in terms of options, I'd probably still go annihilator for 150pts. If you ally in IH or IF though, you might change that accordingly.

Yap agree , normally 3 lascannon shots are more that enough for anti armour , i run 2 triple las predators in my Ultras and they can kill almost every thing , 6 s9 shots with 2 shots being Twin linked are very good and the price is just right , the devastators are much fragile for there cost , ether take a full 10 men squad behind a Aegis or forget them .

Going to be allying in some DA anyways for Black knights and Darkshroud, so yea playing white scars.

I have had problems with land speeders by themselves for the past few games. those two missile shots just don't seem to hi even a rhino! I actually began to hope more on the heavy bolters to glance it to death. Maybe I should try them together for a game.

And i'm planning on getting a thunderfire cannon for better ignore-cover shots with higher rate of fire.

Out of those options, definitely the Typhoons, however I think depending on the list that Lascannon Guard blobs could be better. It also depends as all of the options you listed are AT options, however Bikes tend to be good on AT since they get fast Melta. I take Whirlwinds myself because they provide the crowd control that Bikes lack.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
I take Whirlwinds myself because they provide the crowd control that Bikes lack.

Quick question - what do you normally give your Bikes? They already have twin-linked bolters, two shots within the 12" range that they can easily get to. Granted their price makes them a bit worse off for the role just from having less of them, but giving them a flamer (and combi-flamer on the Sergeant) makes them ideal, as well as that all-important Ignores Cover and a bit of extra protection from being counter-charged through Wall of Death.
By contrast, if you're giving them plasma or melta the bolter shots can easily be wasted on targets they don't really punch into.

It's safe to assume we're talking Dark Angels from the original post, so with that in mind - I'd be giving the AP2 job to Black Knights and/or Sammael and any anti-tank to multimeltas on Attack Bikes or Land Speeders. I appreciate you may well not be running Dark Angels yourself though.

If running vanilla with white scars, go for thunderfire cannons, cannot believe they have stayed the same price!.

MarkyMark wrote:
If running vanilla with white scars, go for thunderfire cannons, cannot believe they have stayed the same price!.

I've heard a lot about how thunderfire cannons work well in conjunction with bikes, but they just so sloooooow!

That's why I went with a Whirlwind - it's a lot more mobile, and just feels better in a bike army.

They both provide ignores cover tech, so they are a bit interchangable.

Yeah, very true. It comes down to how much you need that manoeuverability - or, to put it another way, how much you expect your opponent to move about.

The Thunderfire is much more useful against large hordes like Orks or Nids, where you're always going to have a target, because it just flat out can put out more damage. But it may struggle to find a bead against smaller, faster armies like bikes or Tau with their jetpacks. This is where the Whirlwind's ability to move more quickly and also fire without LoS comes into play - and can also help protect it if you keep it hidden from return fire, too.

 Hedgehog wrote:

MarkyMark wrote:
If running vanilla with white scars, go for thunderfire cannons, cannot believe they have stayed the same price!.

I've heard a lot about how thunderfire cannons work well in conjunction with bikes, but they just so sloooooow!

That's why I went with a Whirlwind - it's a lot more mobile, and just feels better in a bike army.

If FW is an option, try a LR Achilles. 2 twin-linked multi-meltas and a thunderfire cannon, with POTMS, on AV14 that ignores melta and lance, and forces -1 on the damage chart. All for 325pts.

Oh, if we are talking C:SM then the thunderfire cannon is definitely a really good option. Folks at my FLGS have had relatively good success with them, and they are 60" range if I remember correctly so they probably will never need to move.

Sorry to not say this before, but I will be running A vanilla White Scar army with an allied Black knight detachment and a PFG libby.


I loved the dual flamers on my one biker squad and am going to be using two meltas on another squad.

Is the non BoD bikes good enough, though?

I use an Autocannon Pred with Lascannon sponsons to great effect in my Word Bearers army...although he is backed up by a Vindicator and a dual Hades-Autocannon Forgefiend, so I have lots of armor on the table. That said, while the Pred doesn't always make his points back, he's at least quite the distraction along side the other big guns.

I prefer plasma guns on my bikers. Synergizes very well with TL bolters. And they can assault after firing them.

 Tiger9gamer wrote:
Sorry to not say this before, but I will be running A vanilla White Scar army with an allied Black knight detachment and a PFG libby.

Have you considered the mandatory Troops choice yet...? A PFG Libby seems useful, but without Azrael or Sammael you can't take Ravenwing as Troops, so you'll need either DA Tacticals or Scouts.

He'll need infantry in either case, as FOC shenanigans only works in primary detachments in 6th edition books.

It's a shame DA don't get the LS Storm. Scouts + Storm will be sweet for infantry support in WS armies.

I know what i'm doing, guys, I worked this all out. I'll be taking a wimpy scout squad for the troop. I have it all worked out.

Now, back on topic. What would be the best long range support for bikes? should typhoons be run together?

Pure Ravenwing .... land speeder typhoons - take a full squad with 2 special weapons and a land speeder

With pure ravenwing black knights / command squads take care of your plasma then take 1-2 units of flamers and 1-2 units of meltas and keep the land speeders back field for long range missile spam ..... honestly if you are playing C:SM I wouldn't ally anything into a bike army.

Take your bikes then add in 2-3 thunderfire cannons that sit back field (added in cover/ruins for a 2+ save is even better) .... watch as your cannons shred any troops / elites within 60" and on your bikes run 1/3 flamers 1/3 plasma 1/3 meltas.

With bikes just don't spam one type of special weapon take a balanced mix - they can always use their twin-linked bolters instead of the special ... but its better to have what you need than not.

With the new C:SM coming out soon I would wait either way until its out ... the new centurions look pretty interesting as heavy slots, or the AA tanks.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
It's a shame DA don't get the LS Storm. Scouts + Storm will be sweet for infantry support in WS armies.

I'm planning on doing precisely this with my White Scars...

 lord_blackfang wrote:
He'll need infantry in either case, as FOC shenanigans only works in primary detachments in 6th edition books.

Just popping in to say I was wrong on this one. The Bikes-as-Troops thing in C:SM works in any detachment. Meanwhile CSM can only move Cults to Troops in the primary, ditto Ravenwing/Deathwing. Way to play favorites again, GW