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Hey all, I was wondering if I put a Librarian w/ a Tele. Homer in a Rhino where would I measure the 6 in. for the Homer from? The hull of the Rhino I assume?

Lucarikx

I do believe per the phrasing it's from the model that possess the Teleport Homer. So the Librarian would have to be outside the Rhino, because the Rhino does not physically possess the Teleport Homer.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Correction, looked at my BRB on my Ipad. You would measure it from the hull. It's covered in the Embarking section that for models within a vehicles's measuring purposes you measure from the hull. So yes, you would measure from the Hull of the Rhino. It is also covered in the FAQ, saying that you measure from the hull for Area of effect Wargear.

The teleport homer requires the model to be on the table, and to have been there since the beginning of the player turn. You wouldn't be measuring at all because a homer in a rhino is not on the table.

Ah, I must go check the statement for Teleport Homer. But that does raise the question of how a model's Area of Effect Wargear is FAQ'd since most say to measure from the model.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It says that the bearer must be on the battlefield. Not the model on the table, so I'm pretty sure the measuring from the hull applies in this case as the bearer is on the battlefield, in the rhino.

in the rhino and on the battlefield are not the same thing.

Per the BRB FAQ a model with Area of effect wargear embarked upon a transport measures the range of those items from the hull of the transport they are embarked upon. So wouldn't this include the teleport homer as it is a piece of wargear on a model?

DJGietzen wrote:The teleport homer requires the model to be on the table, and to have been there since the beginning of the player turn. You wouldn't be measuring at all because a homer in a rhino is not on the table.

DJGietzen wrote:in the rhino and on the battlefield are not the same thing.

Can't decide if trolling or really this ignorant.

YES, you would measure from the hull. Per the BRB FAQ a model with Area of effect WARGEAR embarked upon a transport measures the range of those items from the hull of the transport they are embarked upon. Guess what? a teleport homer is wargear.

 DJGietzen wrote:
in the rhino and on the battlefield are not the same thing.

Yes, it actually is.

Lobukia wrote:Yes, it actually is.

No, it's really not. In this specific instance there is a rule indicating how one is supposed to treat Wargear with an AoE if the model is embarked, but that is a far cry from blanket permission, nor any explicit indication that the model is considered to be on the table at all. (not to mention that opens up a 'huge' can of worms, rules-wise)

 Phiasco II wrote:

DJGietzen wrote:The teleport homer requires the model to be on the table, and to have been there since the beginning of the player turn. You wouldn't be measuring at all because a homer in a rhino is not on the table.

DJGietzen wrote:in the rhino and on the battlefield are not the same thing.

Can't decide if trolling or really this ignorant.

YES, you would measure from the hull. Per the BRB FAQ a model with Area of effect WARGEAR embarked upon a transport measures the range of those items from the hull of the transport they are embarked upon. Guess what? a teleport homer is wargear.

1) Don't be an ass.

2) The teleport homer has no effect if the bearer is not on the battlefield at the start of the turn. If the bearer is inside a transport he is not on the battlefield. There is no effect and nothing will be measured from the hull. If the teleport homer did not have this very specific restriction then there would be an effect and it would be measured from the hull of the transport.

Yet page 78 states you can measure to the model, if you need to, meaning they are "on" the battlefield.

I will just mention the KFF here for a example, when innside a veichle it's measured from the hull.

The "on the battlefield" restriction is there to prevent shenanigans like deepstriking something with a homing beacon to guide the rest of a deep striking force in the same turn.

Also, it's "on the battlefield", not "standing alone and unafraid, disembarked upon the ground/dirt/snow/etc".

So just to confirm, it does radiate from the Rhino?

Thanks,

Lucarikx

Yes, it radiates from the Rhino, same as any AoE. Page 78/79 (cant recall which) under embarked passengers states that you measure to the models, meaning they are "on" the tabletop for that purpose

Nos is right. You measure from the hull.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Yet page 78 states you can measure to the model, if you need to, meaning they are "on" the battlefield.

Page 78 says to remove the models from the table. The errata to page 131 says that embarking onto a transport is form of removing a model from the battlefield.

How can you be on the battlefield and not on the battlefield at the same time?

Page 78 says to measure from the hull if the players need to measure a range from the embarked unit. A teleport homer must be on the battlefield for it to have any range or effect. If its not on the battlefield you don't need to measure from the unit.


If you can find me something that tells me a unit that has been removed from the table/battlefield while embarked in a transports counts as being on the battlefield, or if you can find me something that specifically gives a teleport homers embarked on transports permission to function I'll drop it.

Page 78 says that DJGietzen.

If you can measure range from unit that is embarked for effects or shooting (Fire point) then they are on the battlefield. To say they are not is just silly.

 DeathReaper wrote:
Page 78 says that DJGietzen.

If you can measure range from unit that is embarked for effects or shooting (Fire point) then they are on the battlefield. To say they are not is just silly.

Its not silly at all.

"When the unit embarks, remove it from the table and place it aside, making a note that the unit is being transported." It can't be on the table and removed from the battlefield at the same time. To say that they are is just silly.

seeing as how its inside the vehicle, it is in fact on the battlefield, even if it has been removed from the table.

Since this has a FAQ telling us to measure from the hull your argument has already been resoundingly thrown out the window.

Eihnlazer wrote:
seeing as how its inside the vehicle, it is in fact on the battlefield, even if it has been removed from the table.

Since this has a FAQ telling us to measure from the hull your argument has already been resoundingly thrown out the window.

Exactly this.

The models are removed from the table, but they are coexisting within the transport, therefore are on the battlefield and can still be measured to, heck they can even shoot thing out of a fire point...

Can't we all just get along? DJ Gietz, what if you don't glue the doors shut to your Rhino and then jam all of the models inside? Will they be on the battlefield then? Oh no, probably not, because their feet wouldn't be touching the ground. I guess you'd have to cut out the bottom of the Rhino, kinda like how Fred Flinstone used to drive his car?

Super Newb wrote:
Can't we all just get along? DJ Gietz, what if you don't glue the doors shut to your Rhino and then jam all of the models inside? Will they be on the battlefield then? Oh no, probably not, because their feet wouldn't be touching the ground. I guess you'd have to cut out the bottom of the Rhino, kinda like how Fred Flinstone used to drive his car?

I think that's what he'll expect you to do

 DJGietzen wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Page 78 says that DJGietzen.

If you can measure range from unit that is embarked for effects or shooting (Fire point) then they are on the battlefield. To say they are not is just silly.

Its not silly at all.

"When the unit embarks, remove it from the table and place it aside, making a note that the unit is being transported." It can't be on the table and removed from the battlefield at the same time. To say that they are is just silly.

I suppose you don't let embarked units fire from fire points either. Since the model has to be on the battlefield to fire a weapon.

 DJGietzen wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Page 78 says that DJGietzen.

If you can measure range from unit that is embarked for effects or shooting (Fire point) then they are on the battlefield. To say they are not is just silly.

Its not silly at all.

"When the unit embarks, remove it from the table and place it aside, making a note that the unit is being transported." It can't be on the table and removed from the battlefield at the same time. To say that they are is just silly.

When you put items in a cardboard box for storage, you remove them from the world as we know it.
Do they cease to exist? No.
Can they still affect things outside the box? Sometimes. (radioactive materials etc)
Can they be affected by things that happen to the box or its surroundings? Yes.
Does this mean that the items are still in the world? Yes.

The same holds true for models in transports in the TT game of WH40k.

Guys, just wanna throw 1 thing out there, drops pods can have/do have teleport homers(dont have my codex on me, at work!) and that is a vehicle. surely it would work the same/very similar to that, im sure that I have read that its measured from the hull as being in a Rhino is actually classed as being on the battlefield. The reason for this is because if the Rhino explodes, the models inside can be hurt from the explosion.

If they werent on the battlefield, they couldnt be hurt(aka Necron Night Scythe).

If the rhino explodes, the models inside can be hurt because page 80 provides us with a rule that specifically tells us they can be, not because the embarked unit is on the table.
Units in the rhino can shoot at enemy units because page 78 provides us with a rule that specifically tells us they can, not because the embarked unit is on the table.
No I don't expect you to cram models inside a transport model with a hole cut in the bottom so they can touch the ground. That hyperbole is bot ludicrous and insulting. I expect you to follow the rules on page 78 remove the unit from the table.

Its a permissive rule set, you don't have permission to count models as being on the table if they are not physically on the table. You have permission to measure to the transport's hull if you need to measure to the unit. The teleport homer's rules require the model with it to be on the able for it to have any area of effect. If the model with the teleport homer is not on the table the TH has no area of effect. If it has no area of effect you don't need to measure to the unit. This is different than any other piece of war gear that I am aware of as no others require the model with the wargear to be on the table.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
ahhh, I just found two things in the BRB that work against what I've been saying this whole time. SO I'll acknowledge now that I was wrong. Can any one guess why?

 DJGietzen wrote:
If the rhino explodes, the models inside can be hurt because page 80 provides us with a rule that specifically tells us they can be, not because the embarked unit is on the table.
Units in the rhino can shoot at enemy units because page 78 provides us with a rule that specifically tells us they can, not because the embarked unit is on the table.
No I don't expect you to cram models inside a transport model with a hole cut in the bottom so they can touch the ground. That hyperbole is bot ludicrous and insulting. I expect you to follow the rules on page 78 remove the unit from the table.

Its a permissive rule set, you don't have permission to count models as being on the table if they are not physically on the table. You have permission to measure to the transport's hull if you need to measure to the unit. The teleport homer's rules require the model with it to be on the able for it to have any area of effect. If the model with the teleport homer is not on the table the TH has no area of effect. If it has no area of effect you don't need to measure to the unit. This is different than any other piece of war gear that I am aware of as no others require the model with the wargear to be on the table.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
ahhh, I just found two things in the BRB that work against what I've been saying this whole time. SO I'll acknowledge now that I was wrong. Can any one guess why?

the fact that embarked models are embarked in the transport, and not is some mythical place off the table.

This is quite interesting, as teleport homers historically have always had to be on the table, I wonder how many other vets still play it this way due to assuming that it should.

I think on the table literally mean not in a transport as this is as its always been, I never considered measuring it from the hull, I will have to discuss this with my gaming group and see how we will play it.

It's in the FAQ that area of effect wargear is measured from the Hull of the Transport if you want to show your gaming group Formosa.