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Hey people. We all know that mantic dont care if we use their miniatures as proxy/count-as on other game systens. They kinda want you to choose their models instead of others for those said games...

So, with "leaked" pictures of broks finally around, what the people who plan to play 40k with a nice and new Forge Father/Space Dwarf/Demiurg army are thinking for broks?

Particularly myself, inside the fluff i have been working for "Demiurgs" in 40k universe (you can read it here, if you have the courage http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/537654.page), im very confused about those half naked space barbaric dwarfs, maybe some scavenger faction of corporations who turned to barbaric life style, lefting all the honour and pride behind.

But what about the rules? I have been toying about using them as Orks, allied with a core detachment of space marines, but that seens so counter-intuitive rulewise. Or maybe Fenririsian wolves if playing codex Space Wolves (but the lack of ranged weaponry on the original unit may seen a bit tricky).

So, what you plan to do?

For friendly games, I'll be using this (apparently, there's a slightly more updated version on the Squat Facebook group).

http://rasmushome.com/pdf/Codex6.pdf

Hey, thank you. While i dont like squats (the whole ideia, beggining from the "abhuman" thing) it is nice to have some aditional rules for them.

But regarding my question: it is much more "wich unit you use them for", tham "wich codex".

My problem with is: essentially they are naked dwarf with CCW+Pistol, and i fail to see such unit in any codex i would use space dwarfs for (Space Marines+IG).

So, anyone have some extra ideias?

Make them a bit odd and turn em into chaos cultists? Who's to say there weren't a sect of squats that turned to chaos and survived in the warp. Worked for dwarves in fantasy.

You know, this thread reminded me of how long I was pining for GW to re-release Squats/Demiurg. Thinking about it, I looked up an older forum I used to post on and found a thread I had made from 2008, talking about Demiurg rumours and with pictures of Peter from Family Guy clapping excitedly.. damn, it made really sad reading!

From early 2000 or so I always used to use a picture of a Squat as my Avatar on various forums - partly in hope that they would return, partly in response to the many narrow-minded players who used to just say "squats, lol!" and then ridicule the concept just because GW had decided that they no longer existed.

But you know what? I'm glad that Mantic are doing this line of miniatures (I have a nice collection of Forge Fathers already, and am looking forward to the future Deadzone and Warpath releases) but I'll be damned if any of them are going anywhere near a game of 40k or that universe. I'm long since burnt out.. yes really it's overblown feeling of fan entitlement on my part, but I became sick of feeling like some starved child stood outside of Scrooge's window, waiting for him to throw whatever half-chewed piece of turkey gristle outside.

Fortunately, it's a decision made easy for me by the 40k rule-system being gradually transformed into a pile of toss through expansions aimed at getting everyone to buy the biggest and most expensive models and include them in their force. I got sick of my lovingly converted and painted pre-heresy army getting carpet-bombed by what look like Tomix toys - and I know that I equally wouldn't enoy them taking on massive anime-knock-offs or the Khorne skull-mower (or whatever that gak is called) - if I made the same decision to create a mass Forge Father army there is no way I would be going anywhere near that fething game..

Anyway! As I'm sure you can tell I hold a rather large amount of bitterness over this topic; please carry on..

Well said, Pacific. I feel the same way, just not a bromance with the short and hairy fellas.

Well, i got that same feeling Pacific. And for me, i would never ever touch 40k again, but this is a social hobby and the community around me is of GW fans...

Well, the history is long, complicated and full of bad decisions (mostly mine), but you want to speak about bitterness?

I understand you with all my heart, and i promissed myself i would never buy another model from GW. At least, until now, i made it.

I hope to get other friends in Warpath/Kings of War with the time, but this group im talking about is "all GW". My only option them? Proxy, or leave 1/3 of the hobby... (one of my 2 prefered ones).

Now the brokks looks amazing, and i want to use them in game, just dont know how. And maybe it dont matter after all.

PS: sorry if the topic annoy you people, i was just trying to get some ideias...
PS2: sorry for this post at all, i got a great week for the hobby (the modeling part), fallowed by some buckets of cold water (the social part). Im probably beying an attention whore right now.

I've already been working on a squat army using a combination of IG and space marine stats. (Mostly IG) and primarily based around squat figures with some forgefathers, I plan to use the Broks in that army in some way.

As well as 40k, they will likely also see use in Warpath.

Hey, Eilif, i have seen your squats on your galery. Great stuff, must have been a hard earned collection... (I loved the terrain piece you made, i have the same habit to get "toys" and try to turn them into terrain (most of the time, with no good results).

Particularly, i am not a fan of squats. I dont like the general look of GW dwarfs, and their fluff as some type of abhumans just dont work for my taste. If elves deserved and orks deserved to be full species in 40k, why not the dwarfs too?

Anyway, what unit you plan to use the Brooks for? I plan to use my demiurgs as Space Marines with IG Allies too (but more marines here). Maybe brooks can go well as penal legion?

There are a couple of decent-looking fanmade Squat Codices out there that I found a week ago or so on the back of this thread. I figure I'll gather up my few remaining Squat figures and see if I can put together a 600-pt combat patrol for them. I only ever had a small number of Squats, but I'm sad that I sold them (as part of my IG force) in my youth. I might have 10 or so of the original models left, so those plus some Harlequin not-squats, and at some stage a few Forgefathers and Brokir, should do it. I'll just be lacking the cool bikes and trikes...

I am using a download of one of the 40K 2nd edition "Battle Bibles" off the web to play small skirmish-level games of 40K in 2nd edition. I can't wait for the second wave DZ survey. I figure about 100 dollars will give me the Forgefather starter, the expansion set (with two extra bikes for a basic squad), and the Iron Ancestor variant, plus a squad of normal Forgefather warriors from Warpath proper. Every single figure from that setup can find a direct analogy in 2nd edition squats (with some fudging for the Ancestor to be a Space marine dreadnought w/ heavy plasma gun as an "ally").

Can't wait.......

I'm... kind of embarrassed to say that the only things that I have thinking about using the Brok for are as dwarfs mounted on giant badgers....

In multiple games, mind - I am looking at Barbarian archetypes in Pathfinder, for example....

But, still... a berserker mounted on a giant badger.

So, to distract everybody from my failure of imagination....




The Auld Grump, badgers? We don't need no steenking badgers.....

Here's one of the codices I picked up...

http://rasmushome.com/pdf/squat_codex5_3.pdf

I originally started 40K with Blood Angels from the box, but I thought Squats and Orks were WAY cooler from the Codex Imperialis background. I tried to make a small squat force (bought some bikers from Mail Order, after calling up to ask about them and being told they didn't really make them any more!)

I'm also long past expecting GW to do anything with the archetype, but I do sometimes think about doing something with Forgefathers. My problem with them is while I think Sci Fi dwarves are cool, I no longer think they should look like bearded humans in space. I think perhaps a greyish skintone might make me feel better about the models.

Da Boss: Duergars in space would sound very cool, specially for 40k. Lets say our "dwarfs in space" have a rich mineral diet, and their complex social code is only honourable amoung themselves

Indeed, around my own version of the demiurgs fluff, a noble corporation could have survived the maelstrom with some minor corruptions, including grey skin and "mineral protuberances" growing at some parts of the body...

I am hereby stealing the idea of Squats being Duergar in space! I think a good grey tone would make a very unique change from the flesh tones I would normally have to fight with, especiall as much skin as the basic troops sport. A couple proper shades of grey would still show all the muscles and details really well.

Thanks for the idea, I can't believe I never thought of Duergar!

I'm such a D&D heathen. I had to google Duergar to find out that they're like the Dark Iron Dwarves from WoW..

lol Azazelx, i find so funny when someone point Blizzard as reference to something

But yeah, they are the "evil dwarves" of D&D, but not enough to say they are "chaos dwarves".

They are very fun indeed...

Hey Aegis: take a look at my "Demiurgs" fluff, into my signature link. Indeed, there is plenty of space for "guilds" with minor genetic corruptions, specially among the ancient ones (who passed the last couple of centuries fighting for survival in the maelstrom).

Yeah, I never played D&D in my Youth. My older brother played Tunnels & Trolls, so I played through that, Robotech RPG (Macross and Southern Cross), Twilight 2000, Recon, Rolemaster and MERP (a hybrid of both) and in the midst of that, Warhammer (RT and WFB and WFRP). A small bit of low-level D&D as well in that time, but not much beyond Orcs and Skeletons etc.

It's only much more recently that I've played D&D in any passable amount, and even there we're only a few levels in....

I've been using Space wolves codexfor my squats but may try blood angels, Vanilla, or Sisters. I was going to use brok riders as Thunderwolves or bike count as