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Made in gb
Esteemed Veteran Space Marine






Northumberland

As the title indicates, I came to wondering just how complete the purges of Loyalist elements of the traitor legions were on Isstvan III. I was wanting to create a little piece of fluff for a relic weapon I was going to kitbash, and I had the idea of a 'Traitor' Astartes who reveals his Loyalist colours during the battle of Isstvan V and fights alongside the beleaguered Loyalists. Upon the evacuation of the Loyalists, he is rescued by the Salamanders (simply to tie in to my Chapter) and subsequently fights under their Chapter until his death in later years - upon which his weapon is hailed as a relic and kept by the Chapter. However, I can't find any mention of Loyalists escaping Isstvan III aside from the Flight of the Eisenstein, much less any named Astartes whom I could build some fluff around (I find Characters in books who are named but usually play a minor role, thus warranting little to no backstory, are perfect for creating fluff around).

So, is it possible the traitor Primarchs overlooked certain Astartes during the Isstvan III purges? Maybe a handful of Battle-Brothers who hadn't succumbed to the pro-Horus rhetoic of their Sergeant or Captain? Similarly, what of the traitor legions who didn't take part in the Isstvan III purge - the Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, Alpha Legion, Nightlords and Thousand Sons? How did they root out the dissenting Loyalist elements?

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Made in gb
Leader of the Sept







Given the hundreds of thousands of troops in the Legions at that time, and the general ability of being able to crowbar into the fluff anything you want, yes it is possible

In terms of rooting out remnant loyalists, I imagine everyone watched each other and if they started seeing fellow marines that weren't joining in with all enthusiasm they would lynch them.

Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in eu
Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh






Reading, UK

There are some instances of where loyalist elements of the Traitor legions have survived. In Garro: Sword of Truth there are Emperors Children who managed to escape. We also don't know the fate of Ancient Rylanor, Tarvitz or Vipus yet either.

Iron Warriors in the majority went over with their Primarch. It's possible, that as with Warsmith Dantioch, there were other loyalists from the Iron Warriors dotted around the Imperium.

The Alpha Legion will likely have some form of reckoning either during or at the end of the Heresy, as it stands they are loyal traitors

The Word Bearers already had a purge, possibly after Lorgar traveled on his pilgrimage into the Eye.

The Night Lords, wasn't a good banana amongst the bunch in the first case.

No pity, no remorse, no shoes 
   
Made in gb
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





I wouldn't count on a loyalist World Eater unless one survived Isstvan III as the butchers nails make them bat crap crazy, and yearn to spill blood in order to earn a rest bite and a little pleasure from the nails.

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.


Come into my web, said the spider to the fly.
Come rest your wings, and let us talk eye to eye.
For I am a spider, and you are the fly. Now that you are here, let us sit, and say hi.
But I have have no morsel to share, nor anything to eat. But wait, what is that stickiness upon your feet.
Ah now I have you, now I can eat. Now I can enjoy you, or store you as meat.
For I am the spider, and you are the fly. How else could it have gone, between one such as you, and one such as I.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Among the huge numbers of marines in the legions, it'd be unrealistic for the traitors to have been able to purge all of them, although there probably weren't many Night Lords who were loyalists in the first place and Lorgar's purge wasn't as rushed as the others (the possibility that some slipped through still exists for both, though. After all, a n IMHO surprisingly large amount of loyalist world eaters existed to be purged and you'd think that Legion wouldn't have many loyalists in the first place, either)

Canon-wise, there's Warsmith Dantioch of the Iron Warriors and his men (though I don't know how many of his men are still around), Garro and his group of Death Guard that warned the Emperor after Ishtvan III, an unknown amount of Emperor Children might still be alive after Ishtvan, at least two Luna Wolves and one World Eater are implied to be founders/precursors of the Grey Knights, and the Thousand Sons like, had an entire chapter's worth of marines sent away by Magnus during the Burning of Prospero of which at least their leaders ended up staying loyal (likely the Blood Raven founders, given all the hints). Probably more. Battle for the Abyss had a bunch that were clearly missed although they all died in the end.

Battle for the Abyss and The Outcast Dead showed that a bunch were never told their legions even went traitor in the first place and I think some were loyal simply because that's the side they were on when the shooting started (that might have been the case with the "loyal" World Eaters in Battle of the Abyss). I imagine it's hard to spread the word around across the entire galaxy on such short notice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:
I wouldn't count on a loyalist World Eater unless one survived Isstvan III as the butchers nails make them bat crap crazy, and yearn to spill blood in order to earn a rest bite and a little pleasure from the nails.


There's still at least one loyalist World Eater running around after Ishtvan (Macer, apparently one of the Grey Knights precursors). I forget if he got his butchers nail problem fixed or not.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/01/23 14:32:16


 
   
Made in eu
Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh






Reading, UK

 Themanwiththeplan wrote:

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.

No pity, no remorse, no shoes 
   
Made in gb
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





TiamatRoar wrote:
Among the huge numbers of marines in the legions, it'd be unrealistic for the traitors to have been able to purge all of them, although there probably weren't many Night Lords who were loyalists in the first place and Lorgar's purge wasn't as rushed as the others (the possibility that some slipped through still exists for both, though. After all, a n IMHO surprisingly large amount of loyalist world eaters existed to be purged and you'd think that Legion wouldn't have many loyalists in the first place, either)

Canon-wise, there's Warsmith Dantioch of the Iron Warriors and his men (though I don't know how many of his men are still around), Garro and his group of Death Guard that warned the Emperor after Ishtvan III, an unknown amount of Emperor Children might still be alive after Ishtvan, at least two Luna Wolves and one World Eater are implied to be founders/precursors of the Grey Knights, and the Thousand Sons like, had an entire chapter's worth of marines sent away by Magnus during the Burning of Prospero of which at least their leaders ended up staying loyal (likely the Blood Raven founders, given all the hints). Probably more. Battle for the Abyss had a bunch that were clearly missed although they all died in the end.

Battle for the Abyss and The Outcast Dead showed that a bunch were never told their legions even went traitor in the first place and I think some were loyal simply because that's the side they were on when the shooting started (that might have been the case with the "loyal" World Eaters in Battle of the Abyss). I imagine it's hard to spread the word around across the entire galaxy on such short notice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:
I wouldn't count on a loyalist World Eater unless one survived Isstvan III as the butchers nails make them bat crap crazy, and yearn to spill blood in order to earn a rest bite and a little pleasure from the nails.


There's still at least one loyalist World Eater running around after Ishtvan (Macer, apparently one of the Grey Knights precursors). I forget if he got his butchers nail problem fixed or not.


Cool, thanks for the info on Macer TiamatRoar.

Come into my web, said the spider to the fly.
Come rest your wings, and let us talk eye to eye.
For I am a spider, and you are the fly. Now that you are here, let us sit, and say hi.
But I have have no morsel to share, nor anything to eat. But wait, what is that stickiness upon your feet.
Ah now I have you, now I can eat. Now I can enjoy you, or store you as meat.
For I am the spider, and you are the fly. How else could it have gone, between one such as you, and one such as I.
 
   
Made in gb
Leader of the Sept







 Pilau Rice wrote:

This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.


A lot of it comes down to propaganda and who individual Marines trusted the most. All marines were highly influenced by their own Primarch, so as soon as the Primarch decides to turn and can come up with a valid reason for doing so" for my Father's own good", " to protect Him from other bad guys", etc then they could bring a lot of their Legions with them. Added to that is the isiduos creep of Chaos gradually twisting the Marines to enjoying what they are doing and believeing even more vehemently that their Primarch is doing what is needed.

Its not just a sudden switch ebing thrown in all their heads where they say "well, I'm a traintor now, aces".

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/01/23 15:17:50


Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Themanwiththeplan wrote:
I wouldn't count on a loyalist World Eater unless one survived Isstvan III as the butchers nails make them bat crap crazy, and yearn to spill blood in order to earn a rest bite and a little pleasure from the nails.

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



For the longest time I wanted to do a Black Templars army painted like pre-heresy World Eaters.

The general idea was that their small fleet was sent on an exploration mission before Angron was found, and were caught on the wrong side of a warp storm, but had found a cluster of human worlds, and settled in while waitin for the storm to abate, with the descendents eventually finding their way back after everything went down.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/01/23 16:06:35


 
   
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The Great State of New Jersey

For the most part, loyalists were eradicated from within the 'main Legion'. It wasn't particularly difficult to do it seems, as the loyalties of the legion were divided by homeworld. Terran marines were entirely devoted to the Emperor (or at least believed to be as such) and as a result were eliminated entirely. The non-Terran marines seem to have all come from the planet that the individual Primarchs were found on, where (almost without fail) they were hailed as hero's, leaders, and even GODs prior to the Emperors arrival, and as such, their loyalties tended to lay with their Primarchs (overwhelmingly), so for the most part there were very few loyalists left after the massacres, etc.

On the flip side of that, there were many detachments from the Legions scattered throughout the galaxy well away from their Primarchs when this all went down, as shown in the fluff, many of these detachments didn't switch sides for whatever reason.

So, basically, yeah, its a feasible concept.

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Wargamers hate two things: the state of the game and change.
 
   
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Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh






Reading, UK

 Flinty wrote:
 Pilau Rice wrote:

This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.


A lot of it comes down to propaganda and who individual Marines trusted the most. All marines were highly influenced by their own Primarch, so as soon as the Primarch decides to turn and can come up with a valid reason for doing so" for my Father's own good", " to protect Him from other bad guys", etc then they could bring a lot of their Legions with them. Added to that is the isiduos creep of Chaos gradually twisting the Marines to enjoying what they are doing and believeing even more vehemently that their Primarch is doing what is needed.

Its not just a sudden switch ebing thrown in all their heads where they say "well, I'm a traintor now, aces".


Oh yeah, I get that totally. But surely some went down this path doing it because their lord said its the new way to do the tango, and must have thought actually this turnip raping really isn't my thing. I can't imagine that all of the traitors felt like Turnip raping was a good past time to be indulging in, even if their Primarch was digging it. Some must have gone along for the ride because they didn't want to end up being the turnip.

No pity, no remorse, no shoes 
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Earth

we also have a traitor loyalist traitor word bearer too, he is in unremembered empire, he is loyal to the word bearers, wants to kill lorgar but also doesnt like the imperials.... now thats a renegade if ever i saw one
   
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Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh






Reading, UK

Really though, who does like Lorgar

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Made in gb
Adolescent Youth with Potential





an alpha legion captain has been hiding along with a few other still loyal legion members who have hid upon the system. they have renamed themselves and now fight as one. but the rest of them are massacred and he is the only survivor left and when a company starts to look for their primarch they stumble upon him he explains that he's still loyal and so under the watchful eye of the salamanders he is allowed to stay alive he fights lots of memorial battles but he has not been mentioned he is the salamanders biggest secret.

ALPHA XX

 
   
Made in gb
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





nobody wrote:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:
I wouldn't count on a loyalist World Eater unless one survived Isstvan III as the butchers nails make them bat crap crazy, and yearn to spill blood in order to earn a rest bite and a little pleasure from the nails.

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



For the longest time I wanted to do a Black Templars army painted like pre-heresy World Eaters.

The general idea was that their small fleet was sent on an exploration mission before Angron was found, and were caught on the wrong side of a warp storm, but had found a cluster of human worlds, and settled in while waiting for the storm to abate, with the descendents eventually finding their way back after everything went down.


They would be the War Hounds instead of the World Eaters, which wouldn't be a bad thing.
As well as being known for their ferrosity in battle (like the World Eaters but less crazy) they also had a superb array of tatical skills they learnt over the course of the cusade, and at times fighting at the Big E's side. (unlike the WE who simply charge into battle the first chance the get). Would make them a bad ass chapter.

Come into my web, said the spider to the fly.
Come rest your wings, and let us talk eye to eye.
For I am a spider, and you are the fly. Now that you are here, let us sit, and say hi.
But I have have no morsel to share, nor anything to eat. But wait, what is that stickiness upon your feet.
Ah now I have you, now I can eat. Now I can enjoy you, or store you as meat.
For I am the spider, and you are the fly. How else could it have gone, between one such as you, and one such as I.
 
   
Made in us
Esteemed Veteran Space Marine




My secret fortress at the base of the volcano!

Back in '95, when I first got addicted to 40K, I decided my Chapter was descended from loyalist elements of the Emperor's Children. I just fluffed them as being an under-strength formation left behind at a resupply point by Fulgrim, because he was in a hurry to get to Horus and these guys were low on ammo, food, and whatever, and the Primarch couldn't be bothered to wait for them to get geared up. Since these guys were well away from where Fulgrim got seduced by Slaanesh, they didn't get the memo that it was time to be evil now, so they stayed loyal to the Emperor. They survived the Heresy, convinced the Big E to let them change their name and colors, and pretend to be a Second Founding Chapter.

Of course, the Ordo Hereticus keeps a super-duper extra-close eye on them, just in case they decide that stiletto heels, big hairdos, and guitars dialed up to 'eleven' are cool...

So I figure, if all you want is ONE little loyalist from a traitor legion, there should be enough room in the fluff to have one. Though at this point, you may have to invent your own name for the guy, as I expect every named loyalist they put in the HH novels will end up either dead, starting the Inquisition, or starting the Grey Knights.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/01/24 01:07:40


Emperor's Eagles (undergoing Chapter reorganization)
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Thousands Sons (undergoing Warband re--- wait, are any of my 40K armies playable?) 
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





the iron warriors are intreasting to consider, given they where scattered across the galaxy in small numbers chances are there where a number of loyalists. however the sad thing is I bet a lot of these loyalists where killed by the imperium or their own brethren before they realized what was happening

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Pragmatic Primus Commanding Cult Forces






BrianDavion wrote:
the iron warriors are intreasting to consider, given they where scattered across the galaxy in small numbers chances are there where a number of loyalists. however the sad thing is I bet a lot of these loyalists where killed by the imperium or their own brethren before they realized what was happening

Or they cut all links to their traitor brethren and changed their names/joined other astartes in order to redeem themselves.
Having loyalist survivors is easily possible.

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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I'd suspect that the period following the initial split of the legions would be an excellent time for loyalists from the fallen legions to reinvent themselves as a loyalist chapter, records were spotty from that time anyway.

The real catch is either somehow avoiding the geneseed tithes or finding an, ah, alternate source for geneseed to send in...
   
Made in gb
Esteemed Veteran Space Marine




Sheppey, England

 Pilau Rice wrote:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.


I can so see Little Horus falling into this category.

Click for a Relictors short story: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/412814.page

And the sequels HERE and HERE

Final part's up HERE

 
   
Made in gb
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





 Necroagogo wrote:
 Pilau Rice wrote:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.


I can so see Little Horus falling into this category.


I'm not holding out much hope of little Horus surviving the HH as, IMHO, think he will be the one to lower the shields of Horus' flag ship to atone for his sins of killing his brother. Failbadon will be the one to give him the chop when he discovers what he has done.
Of course I could be totally wrong, and they might not recon that part of the fluff, but it would be cool if they did.

Come into my web, said the spider to the fly.
Come rest your wings, and let us talk eye to eye.
For I am a spider, and you are the fly. Now that you are here, let us sit, and say hi.
But I have have no morsel to share, nor anything to eat. But wait, what is that stickiness upon your feet.
Ah now I have you, now I can eat. Now I can enjoy you, or store you as meat.
For I am the spider, and you are the fly. How else could it have gone, between one such as you, and one such as I.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




nobody wrote:
I'd suspect that the period following the initial split of the legions would be an excellent time for loyalists from the fallen legions to reinvent themselves as a loyalist chapter, records were spotty from that time anyway.

The real catch is either somehow avoiding the geneseed tithes or finding an, ah, alternate source for geneseed to send in...


Get the right connections and you can tithe your gene seed while still having it be classified to the majority of the Imperium (with the few that hypothetically do know you hypothetically belong to a traitor legion willing to keep the secret). That's the case with the Red Scorpions and the Minotaurs and maybe (not sure) the Blood Ravens. (the gene seed classification, that is)

Even if your gene seed isn't classified, they might not be able to identify that it belongs to a traitor legion. Several astartes give their gene seed regularly without it being classified and the ad mech can still only speculate on their primarch at best.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/01/24 20:57:28


 
   
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Sheppey, England

 Themanwiththeplan wrote:
I'm not holding out much hope of little Horus surviving the HH as, IMHO, think he will be the one to lower the shields of Horus' flag ship to atone for his sins of killing his brother. Failbadon will be the one to give him the chop when he discovers what he has done.
Of course I could be totally wrong, and they might not recon that part of the fluff, but it would be cool if they did.


That's pretty much how I see it happening too

Click for a Relictors short story: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/412814.page

And the sequels HERE and HERE

Final part's up HERE

 
   
Made in gb
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





 Necroagogo wrote:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:
I'm not holding out much hope of little Horus surviving the HH as, IMHO, think he will be the one to lower the shields of Horus' flag ship to atone for his sins of killing his brother. Failbadon will be the one to give him the chop when he discovers what he has done.
Of course I could be totally wrong, and they might not recon that part of the fluff, but it would be cool if they did.


That's pretty much how I see it happening too


Glad you agree.
It makes the most plot sense given what we know in the HH series so far, but I'l pray to the God-Emperor for us both, just incase, to make it happen.

Come into my web, said the spider to the fly.
Come rest your wings, and let us talk eye to eye.
For I am a spider, and you are the fly. Now that you are here, let us sit, and say hi.
But I have have no morsel to share, nor anything to eat. But wait, what is that stickiness upon your feet.
Ah now I have you, now I can eat. Now I can enjoy you, or store you as meat.
For I am the spider, and you are the fly. How else could it have gone, between one such as you, and one such as I.
 
   
Made in gb
Esteemed Veteran Space Marine






Northumberland

Since there's too much to address each person directly, I'd just like to express my gratitude to the thread as a whole for the information provided. I'm not one for trying to shoehorn some god-awful fluff into the existing boundaries so getting your opinions and theories is immeasurably helpful in trying to justify what I'm trying to come up with. I think I'll probably roll with the following:

A lone World Eater Sergeant who has his reservations about following Angron into Horus's service as his Legion gradually switches loyalty. Initially succumbing uneasily to peer pressure, the said World Eater is swept along by his pro-Horus brothers, albeit with extreme reluctance. However, upon seeing the massacre of the known Loyalists on Isstvan III, he finds himself sickened by the path his brothers have chosen. Unable to break free from the Legion, but harbouring an intense desire to escape and bring word to the Emperor of Horus's betrayal, the World Eater is trapped. However, with the impending assault on the traitor positions looming, the World Eater finally see's his chance to cast off his shackles of secrecy on the battlefields of Isstvan V. Turning against his maddened brothers, the World Eater fights alongside the Salamanders in the name of the Emperor. However, as the traitors within the Loyalist's ranks reveal themselves, the battle turns into a massacre, forcing the remaining Loyalists to effect a shambolic retreat. In the midst of the confusion, honouring his valour, the Salamanders evacuate the World Eater with them - whereupon he adopts their colours and proceeds to aid them against the traitors.

It's pretty rough so far, but not totally unfeasible I should hope. I should also mention that the World Eater would be somewhat of a rarity: One of the first recruits from Nuceria (and hence not a Terran marine who would instantly be suspected of being a Loyalist), but in being one of the first he would have avoided the implanting of the Butcher's Nails that Angron instigated in the later years of the Great Crusade (Thus avoiding the rampant mental instability that would persuade the World Eaters to devote themselves to Horus cause and Khorne). Once again, many thanks, and all suggestions are welcome.

Now with 100% more blog: 'Beyond the Wall'

Numine Et Arcu
 
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Earth

Nice, I also have a loyalist world eaters warband post IM

Basically its a chapter that was exiled due to Angrons displeasure at the refusal of there Centurion to allow the Nails to be implanted in his men, these world eaters were send off with another expeditionary fleet and basically ignored (a very hurtful thing for a space marine at the time), when the DSM happens they got word of it about 1/2 years after the event due to the warp storms disrupting communication, they fall upon each other as some declare for angron and the warmaster, others for the emperor and the imperium, roughly 400 survive of the 2000 that were originally exiled, I havent decided yet if they will survive the heresy, but they do go to istavaan and search for survivors, finding a handful of Death guard, sons of horus, The white Eyes and anchient rylanor who then co commands the force.

Im thinking of writing a short story called "Exile" about how they got sent off in the first place, will probably be naff but i can post it here if you lot want
   
Made in us
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New York, USA

 Pilau Rice wrote:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.


I remember reading a short story that took place after prospero burns where some thousand sons arrive on the planet not knowing what happens. Most are killed, atleast one escapes and another captured. The captured one is interrogated by what he thinks is a Space Wolf, only to find out that its actually Kharn. The Son is given a chance to join chaos, and he nearly does, but he sees how Kharn, once so levelheaded, is now a foaming at the mouth lunatic, and declines.

And in battle for the Abyss, a loyal World Eater does all kinds of badass stuff, and when taunted that angron turned, he denounces it as lies and murders everyone, forever.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/01/27 09:00:34


"Surrender and Die."

"To an Immortal, to one among a legion, honor and your word are all that matter" - Phaeron Orionis of the Brotherhood

W-L-D
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 Exalted Pariah wrote:
 Pilau Rice wrote:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.


I remember reading a short story that took place after prospero burns where some thousand sons arrive on the planet not knowing what happens. Most are killed, atleast one escapes and another captured. The captured one is interrogated by what he thinks is a Space Wolf, only to find out that its actually Kharn. The Son is given a chance to join chaos, and he nearly does, but he sees how Kharn, once so levelheaded, is now a foaming at the mouth lunatic, and declines.

And in battle for the Abyss, a loyal World Eater does all kinds of badass stuff, and when taunted that angron turned, he denounces it as lies and murders everyone, forever.


I remember that short story too. I think it is was in Visions of Heresy or something like that.

Chaos Space Marines - Iron Warriors & Night Lords 7900pts

 
   
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Reading, UK

 Exalted Pariah wrote:
 Pilau Rice wrote:
 Themanwiththeplan wrote:

Maybe you could have a marine who turned traitor thanks to believing Horus' side of it, but when they saw the coruption and perversions of thier brothers and other legions (EC I'm lookingat you) they had a change of heart and threw their lot in with the loyalists.
i could see an iorn warrior or Son of Horus doing this. Hope this helps.



This is something I have always thought on, did any of the traitors ever think 'You know, this is fun and all but it isn't right'. Were they even aware of what they were becoming is another question. I can't imagine that it sat well with all the Traitors. Korda seems to be skeptical about the whole mumbo jumbo stuff.


I remember reading a short story that took place after prospero burns where some thousand sons arrive on the planet not knowing what happens. Most are killed, atleast one escapes and another captured. The captured one is interrogated by what he thinks is a Space Wolf, only to find out that its actually Kharn. The Son is given a chance to join chaos, and he nearly does, but he sees how Kharn, once so levelheaded, is now a foaming at the mouth lunatic, and declines.

And in battle for the Abyss, a loyal World Eater does all kinds of badass stuff, and when taunted that angron turned, he denounces it as lies and murders everyone, forever.


The short story is called Rebirth, if it' s the one I think it is, and it's in Age of Darkness.

But is he only loyal because he wasn't present at Istvaan?

My train of thought is more in regards to the Legionnaires who followed their Primarch. Chaos corrupts and most would have thought nothing of what they were doing, but some, in my opinion, must have been disgusted at what they were becoming.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/01/27 10:21:09


No pity, no remorse, no shoes 
   
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brisbane, australia

I reamy like the idea of some thousand sons who have seen chaos and gone "no thanks bro" of coursE, they would have to have another chapter take them in as an elite group.

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