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I consider my Greyzilla army to be more of a "fun" list rather than a competitive one. Now some may think that there is nothing casual about 5 monstrous creatures, but to me, it is too unbalanced an army for me to consider it to be a competitive TAC (Take-All-Comer's) army. Thus, I mainly run it for its "shock" value. How are you going to deal with 4 fast MC's (and 1 slow one)? My army has practically non-existent shooting, but it is very fast and very scary in assault (at least to most armies). Better yet, it is my only non-Xenos, Imperial monster-list.
My opponent for this game is Trent (aka Ministry). I've played him a few times, with our last battle (that I documented) being at the Golden Throne GT 2012:
Trent is more of a casual player, but he actually brought a very hard-core list today. He brought Necrons + Tau with the R'varna! His list is brutal. It is actually what I was considering running if only the R'varna was legal in tournament play. In any case, his list was actually greatly influenced by my own Wraithwing Necrons, though he added a touch of Tau for some deadly shooting.
BTW, this game wasn't pre-planned. I just went to my LGS looking for a game, and it just so happened that Trent was available. After I saw his army, I knew I would be in trouble. His army was just a bad matchup for me. However, I was also relishing the opportunity to play as an underdog. This harkens me back to my Daemonhunter days, where every game was a challenge back then for my grey knights. But honestly, I wouldn't have it any other way. This is going to be a fun and challenging match!
Stormraven - TL-Multi-melta, TL-Assault Cannons, Hurricane Bolters, Psybolt Ammo
8x Warp Spiders
Nemesis Dreadknight - Heavy Incinerator, Personal Teleporter
Nemesis Dreadknight - Heavy Incinerator, Personal Teleporter
Nemesis Dreadknight - Heavy Incinerator, Personal Teleporter
Wraith Knight
2000 NecTau - Necrons w/Tau
This is an approximation of his list:
Destroyer Lord - 2+, MSS, Ressurrection Orb
Destroyer Lord - 2+, MSS, Ressurrection Orb
Tau "Toolbox" Commander - the usual wargear
5x Immortals - Tesla, Night Scythe
5x Necron Warriors - Night Scythe
5x Necron Warriors - Night Scythe
10x Kroots - Sniper rounds, 1x Kroothound
6x Wraiths - some whip coils
6x Wraiths - some whip coils
1. Necron air superiority. 3 flyers vs 1 for the Grey Knights.
2. Lack of anti-air for the knights. I've only got 1 stormraven and the spiders to try to deal with his flyers.
3. Mindshackle Scarabs. MC's just hate MSS, especially MC's with force weapons.
4. Superior mobility. While my army is fast, my opponent's army is faster.
5. Superior shooting. Teslas in bulk is nasty, even against 2+ T6 units. The R'varna, despite the nerfing of his gun from AP3 to AP4, can still cause a boatload of wounds to my MC's.
6. The Relic. It's going to be hard for me to take the Relic with only soladins. His wraiths should be able to defend it well.
7. Big Guns. He's got 3 very durable scoring Heavies - 2 Annihilation Barges and the R'varna.
8. My strength is assault, yet I can't play too aggressively against his army. I need to watch out for those wraiths + MSS Lord. Wraithstar > MC. They negate the strength of my army.
9. My other strength is board control. I usually control the game by controlling the Movement phase. Again, my opponent can probably do this better with his 2 wraithstars. There's a reason why I call the Necrons the Masters of the Movement phase.
10. My shooting is nerfed even more against his army. Wraiths w/2+ D-lord don't really care about Heavy Incinerators, and there will be no troops for me to flame, at least not initially.
Top 7 reasons why Greydar will win:
1. All my attacks can potentially cause Instant Death. Wraithknight has distort. Dreadknights have force weapons. All are S10 against wraiths.
2. Big Guns. I have 4 durable Heavy Supports compared to 3 for my opponent.
3. I am going 2nd. I have the final say.
4. Thank goodness the R'varna has been nerfed from AP3 to AP4! Now my wraithknight can breathe a little more easily.
5. I am a sneaky bastard. My opponent is not as conniving tactically as I.
6. I easily have the experience advantage. I know my opponent's army inside-out (probably better than he himself does). I actually run practically the same army. On the other hand, my opponent has no idea how my army plays.
7. I'm hoping I have the intimidation factor in this game. My army looks imposing at least. Intimidation can be an advantage, especially if it throws a person off his game (for example, making him play more or less aggressively than he should, deployment mistakes, etc.).
I can tell from my opponent's deployment that he didn't really have a clue as to how my army works. He deployed very defensively, something that you normally do when you don't know what to expect. Basically he deployed along his board edge and bubble-wrapped the R'varna with his wraiths.
Instantly, my game plan starts to formulate. I can tell from his deployment that he is somewhat intimidated by my army (and maybe by me as a player as well). Well, I am going to play into his fears by acting very aggressively when the truth is, I really don't want to get into combat with his wraithstar with my big guys. In other words, I am going to bluff him by feigning aggressiveness. My actual strategy is to control the middle and prevent him from advancing until its too late. Of course, this strategy could completely backfire as he's got troops in flyers.
My deployment. I deploy all my MC's as far forwards as possible. I need Draigo on the table for his Psychic Communion. I also want my autarch on the table as another viable threat, though I have to be careful of the R'varna with him. That guy can potentially kill my autarch in just 1 turn of shooting.
Finally, 2 soladins and the spiders will be deepstriking. The 3rd soladin will be in my stormraven.
I don't bother to steal the initiative and so we begin.
Wraiths shift just a little to let the annihilation barges (AB's) through.
I believe his R'varna fails to Nova-charge and thus takes a wound.
So with only 2 shots....along with twin-linkage and Monster Hunter from the Buffmander....the R'varna manages to take off 2W from my wraithknight (WK). Ouch! If only he had passed his Nova, that might have been 4 Wounds!
Greydar 1
Spoiler:
I am glad my opponent didn't advance. That lets me do a lot of handwaving and snarling at my opponent.
WK tries to get out of LOS of the R'varna.
My dreadknights advance to around 22-24" away from his wraiths.
In shooting, WK tries to take out an AB, but it gets blocked by Night-fight (my opponent makes his 3+ cover saves).
NecTau 2
Spoiler:
Only 1 immortal flyer and 1 warrior flyer come in. They go after my dreadknight. He is fortunate to survive their shooting without so much as a single scratch.
Wraiths advance ever so slowly.
This round, the R'varna successfully Nova-charges. He moves to the right to try to get LOS to my WK. Fortunately for me, he doesn't.
Unfortunately for my other dreadknight, he doesn't survive my opponent's (or should I say, the R'varna's) shooting. R'varna hits all 4 times and does 12 Wounds thanks to Monster Hunter. I then proceed to roll 5 's, thus giving my opponent First Blood. He also gets +1-pt for killing a Big Gun Heavy Support unit.
AB puts 1W on another dreadknight.
This is going to be a problem. I really don't have any shooting. At the same time, I really don't want to get into assault with his 2 wraithstars. On the plus side, however, my opponent continues to play very passively, which is probably going to hurt him in the long run. Oh wait....what?....he has troops in flyers?!? Hmmmmm....
Greydar 2
Spoiler:
Draigo casts Psychic Communion to help bring the stormraven in. The raven comes in in Hovering mode and Draigo then hops aboard to join the soladin.
I know this is a risky move. If his R'varna targets my raven, he will blow it sky-high. But I am banking that my opponent chooses the wrong target priority and goes after one of my MC's instead.
My jetbikes also come in as well.
Despite my efforts to keep him out, 1 soladin comes in as well. He then scatters away from the Relic. Both of my dreadknights hang out on the periphery of his wraithstar's threat ranges.
The spiders deepstrike in. Autarch moves to rendezvous with them.
The WK tries to get out of LOS of the R'varna.
What I forget (actually, what we forget), however, is that when the R'varna successfully novas his ripple-fire, then he cannot shoot again until the end of his next turn.
Spiders battle focus forwards. They then vector-lock as well as take off 2-Hull Points from the Immortal's night scythe.
The WK fails to kill an AB yet again!
Spiders then jump away in the Assault phase. However, I turbo-boost my Autarch to the spot where his velocity-locked night scythe should be moving to.
That's the extend of my offense for now....just the spider and the WK shooting.
NecTau 3
Spoiler:
The last flyer comes in and he goes after my jetbike troops.
Kroots outflank.
Now I told my opponent about my dreadknights' abilities to "move 30" once per game", but either he forgets or the application of my shunt move didn't really register with my opponent. In any case, his kroots are all bunched up.
Because it is velocity-locked, his night scythe moves straight into the path of my autarch and dies.
But before it does so, his immortals disembark from it (and onto their objective).
Wraiths then go after my guys. Finally, they make their move.
The other night scythe goes after my dreadknight/jetbikes.
Shooting by the night scythes and AB's kill 2 jetbikes and put 2W on my dreadknight.
His R'varna put another 3W on my dreadknight.
I forget that the R'varna cannot fire this turn because he just Nova-fired last turn. It wasn't until my opponent's next turn that I remember. My opponent apparently did not know about this "nerf" to the R'varna - that it must wait 1 turn after doing its ripple-fire before it can shoot again.
My jetbike then turns tail and flies off the table.
So that was an effective turn of shooting for my opponent. He did 5W of damage to my dreadknights and then kill off my fastest troop.
The only bright spot for me is that his wraithstar fails their 8-9" charge against my autarch. That, and the fact that he left my stormraven alone.
Greydar 3
Spoiler:
My last soladin comes in. I deepstrike him near the center to go after the Relic.
My other soladin heads towards an objective in my deployment zone.
I shunt one of my knights.
Stormraven goes after his night scythes. With a little bit of luck, I just may take out both night scythes this turn.
I send my spiders after his night scythe as well.
I then throw my autarch into his wraiths, hoping to keep them occupied with his sacrifice.
Darn it! I was hoping to blow up his AB with my fusion but instead, only manage to immobilize his barge.
Now why is that so bad, you may ask? It's not really, but had I managed to blow it up, I could have then moved again in the Assault phase to take my Autarch deeper into enemy territory, which is what I wanted.
Double-drats! I fire 16 S7 shots, 4 twin-linked S7 shots, 6 twin-linked S5 shots and 1 twin-linked double-strength melta shot....and the result is only 1 HP knocked off from each scythe!
Wraithknight fails to do anything to his other AB with shooting.
Dreadknight then flames the kroots and kill all but 1, who then fails Morale and falls back for the rest of the game.
My Autarch then charges and kills the immobilized barge to give my +1 Heavy Support VP.
NecTau 4
Spoiler:
I advise my opponent not to, but he goes ahead and disembarks his troops anyways. He is taking a gamble here that, between the R'varna, his AB and the troops that he can take out my dreadknight with only 2W remaining.
Wraiths advance. They would later fail their charge against my soladin.
His other wraiths don't take my bait. They go after my spiders instead of my Autarch.
He then goes after my other DK with both night scythes (which will be snap-firing due to jinking last turn). Again, he disembarks his troops despite my "are you sure you want to do this?" warning.
Ha! He didn't even need to disembark them as his 1st night scythe kills my DK with just snap-fire!
R'varna takes off another 2W from my WK.
Again, we both forget that his R'varna couldn't fire this turn due to him firing last turn, even after looking up the rules for him. Lol.
On the bright side (at least for me), his warriors and AB fail to kill my other dreadknight!!!
Wraiths make the charge and kill off 6 spiders. The spiders then break and fall back.
Greydar 4
Spoiler:
I gave him a warning. Now to make him pay.
Autarch goes after his other AB. I immobilize it with the fusion blaster.
WK goes after 1 unit of warriors.
Soladin goes to pick up the Relic. The other heads towards the wraiths.
Dreadknight goes after his 2nd unit of warriors. He flames and kills 3.
Finally, my raven goes and unloads its firepower into the immortals. I kill 4 and the last one fails morale and runs.
My 2 MC's are about to assault and wipe out his troops and my Autarch about to pounce on another Heavy Support barge. After that, he will only have 1 scoring unit left - the R'varna - whereas I've still got 5.
With that, my opponent concedes. I get both the Primary and Secondary, plus Linebreaker. My opponent gets First Blood and potentially Linebreaker.
I love that R'varna Model. Have one myself, and it always performs - it's run alongside a farsight bomb, and it can outperform it in some games. This will be interesting...
Of course, the R'varna is not useful against either a wraithknight or a grey knight MC. 12 S8AP4 attacks will do 4 wounds to the first and bounce off of it the latter
The R'varna's nerfing to AP4 will at least spare the Wraithknight from getting totally pulverized into the ground.
I think the Wraiths + MSS might be too much for the Dreadknights in CC and his 3 Flyers to your 1 could be nasty too. However I'm not going to write off an army with 3 Dreadknights, Draigo and a Wraithknight!
However I think the MotLG tarch might be in trouble though if that R'varna targets it with ignores cover.
1. Necron air superiority. 3 flyers vs 1 for the Grey Knights.
2. Lack of anti-air for the knights. I've only got 1 stormraven and the spiders to try to deal with his flyers.
3. Mindshackle Scarabs. MC's just hate MSS, especially MC's with force weapons.
4. Superior mobility. While my army is fast, my opponent's army is faster.
5. Superior shooting. Teslas in bulk is nasty, even against 2+ T6 units. The R'varna, despite the nerfing of his gun from AP3 to AP4, can still cause a boatload of wounds to my MC's.
6. The Relic. It's going to be hard for me to take the Relic with only soladins. His wraiths should be able to defend it well.
7. Big Guns. He's got 3 very durable scoring Heavies - 2 Annihilation Barges and the R'varna.
8. My strength is assault, yet I can't play too aggressively against his army. I need to watch out for those wraiths + MSS Lord. Wraithstar > MC. They negate the strength of my army.
9. My other strength is board control. I usually control the game by controlling the Movement phase. Again, my opponent can probably do this better with his 2 wraithstars. There's a reason why I call the Necrons the Masters of the Movement phase.
10. My shooting is nerfed even more against his army. Wraiths w/2+ D-lord don't really care about Heavy Incinerators, and there will be no troops for me to flame, at least not initially.
Top 7 reasons why Greydar will win:
1. All my attacks can potentially cause Instant Death. Wraithknight has distort. Dreadknights have force weapons. All are S10 against wraiths.
2. Big Guns. I have 4 durable Heavy Supports compared to 3 for my opponent.
3. I am going 2nd. I have the final say.
4. Thank goodness the R'varna has been nerfed from AP3 to AP4! Now my wraithknight can breathe a little more easily.
5. I am a sneaky bastard. My opponent is not as conniving tactically as I.
6. I easily have the experience advantage. I know my opponent's army inside-out (probably better than he himself does). I actually run practically the same army. On the other hand, my opponent has no idea how my army plays.
7. I'm hoping I have the intimidation factor in this game. My army looks imposing at least. Intimidation can be an advantage, especially if it throws a person off his game (for example, making him play more or less aggressively than he should, deployment mistakes, etc.).
don't you think that teleport dreadknights are very expensive?
Yeah they are, but I need their mobility to make this list work. The key strategy for this army is board control. Unfortunately, wraithwing Necrons do that arguably better.
Dozer Blades wrote: I don't see greydar winning this one unless there are some major tactical blunders and barring really bad dice for the Crons.
Just a little foreshadowing:
1. No wonky dice for my opponent. If anything, I probably had the wonky dice, losing 1 dreadknight from just 1 volley of enemy fire (I rolled 5 1's on my saves).
2. Yes, he did make some tactical blunders, which I certainly took advantage of.
I actually think the r'varna nerf made it pretty unplayable. For something that costs more than a wraithknight to not be able to shoot air, and also be middling at best vs more heavily armored units/mcs, is pretty unacceptable. I actually felt it was slightly underpowered/overcosted at AP3 but would have been insanely too strong at AP2 unless it was like 400 pts. The rest of his army is solid with tons of necron shooting and dlords/wraiths, just wish that varna was a burst tide and then some points saved for a 3rd barge or some more troops.
My prediction is that greydar wins convincingly on objectives.
2013 Nova Open Tournament Champ- 2014 Las Vegas Open Best Tau Player/13th overall 2014 NOVA Open Second to One 2015 Las Vegas Open Best Tau Player/10th overall
R'Varna is still good. He's just not broken good like he was before. Combined with the Buffcommander, he is a tank killer. Re-roll's to scatter, S8 with tank hunter and ignore cover, he would kill any tank, land raiders included. I swear, in a game I played, he killed all of my annihilation barges. Whereas before, that guy was just nuts. I saw a game where this guy had 2 wraithknights side-by-side trying to hide behind terrain. Well, guess what the R'varna (+buffmaster) did to them with his then AP3 shots? That's right, he killed both WK's in 1 volley.
BTW, it is the R'varna in this game that killed 1 of my dreadknights in 1 volley of fire. He did 12 wounds and I failed 5 2+ saves!!!
That is a nasty Greyzilla list! I don't know why people don't take the teleporter, it makes them so much nastier. Shunting up in your face and flaming your troops is crazy.
I think Jy2 takes this handily.
Argel Tal and Cyrene: Still a better love story than Twilight
jy2 wrote: R'Varna is still good. He's just not broken good like he was before. Combined with the Buffcommander, he is a tank killer. Re-roll's to scatter, S8 with tank hunter and ignore cover, he would kill any tank, land raiders included. I swear, in a game I played, he killed all of my annihilation barges. Whereas before, that guy was just nuts. I saw a game where this guy had 2 wraithknights side-by-side trying to hide behind terrain. Well, guess what the R'varna (+buffmaster) did to them with his then AP3 shots? That's right, he killed both WK's in 1 volley.
BTW, it is the R'varna in this game that killed 1 of my dreadknights in 1 volley of fire. He did 12 wounds and I failed 5 2+ saves!!!
Yea, watching a game where the opponent misdeployed that heavily must've been hard. Sucks you failed 5 2+ saves out of 12 though, but that's dice. I lost two riptides during a local tourney to weapon overheats, so that was fun.
Should be really an interesting match as I don't see either army as having a superior advantage over the other. The R'Varna I think is going to under perform as 2+ saves on single models are not going to care all that much and even if he destroys something that's a lot of firepower to absorb. The GreyDau are going to have problems destroying the Wraiths and Destroyer Lords up front on Turn 1. My prediction is going to be Jy2 hiding/hanging back on Turn 1 and holding out for reserves to come in to get the alpha strike on his fliers and Wraith Star. Then he'll pounce with every thing he has on that Wraith Star.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/03/19 04:53:07
Your opponent really needs to strike hard this next turn...If the flyers can remove the Storm Raven, and the Anni Barges remove the Warp Spiders, that clears up anti-air right there. After that the 2 Wraith squads kill a Dreadknight and your opponent would have it in the bag. Unfortunately something tells me that the Warp Spiders either won't lose much or it'll take way too much firepower to kill them.
And please for the love of all that's unholy tell me he doesn't get out his troops next turn...
Actually, getting out the Immortals to add some fire on the Spiders wouldn't be terrible. The 3+ save means they will only lose 1-2 from the Dreadknight's shooting.
Not sure, I think you have this, but your opponent DEFINITELY had the means to win
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/03/19 07:44:39
herpguy wrote: That is a nasty Greyzilla list! I don't know why people don't take the teleporter, it makes them so much nastier. Shunting up in your face and flaming your troops is crazy.
I think Jy2 takes this handily.
I had an opponent who took 3 naked dreadknights along with 3 stormravens and Draigo. He had units with teleport homers in them. T1 they would fly up. T2, Draigo would use Psychic Communion to make them come in and they would deepstrike in safely where the teleport homers were. It was actually quite an effective combo because now you have to deal with 3 dreadknights, Draigo and the contents of the 3 stormravens all up in your grill on T2! That was a very nasty GK MTO list as well (I actually played against him at the last Ard Boyz)!
Also, Hulksmash ran 3 naked dreadknights along with 60 psybolt strikers to a tournament once and he won with them. It's basically a shooty army that marches upfield shooting down the enemy and daring them to assault with 3 dreadknights there.
You can build lists to make both types of dreadknights work.
jy2 wrote: R'Varna is still good. He's just not broken good like he was before. Combined with the Buffcommander, he is a tank killer. Re-roll's to scatter, S8 with tank hunter and ignore cover, he would kill any tank, land raiders included. I swear, in a game I played, he killed all of my annihilation barges. Whereas before, that guy was just nuts. I saw a game where this guy had 2 wraithknights side-by-side trying to hide behind terrain. Well, guess what the R'varna (+buffmaster) did to them with his then AP3 shots? That's right, he killed both WK's in 1 volley.
BTW, it is the R'varna in this game that killed 1 of my dreadknights in 1 volley of fire. He did 12 wounds and I failed 5 2+ saves!!!
Yea, watching a game where the opponent misdeployed that heavily must've been hard. Sucks you failed 5 2+ saves out of 12 though, but that's dice. I lost two riptides during a local tourney to weapon overheats, so that was fun.
Funnily enough, the Eldar opponent still won, but that was because he was running the frickin seer council. Lol.
y0disisray wrote: Should be really an interesting match as I don't see either army as having a superior advantage over the other. The R'Varna I think is going to under perform as 2+ saves on single models are not going to care all that much and even if he destroys something that's a lot of firepower to absorb. The GreyDau are going to have problems destroying the Wraiths and Destroyer Lords up front on Turn 1. My prediction is going to be Jy2 hiding/hanging back on Turn 1 and holding out for reserves to come in to get the alpha strike on his fliers and Wraith Star. Then he'll pounce with every thing he has on that Wraith Star.
The R'varna will surprise you. Don't under-estimate it. Despite being only AP4, he's actually caused quite a bit of damage to my big guys, including killing 1 dreadknight all by himself.
Actually, my strategy was to avoid his wraiths altogether. Unless forced, I wanted nothing to do with them.
Devil wrote: Can someone explain why he decided to go straight forward with night scythe and crush ? Flyer can pivot with locked velocity..right..
I'd have to check my BRB later when I get home. I believe when you get velocity-locked, you have to keep going forwards at the same speed, but I don't have my book here to verify.
BTW, that is also how I've been playing it with my necron flyers.
If that's the case, then we made a mistake in this game and I've been playing my flyers wrong. Could've saved a few night scythes throughout my necron career.
jy2 wrote: If that's the case, then we made a mistake in this game and I've been playing my flyers wrong. Could've saved a few night scythes throughout my necron career.
Not that you've needed it But this next turn I think your opponent is gonna lose ALOT of his troops...Kroot are dead for sure from the Dreadknight, and he's probably going to lose a Scythe from the Storm Raven
jy2 wrote: If that's the case, then we made a mistake in this game and I've been playing my flyers wrong. Could've saved a few night scythes throughout my necron career.
You may be getting confused with Stunned results for fliers (which admittedly don't happen that much for Crons) which do force you to move directly forward 18". Its one of the weird quirks of the flier rules, as being Vector Locked is annoying but doesn't hurt you that much, whereas Stunned means you can be auto killed by guys in the way.
jy2 wrote: If that's the case, then we made a mistake in this game and I've been playing my flyers wrong. Could've saved a few night scythes throughout my necron career.
You may be getting confused with Stunned results for fliers (which admittedly don't happen that much for Crons) which do force you to move directly forward 18". Its one of the weird quirks of the flier rules, as being Vector Locked is annoying but doesn't hurt you that much, whereas Stunned means you can be auto killed by guys in the way.
Yeah, probably.
Ironically, I've failed more Living Metal tests than I've passed for being stunned.
's, thus giving my opponent First Blood. He also gets +1-pt for killing a Big Gun Heavy Support unit.
.....Bay Area Open GT 2013 - Best Tyranids 
.....LVO GT 2014 Team Tournament - Best Generals
1750
1750
4000 
Cratfworld Alaitoc (
Order of the Red Mantle (
-5000 Pts. of Orks
13000
