Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Verthane wrote:

tag8833 wrote:

1) if you want Melee Carnifexes you should look at the Stone Crusher varient: It is considerable tougher than normal carnifexes and has some wargear options that make it intriguing.

2) Tyranid Prime can't join units of Carnifexes any more. It is a significant nerf. He doesn't work great unless you are running hoards. So I suggest one of two options.
A) Deathleaper - He is cheap, and give you opponent something to shoot at for a bit before dying. Alternatively he can deep strike without scatter.
B) Go full hog and run a dakka-Flyrant like the rest of us. It give you good anti-air, and some psychic support.
3) Malanthropes. The are the ideal support for Meleefexes. 1 Per 4-5 Carnifexes.
4) Gargoyles. They will keep your Carnifexes alive until they get there.
5) Carnifexes don't have to be fluffy/bad. They are our 3rd or 4th best unit. This Carnifex Spam list would do very well, against many, many things.

Spoiler:

Hive Tyrant (Wings, 2 TL-Devourers, E. Grubs)
Hive Tyrant (Wings, 2 TL-Devourers, E. Grubs)
Malanthrope
Malanthrope
20 Hormagants
20 Hormagants
20 Gargoyles
2 Carnifexes (2 TL-Devourers)
2 Carnifexes (2 TL-Devourers)
2 Carnifexes (2 TL-Devourers)
I've run this list a few times. It works very, very well, and tables quite a few opponents.

Thanks, tag, I appreciate the suggestions!
The stonecrushers are an excellent idea, and I do really like the idea of using deathleaper for the HQ.

Malanthropes seem ideal; the thought of 6-7 Zoeies moving them up and providing support also seems fun, if probably less effective.

The list looks very solid. Pulling from it, hormagants might be a good call too.

Hormagants are highly devisive these days. However if you are running a Walking MC list, Hormagants or Gargoyles are a requirement. There are lots and lots of stuff out there that can beat our MC's in assault, fortunately most things that punk our MC's don't do so hot against a giant fearless mob. They also work well as a sort of advancing Aegis Line if you are using Dakkafexes.

The reason its got to be hormagants or gargoyles is that they can outrun the MC's, and thus don't get in their way as you advance them.

I always include Hormagants in my TAC lists mainly because I play a much more aggressive and flexible game then most Tyranid players.

ETS: Hormgants are devicive not decisive.

Are your hormagaunts bare bones?

Verviedi I would recommend playing him again in a mirror match on an appropriate table. This would serve a number of good functions:

1) you will get a chance to understand his army better and how it functions. Sometimes, we don't really understand what our target priority should be until we play the army and see what our valuable units really are. Also, watching what he goes for will tell you a great deal about what you should go for when you play him

2) it will give you an excellent chance to ferret out his cheating ways. Look through his codex while he is explaining how his army works. If he can't show you the rule that allows his army to function in the way that he says it does, he is either misinformed or cheating. Either way, you will have levelled the playing field

3) use his same restrictions against him. Make sure that you play on planet bowling ball, using the longest deployment you can, and sit back and blast the bejesus out of those Nids. Do not allow him any more terrain than he allows you. Most importantly, when he complains (and he will) that you are playing for an advantage, EXPLAIN CLEARLY TO HIM THST THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT HE WAS DOING TO YOU. Don't actually shout when you do this - I've just emphasized it because it is so incredibly important. Whether he realizes what he's doing or not (and I believe that he does) the best way to turn the tables is to present him with the same set of ridiculous demands and when he says that he doesn't want to play it that way, you say these simple words:

"Ok man. We won't play it that way. You're right - it does seem a little un-fair. Do you mind if in the future we don't play like this if I'm using Nids and you're using Tau?"

That little litmus test will tell you everything you need to know about him. If he refuses to give you a fair game after that, you absolutely need to find a new opponent.

On a completely different note, I think you'll find that there are a number of people here who are genuinely interested in helping you or any other Tyranid players consume the galaxy. People don't always come across the way that they intend to, and I know in guilty of that myself. But if you've ever got specific questions, feel free to shoot me a PM. I'm not the most experienced general, but I'd be glad to help you out. 40k is a really fun and thematic game when you do it right. Would hate to see someone lose interest just because they can't find someone to play who's a decent human being


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So this new super-lictor, or whatever it turns out to be, got me thinking - I wonder how it might work with....you know...actual lictors lol. Maybe not even regular lictors, but Deathleaper seems like a pretty decent candidate for a list with this dude. I know our knowledge of the new guy is very limited, so I wanted to focus on Deathleaper - has anyone had success running him? Seems like with shadows, the leadership reduction, and now maybe even that new Psychic bug we could have some interesting synergy. I know that some of the biggest reasons for excluding Deathleaper previously were:

1) you would have to take one less Flyrant
2) Deathleaper doesn't have Synapse (really, just take the Flyrant)
3) Deathleaper costs a lot for what he does (unlike a Flyrant, who can do everything)

Number three is still true, as are the not-so-veiled reminders that a Flyrant is, in many ways, just so much better. That being said, there seems to be a lot of potential Deathleaper synergy (and I do not mean with a Mawloc, although I'll probably still run one because why not). Maybe with some Raveners (or Shrikes because I know a lot of people like those more) you could have something resembling a decently assaulty list that wouldn't be too bad. This seems especially possible with the advent of the Malanthrope (or whatever you use) giving cheap synapse, abundant cover saves, and the fact that many places are opening up to self-ally or even double CAD.

On a related note, my FLGS is thinking about running a "true 7th edition tournament", meaning that if GW says it's ok, then it is. Quadruple CAD? Go for it. Forge World Lords of war? As long as they're on Forge World's list of Lords of War we're good. I've been talking to the tournament organizer and it seems like there's a decent chance that they'll use the BAO missions, so it will be incredibly interesting to see what happens. TBH I'm pretty torn as to whether I should bring a Harridan + Skyblight or a Hierophant + whatever

I ran my little RTT on Saturday. Since I was TO and Judge I didn't get to play. Thankfully, we are rotating TO duties and so I get to play the next one. The winning list was Space Wolves Drop Pods with Sentinals of Terra Grav Centurions in them. Specifically:

I understand completely how this list beat the Tau gunline for 1st overall, but my opinion is that I would generally roll this list easily. The Centurions come in and Alpha Strike hard, but without hit and run / Ignore Cover / GOI / or Levitate (he was rolling for it, but just 1 dice), I can just send over some Gargoyles / Gants to babysit them for 5 turns while I kill everything else. Is there any hidden threat that I'm not seeing here? 15 TL(prescience) Grav Shots are still only going to hit a flier 4.58 times, and even if they wound, I still cover save / jink away 1/2 of them. Between 2/3+ cover and FNP, my Barbed Heirodule would even survive long enough to get the tarpits in place.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AdeptSister wrote:
Are your hormagaunts bare bones?

I always run hormagants bare bones unless i am doing a themed list, or tailoring to one specific opponent.

Nope, like most drop pod armies you'd have to try pretty hard to lose against that one. Tough list for some other armies to face but I'm confident I'd steamroll that as well

Maleceptor Pic:

http://instagram.com/p/uq7ZsIgPm7/

Different angle for the Toxicrene:

http://instagram.com/p/uq5Wk7APjf/

I have to say the Toxicrene looks a lot cooler than it did in the first pic (especially if it actually comes with a blood angel to curb stomp lol). May just have to get that bad boy even if the rules are lackluster. I am definitely GW's favorite kind of sucker

Maleceptor looks like something out of Starship Troopers

A fun part of my day was spent playing this list;


Chapter Master on Bike
shield, thunder hammer, artificer armour, grav pistol.

Bike squad
2x Grav
Combi grav

Bike squad
2x Grav
Combi grav

Tactical squad
Lascannon

Stalker

Storm Talon
Lascannon


Storm Talon
Lascannon

Typhon Heavy Siege Tank
Lascannon sponsons

Assasin formation.


my list was

Flyrant
Flyrant
Rippers
Rippers
Malanthrope
Dima
Hive Crone
Mawloc
Mawloc

LAN

...without going into detail, that was probably the most upsetting game I've ever had.

Assasins are upsettingly good...

First turn I lost my LAN and a hive crone to the Caladis and orbital bombardment.
second turn I lost the Malanthrope and the Dima to the Culexus.
third turn I just lost the enthusiasm to carry on playing. ( I lie, I lost it after turn one!)
half way through turn 4, all I had left was 1 Flyrant and 2 ripper swarms left. I have never been beaten that badly - I don't know if it's because the assassins caught me off guard and so I freaked out or if they really are that good. either way, I played awfully and they are extremely good.

Any pointers on how to deal with these!? they all infiltrate as well. mental!

Grab a bastion bro. What alpha strike?

luke1705 wrote:
Grab a bastion bro. What alpha strike?

Orbital bombardment/ Typhon would just blits a bastion.

The range on the typhon goes way down if the siege tank has moved. Remember that you can get a cover save for the bastion if you deploy it behind terrain such that it is obscured (not increased by the Malanthrope sadly). Sounds in general like you needed more cover that game. Your whole LAN wasn't benefitting from the Malanthrope's cover save?

But really, the bastion is quite durable. Yes, the orbital bombardment might take it down. Cool. You've still got your Malanthrope and he has no orbital bombardment.

luke1705 wrote:
The range on the typhon goes way down if the siege tank has moved. Remember that you can get a cover save for the bastion if you deploy it behind terrain such that it is obscured (not increased by the Malanthrope sadly). Sounds in general like you needed more cover that game. Your whole LAN wasn't benefitting from the Malanthrope's cover save?

But really, the bastion is quite durable. Yes, the orbital bombardment might take it down. Cool. You've still got your Malanthrope and he has no orbital bombardment.

The assassins just freaked me out. I've never come up against 4 of them before and having them all there in my midst just completely threw me off!

There was a lot of terrain on the board, I think I just went into feck it mode. too many big threats. no way to avoid them all. better off just letting the bad stuff happen...

Also, even with the Typhons halved range, it still has a max range of 36"...

I avoided it for 1 turn which is all I could manage really.

roxor08 wrote:

Spoiler:

 Iechine wrote:
Hey guys, just posted round 1 of Mechanicon here.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/620341.page#7302375

I face off against an Adamantium Knight list.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I had high hopes for you!! Tough matchup first opponent too.....It's too bad you landed your Flyrants. I feel like had you not done that you would have had more of a chance.

On a side note, I decided on the list I am going to be bringing for my next 1850 (FW allowed, limited LOW, allies allowed although 2 sources max, and Tyranids can self ally, will be using LVO FAQ and similar LVO mission packet):

CAD
DakkaFlyrant - E.grubs
DakkaFlyrant - E.grubs
Malenthrope
3 Deep striking Rippers
3 Deep striking Rippers
3 Deep striking Rippers
3 Deep striking Rippers
15 Gargoyles
Mawloc
Mawloc
Tyrannofex - Adrenal Glands, E.grubs
Allies
DakkaFlyrant - E.grubs
Venomthrope
3 Deep striking Rippers
Tyrannofex - Adrenal Glands, E.grubs
Total = 1845

Played a two games using two of the missions in the packet. Lost 6-7 against Fire Cadre Tau with FW HQ, 2 sniper teams, Riptide, and 2 solo fusion suits. Mission was eliminate 3 targets (worth 4 points as primary), modified maelstrom (worth 3 points as secondary), and each tertiary worth 1 point with a modified First blood so each player can achieve it. There were a couple misplays on my part, and a couple misplays by my opponent. Otherwise great guy and cool fluffy list. However, does anyone know how killing an Ethereal counts towards the final point count at the end of a game that doesn't use VP scoring?

Second game was against SM/GK using the Sicarian tank. His list included a Chaplain, Libby, a unit of 6 Terminators, 2 Tac squads with Lascannons, 2 Tac squads in Rhinos with melta, 2 Legion of the Damned with combi-melta, multimelta, and meltagun, the Stormclaw gunship?, and a unit of GK Terminators. I won this game 7-6. It was a mission that involved table quarters + middle circle (4 points as primary), modified maelstrom (worth 3 points as secondary), and each tertiary worth 1 point with a modified First blood so each player can achieve it. Again, my opponent was good guy. We both had our share of luck, including one of my Mawlocs wiping half his HQ terminator unit out turn 2 and denying his Gate of infinity turn 1. He had his Sicarian tank immobilize itself turn 2. Actually, now that I've written the bit about luck, luck was definitely in my favor through that game. Either way, great opponent, awesome list.

Couple thoughts:

Gargoyles, didn't do much. Actually, they didn't do anything except force my opponents to shoot at them, in order to remove the mobile cover unit for my larger units. They almost got to tie up a Riptide game 1.

Double T-fex. Wow. SUPER durable. Given, both my opponents were expecting armor heavy opponents, so the matchups slightly favored me because the lack of AP2 weaponry really hurt them.

Mawlocs are awesome. Enough said.

I could probably find something better to put points into instead of the Gargoyles, but the buffer between drop marines is nice to have...

What do you guys thinks?

With regards to the Ethereal worth 2x VP's, the BAO/LVO plays it (and Warlord traits giving you VP's for slaying other characters or whatnot) that they count towards the Secondary mission. Basically, unless the bonuses pertain directly to the Primary mission itself (i.e. Scouring Fast Attacks, Big Guns Heavy supports), all other bonus VP's from Warlord Traits and/or codex-specific rules count towards the Secondaries.

I think you need to run a larger unit of gargoyles. I'd recommend at least a unit of 20. You can drop 1 unit of rippers (you've got way too many IMO) to fit in more gargoyles. They really are a great utility unit but don't work as well in smaller numbers (unless you are playing recyclable Skyblight gargoyles).

Verviedi wrote:

SBG wrote:
I and others have been giving him advice for days on his other thread, but to no effect whatsoever.

To the point where it is coming across as a purposeful attempt at 'doing it wrong'. Happy if I'm wrong, but look at the long thread he's got going about 'OP Hammerheads' that kill multipleflyrants per turn and you'll see what I mean. I've offered advice aplenty, but we're all entitled to our opinions. Cheers.

Really? You think I'm TRYING to do it wrong? I've been trying to beat that bastard for a few months. I play the most competitive list I can vs. his unoptimized mess, and lose every single damn time thanks to always being disadvantaged purposefully by him. He won't play me if I have enough terrain on the board, he won't play me if there is a possibility he won't win because the objectives can't be camped. He BUYS HIS UNITS AND BUILDS THEM to be as effective as possible against nids, and abuses the hell out of the BS rules governing Tau and FMCs. I can guarantee I always go last due to my crappy rolling, and thanks to the absolute gak rules that say FMCs start in Gliding mode and can't switch into Swooping mode until your turn, my dual dakkarants always eat Railgun and Pulse Rifle shots first turn. While I roll 1s for my run moves, he's wiping entire squads of Gaunts with Submunition rounds that ignore cover, and dropping dual flamer deathstars into my Venomthropes and Zoanthropes. Do you know how fething infuriating that is? AND YOU ACCUSE ME OF TROLLING ABOUT IT? I've wasted hundreds of dollars on my bugs, and I can't win a single damn game with them.

My honest opinion is that you need to FIRM UP. DO NOT always give in to him. It's like you're willing to play with 1 hand tied behind your back. Dice roll you can't do anything about. He is also able to tailor his list against yours, just as you are able to tailor your list against his. However, what you can do and what you SHOULD do is to INSIST on the other factors being fair. That means the types of terrain used, terrain placement, deployment of your forces, and other stuff that should not be beyond your control. After all, he wants to play just as much as you. Why do you have to give in to his unfair treatment/advantage? Be firm. Be honest. Tell him that these games are not fair and that you are sick of being taken advantage of. INSIST on having a fair game where terrain is adequate and fairly placed.

1 thing I normally do with my opponents is to take turns placing terrain. Therefore, there is no pre-terrain deployment that gives advantage to one side and disadvantage to another. Roll off to see who places terrain first and then take turns placing terrain. Do so until at least 25% of the table is filled with terrain (25% is about the standard for a terrain placement, with a mixture of area terrain, ruins and Line-of-sight blocking terrain.)

If you continue to let him take advantage of you, then you've really got no one to blame for not standing up for yourself.

WOW! Those new nid models are AWESOME!!!!
Cant wait for the rules, especially the maleceptor since it mentions that they use psychic powers to destroy vehicles like living beings !!!

Im sooo happy about this new model ! Oh and someone tell Incontrol he cant call zoanthropes the brain bugs anymore because the maleceptor has 6 of them ! LOL

 cyberjonesy wrote:
WOW! Those new nid models are AWESOME!!!!
Cant wait for the rules, especially the maleceptor since it mentions that they use psychic powers to destroy vehicles like living beings !!!

Im sooo happy about this new model ! Oh and someone tell Incontrol he cant call zoanthropes the brain bugs anymore because the maleceptor has 6 of them ! LOL

There are rules floating around - the majority of the Tyranid community don't like them at present. The Psychic Power the Maleceptor(?)has only causes one glance IIRC.

Everyone is just hoping for 12 inch movement, as well as better

The rules floating around seem made up, id rather wait for more concrete evidence before talking tactics.

I really hope theese 2 models dont turn out to be like 2 haruspex kind of deal.

So I know how everyone is wondering whether or not these new bugs will pan out....just thinking about them got me in the mood to paint some of my Nids. This isn't a finished product by any means yet (and I can't draw my way out of a paper bag so even this is progress) but I thought you guys might like to see a critter that I've been using as a Harpy. Technically modeled for advantage? Sure I guess you could call it that. I call it "modeled for awesome". I'm sure some people will recognize the base model (only cost me $10 more than a harpy too!)

I swear my camera just decides what orientation they'll be on a whim.

I've got a Kill Team Tourney coming up. I've never played kill team before. 200 Points. No MC's, No fliers, every model for itself. Seems like it will be rough for Tyranids, because shrouded bubbles won't work well.

Does anyone have advice for playing kill team?

Three Warriors/Shrikes-Barbed Strangler with Ignore Cover, One with Eternal Warrior. One is Warlord.
Termagants/Gargoyles
Hive Guard with preferred enemy.
Some like a Venomthrope. I prefer Warriors so I can take Gargoyles.

just swarm your ennemy with gaunts, im sure you ought to scare the hell out of your oponent on a 200 pt game where you bring 50 models

That's also 50 instinctive behavior tests per turn... Just rolling for all that will make people give up out of exasperation.

 cyberjonesy wrote:
just swarm your ennemy with gaunts, im sure you ought to scare the hell out of your oponent on a 200 pt game where you bring 50 models

50% of them would run off the board, and then I'd have to take break tests every turns in addition to synapse. It would be a slaughter, but not the way you think.

200pts is very limiting. About all you can run are three Shrikes plus Termagants or Hormagaunts really.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I assume you're still choosing USRs?

Luke that's a cool Harpy substitute man. Nothing I love more than seeing people doing their own thing.

 Sinful Hero wrote:
200pts is very limiting. About all you can run are three Shrikes plus Termagants or Hormagaunts really.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I assume you're still choosing USRs?

Yep. Choosing USRs.

Almost always I prefer Shrikes to Warriors. But in a Kill Team environment, I'm wonder if warriors might be better because of their 4+ armor save, and I5.

I was thinking this:
3 Warriors (Deathspitters, RCs) <- Give one E.W.(warlord), give one Armorbane on the Deathspitter, give one Shrouded.
16 Hormagants

tag8833 wrote:

 cyberjonesy wrote:
just swarm your ennemy with gaunts, im sure you ought to scare the hell out of your oponent on a 200 pt game where you bring 50 models

50% of them would run off the board, and then I'd have to take break tests every turns in addition to synapse. It would be a slaughter, but not the way you think.

My bad you re right, did nt think about synapse lol.
how bout a zoan , a venomthrope then all termagants.move from ruins to ruins for 2+ cover
Ought to be hella fun !

tag8833 wrote:

 Sinful Hero wrote:
200pts is very limiting. About all you can run are three Shrikes plus Termagants or Hormagaunts really.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I assume you're still choosing USRs?

Yep. Choosing USRs.

Almost always I prefer Shrikes to Warriors. But in a Kill Team environment, I'm wonder if warriors might be better because of their 4+ armor save, and I5.

I was thinking this:
3 Warriors (Deathspitters, RCs) <- Give one E.W.(warlord), give one Armorbane on the Deathspitter, give one Shrouded.
16 Hormagants

Unfortunately you can't give your Warlord a Specialization, so you'll have to waste one on gants. It would be easier to hit side or rear armor with Shrikes, but a 4+ save is pretty awesome in Kill Teams- almost everything is AP5 except for their one or two antitank weapons. Also, the Taurox is a BEAST and will instagib your warriors.

I personally prefer including a Barbed Strangler to take care of pesky hordes(Orks mainly, Guard as well). There's usually always a few good targets, although it's almost exclusively anti-infantry. So it's really up to personal taste. Deathspitters are the bee's knees, but I would feel Rending Claws are wasted. Most things you'd be in CC with Scything Talons are enough. Other things you dakka down with Deathspitters.

 Sinful Hero wrote:
Unfortunately you can't give your Warlord a Specialization, so you'll have to waste one on gants. It would be easier to hit side or rear armor with Shrikes, but a 4+ save is pretty awesome in Kill Teams- almost everything is AP5 except for their one or two antitank weapons. Also, the Taurox is a BEAST and will instagib your warriors.

I personally prefer including a Barbed Strangler to take care of pesky hordes(Orks mainly, Guard as well). There's usually always a few good targets, although it's almost exclusively anti-infantry. So it's really up to personal taste. Deathspitters are the bee's knees, but I would feel Rending Claws are wasted. Most things you'd be in CC with Scything Talons are enough. Other things you dakka down with Deathspitters.

Luckily, my local meta HATE the taurox. I don't think anybody has one. Personally I think it looks a little funny, but don't think it is that bad.

The RC's were my idea for an alternate anti-tank weapon in case the armorbane didn't get it done. I see so many Rhinos, Razorbacks, and Chimeras in normal games that I'm sure to see one in Kill team, and a Tac Squad in a Rhino or a Veteran Squad in a Chimera make an awful hard nut to Crack. Something like 2 Scout squads in Land Speeders seems nearly unbeatable.

I'll definitely consider an ignore cover Barbed Strangler. Would Shred perhaps be an even better USR?

Probably depends a lot on your tables- is there a lot of area terrain for mooks to hide in? It's also a little bit of personal preference. And jetbikes. Ignores cover eats them alive.

Mind if I ask why Hormagaunts over Gargoyles? They have a better IB, a gun, blind/poison attack, and can move much faster. Not to mention just two or three per warrior works as mobile cover. Granted, hormagaunts can do the cover thing as well.

 Sinful Hero wrote:

Mind if I ask why Hormagaunts over Gargoyles? They have a better IB, a gun, blind/poison attack, and can move much faster. Not to mention just two or three per warrior works as mobile cover. Granted, hormagaunts can do the cover thing as well.

In kill teams IB: Feed is actually better, as each model counts as its own squad. Thus, all results are automatically upgraded to "Devour" (must assault if possible, no run) which is less debilitating than self-pinning (can't do anything but snap-shoot).