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Flachzange wrote:

G_Model101 wrote:All you non suscribers...you don't know what you're missing!
I mean theres a page long artilce/advert about the new GW gaming mat!
Thats right a green tablecloth!
A green tablecloth that costs £18!!!!!!

Uh wow, i better go right now, buy and check the german WD if its in there as well.

Hopefully for at least 20 € !!!!!!!!

Were lucky its 25€ ! ONLY 2 5 €

I love the WD and have not missed one for a few years. i dont see why there some much hate for a fine product, although i do understand that some people claim there is a lack of content or too pricey. i would like to see more little free bees in the WD

Its mainly because the magazine has deteriorated recently. It was a great source for hobby information, yet now it is more like a brochure advertising GW's products. However, they have promised to turn this around.

When WD went global thats when the music died, all the army profiles disappeard, same with conversion corner, and pretty much what blinky just said too

Phryxis wrote:I don't really get why people complain about how expensive WD is. If you can't afford $6 a month for something to read when you're in the can, isn't that more of a commentary on your lack of earning power than it is on the publishers of WD?

"I'm poor, therefore you suck!"

Really?

I could be a millionaire and I wouldn't buy it. There's no content to make it worth the time to sit down with it. Regardless of your earnings and how much money you have, many people believe in getting 'value for money'.

I flick through WD each month but find nothing to tempt me, what I was amazed at is how spread out everything has become. For a battle report the army lists were spread over a few pages with a lot of white space between each chunk of words detailing the various units. A few years ago the whole army list would have been crammed onto a page making more room elsewhere articles. The painting articles and 'eavy metal sections often seem to use the same old photos that are in the catalog or available online, it's smacks of padding with minimal effort. The volume of material has gone down even if the page count has remained the same, I bought WD on and off and have numerous back issues ranging to a collection spanning #100-300.

The difference? Well those older issues took longer to read, and I've re-read them and can think of many memorable articles. Of the later stuff, nah, they took less time to read and have little worth going back to. What happened to the days when they'd supply plans and tell you how to build a vehicle for your orks from card? hell they even gave full rules and plans to make a Baneblade! Or when they had new rules for you to use detailing a specific marine chapter or vehicle? When did they last support a Specialist game giving you battle reports, new rules for equipment and events tables on which to roll as they did with Gorkamorka? What about the free "bar-room-brawl" game that they did in the magazine to coincide with Gorkamorka with pull out counters and a floorplan, or the Full Tilt jousting game with card scenery - for a game to play in itself? Or when they went mad giving away card buildings with every issue? Or the individual painting articles featuring players and shop staff armies from around the globe? Or you know, a few pages of background fluff?

yakface wrote:The issue for most people stems from the fact that White Dwarf used to be a very different magazine from what it is now and the people who 'hate' it now are those that liked the magazine the way it was before.

True, but the criticism is fair. And people complained to the extent the GW shut down the White Dwarf section on their own forum just to silence dissent. They asked for advice on improving the magazine, and to be fair several people gave them calm and considered advice. But clearly it wasn't what the people high up wanted in the magazine, there was no quick fix to satisfy customers and as they were not going to amend the magazine in light of common criticism they closed down discussion.

The magazine today is just dull.

Yeah, even though I used to be a big WD fan, I'm now counted among the haters. Once upon a time, there used to be usable content in WD. In fact, there's a direct relationship to the length of time WD has been printed and the decline of usable material in it. Anymore, anything creative and interesting that you could get from WD you can get online either in a forum like Dakka or from the so-called "hobby" articles on GW's site itself (not that those articles are incredible pearls or anything, I'm just saying.) WDs these days are just shiny pics of new minis with the subtext of "Buy me! Buy me!"

had a quick flick through a 2nd time - point - articles are mainly one read only ones now. Old mags, can read again, current ones, nothing new.

With the whole 'we're going to make it more like the old days' there's a comment that next issue they're bringing back a tale of 4 gamers, but for 40K. YES!!!! just hope they do a better job of it than with the last attempt to resurrect the article. Will give JErvis a snail mail letter at some point soon and let you know if i get a response.

the best thing i seen is on page 37 of the us edition in the last paragraph from rick priestly " its about time the DARK ELDAR, space wolves, and A FEW OTHERS had THEIR turn in the spotlight again." great to hear.....

1hadhq wrote:

Flachzange wrote:

G_Model101 wrote:All you non suscribers...you don't know what you're missing!
I mean theres a page long artilce/advert about the new GW gaming mat!
Thats right a green tablecloth!
A green tablecloth that costs £18!!!!!!

Uh wow, i better go right now, buy and check the german WD if its in there as well.

Hopefully for at least 20 € !!!!!!!!

Were lucky its 25€ ! ONLY 2 5 €

WD UK says €27,5 but the website says €30,-

Funny enough the UK WD wants to restart "a tale of four gamers" next month for 40k, something that was only good fun in its original form. The fantasy retry was a failure at trying to capture the feel of the original article and I have a feeling that the 40k series will likewise.

We need Fat Bloke at the helm again! Not Owen Reese or ahem sorry, the White Dwarf.

BrookM wrote:Funny enough the UK WD wants to restart "a tale of four gamers" next month for 40k, something that was only good fun in its original form. The fantasy retry was a failure at trying to capture the feel of the original article and I have a feeling that the 40k series will likewise.

We need Fat Bloke at the helm again! Not Owen Reese or ahem sorry, the White Dwarf.

I remember when Fat Bloke used to spend his extra money on bacon buddies....

out of curiosity what happened to fat bloke? I quite enjoyed some of the articles he made.

Has anyone mentioned the fact that WD takes up a lot of shelf space? That's one reason (among many of the legitimate reasons already mentioned) that I don't buy it regularly. I don't even buy it occasionally (but that's because it's not a very good magazine). I flick through it when I see it but never go further than that.

two_heads_talking wrote:

Jervis used to answer any and all emials and he did it very quickly and very clearly. Now, to be honest, I am not sure he can.. I imagine that 10 years ago he got a few hundred emails.. not he probably gets that many a day.. Not trying to be negative, but the guy is only human.. maybe he needs a few servitors to scan the emails for him.. lol

WD july 08 page 82 standardbearer:
Quote Jervis: " I have no servitor squad to scan my e-mails, read them myself!"

An answer to you,I suppose?

NAVARRO wrote:out of curiosity what happened to fat bloke? I quite enjoyed some of the articles he made.

He's in GW accounting now if his last editorial is to be believed.

NAVARRO wrote:out of curiosity what happened to fat bloke? I quite enjoyed some of the articles he made.

He's making plastic historical miniatures with John Stallard for Warlord Games.

I'm a little behind, but on p. 35 it says under good 'ol Gav's pic that he's left the company to become a freebooter? I'm guessing that was a few months ago? Damn! He so needed a proper rochambo-ing for the end of the SoC.

No doubt he did!

Archaon (and Gav!) really needed to be "gifted" into Spawndom after that fiasco...

Well, this month they did away with the Editorial by the "White Dwarf" and actually had the editor do it (thank god!).

Also, they are bringing back Tale of Four Gamers so that's a step in the right direction as the previous one was one of the best WD features ever.

Overall, this WD was much better than previous ones. I liked the commentary with the 4 veteran game designers and the battle report was pretty good (they gave the caveat up front that the armies were chosen to show off the new rules).

Hopefully this is a sign of good things to come.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

Squig_herder wrote:I would like to see more little free bees in the WD

.. to take the sting out of paying for it you mean ?


.. sorry.

Gitkikka wrote:

NAVARRO wrote:out of curiosity what happened to fat bloke? I quite enjoyed some of the articles he made.

He's making plastic historical miniatures with John Stallard for Warlord Games.

I seem to recall he even posted on Warseer about his stuff, which I found a nice touch.

The magazine is $6, the average price for a magazine of its size. The content is basic level stuff, targeting the beginner hobbiest. If you want something more, then look else where. It is not unlike your run of the mill cooking or lifestyle magazine. Simple layout of uncomplicated articles. Yes, I am tired of the excess of LoTR content, but what are you going to do?

What you could do is submit well written articles for publications. A year or two back, WD solicited community written articles. They may still do that. So, if you think you have the chops, go for it.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Iorek wrote:About two or three years ago, I called to see how much a subscription to White Dwarf was. I let my subscriptions lapse in the late 90's, and the sticker shock...er, shocked me. I remembered paying $24 a year (or some such number) and the $60 a year price was way too steep for what you get.

It's not a lack of earning power on my part, it's the fact that it's not a good bang for my buck.

Normally, magazine subscriptions provide a substantial discount to the subscriber. Like 50%. Or higher.

So if WD is $6 on the cover, the 1-year subscription should be less than $40. With a "bonus" thrown in. Not $60+.

If GW did discount their subscription rate, over the magazine rack rate, they would see their sales increase, even if ever so slightly. I know I would go back to getting them regularly if their was a cheaper subscription rate.

Although I have been getting the White Dwarf back when 75 dollars was the going rate for a year. But that was because it was still a UK magazine and the shipping rates were ludicrous.

KurgantheLurker wrote:At the Developers Open Day in UK today this was evidently attributed to Rick Priestly:

http://warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148115&page=6

WD - All WD'sc are now centrally controlled from Lenton to prevent as Rick put it 'anarchy!' They are quite aay of the lack of hobby content in the mag and are looking to remedy this.

Interesting thing was how vocal Rick P. was re; GW / WD policy - he seemed very hacked off at the direction WD had / is taking, and that now the design studio had more control over Wd, he'd like to see more rules based stuff in there... - in fact, there was projec the nearly mentioned, but stopped short after a glare from Tim....

And there was word recently that GWCan was being absorbed by GWUS. Don't know if that means your "even more horrible than ours" WD will change but that in conjunction with what Priestly said may give you Cannucks hope yet.

The part about Rick P. being hacked off has been proved to be nothing more than heresay.. It's just rumor ...

Ozymandias wrote:Well, this month they did away with the Editorial by the "White Dwarf" and actually had the editor do it (thank god!).

Also, they are bringing back Tale of Four Gamers so that's a step in the right direction as the previous one was one of the best WD features ever.

Overall, this WD was much better than previous ones. I liked the commentary with the 4 veteran game designers and the battle report was pretty good (they gave the caveat up front that the armies were chosen to show off the new rules).

Hopefully this is a sign of good things to come.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

I don't know if anyone else noticed or commented on this, but in that battle report for 5E.. the Space Marines had a Terminator Squad with 2 Assault Cannons. I HOPE this means that they can continue to have 2 in whatever new codex arrives for the Emperor's Boyz..

anyone else notice this, or think much of it? Am I hoping too much?

The space marine list was built from the current marine codex mate, as the new marine codex isn't out yet remember ? You'll note they also have a few odd squad sizes and at least 1 5 mans quad with a alscannon if memory serves.

Squig_herder wrote:I love the WD and have not missed one for a few years. i dont see why there some much hate for a fine product, although i do understand that some people claim there is a lack of content or too pricey. i would like to see more little free bees in the WD

First of all, it has always been an ad rag. Always. Even in its earliest days it was an ad rag, but atleast the content was more than merely an ad.

I still have very early issues of white dwarf where they sold more than just GW stuff. They had gammaworld scenarios, runequest scenarios, D&D scenarios, etc. and the interspersed advertisements from various game companies trying to offer a product, including citadel in its early days.

Fast forward to a time when GW focused solely on their own products.

While still an ad rag it still had usable content.

Rules for Jet bike duels
Space hulk tiles and scenarios
creature feature
etc.
The list goes on.

That content is now largely gone, if not completely. Now you get an occasional fluff blurb, a page of painted models to drool over, and the rest is Jervis pontificating about how we should play the game, and advertisements for the flavor of the month. And maybe, just maybe a BA codex that they are just going to post online for free anyways.

This hardly seems like value to most people who want to read the magazine. Not only can they not be bothered to read it anymore, but feel GW should be paying us for the august privilege of reading their periodical, or 'fine product' as you put it.

I don't care if it costs 25 cents for an issue, its still to much to pay to be advertised to. Most companies actually pay for advertising. Instead, GW expects its consumers to line up and pay to be advertised to.

Judging by what Priestly has remarked on, it seems they realize that this tactic wont pass the snuff anymore and they have to add something to coax the GW consumer to again pay for their advertisements.

This is why WD is universally considered a bad buy.

[edit]

However, in GW's defense, the internet has a large portion to be blamed for the reduction in quality regarding the content of WD.

Prior to the internet boom, to get any discussion about GW products, consumer relied upon WD for such. Now that we have discussion forums, and various other sites devoted to the hobby, the role of WD is much reduced.

That still didn't prevent actual content being included in WD though during that time however.

It seems once Andy Chambers left, the WD content pretty much fizzled to non existence.

Dont believe me? Compare issues pre2003 with what we get now and you will see an obvious difference.

Some of the bet hobby articles I've seen of recent years were on the Black Gobbo, I couldn't understand why they were spending money on that and not using it for the magazine, some of it was great, conversions, scratchbuilding and terrain articles.

Then they took the inexplicable step of getting rid of black gobbo, and wiped the archive as though to spite people who may want to look at it.

It's all run by the bean counters now, whoever is editing the magazine probably hasn't got the editorial control of years gone by so I don't think the blame entirely lies with Owen Reese or whoever is 'running' it today.

Write in your articles if you like, but they don't publish their own hobby material like they used to, so unsolicited mail will end up unwanted in a slush pile somewhere.

Hellfury wrote:
However, in GW's defense, the internet has a large portion to be blamed for the reduction in quality regarding the content of WD.

Prior to the internet boom, to get any discussion about GW products, consumer relied upon WD for such. Now that we have discussion forums, and various other sites devoted to the hobby, the role of WD is much reduced.

That still didn't prevent actual content being included in WD though during that time however.
.

Thats the big challenge for all traditional paper mags these days, to lure people out of the internet to actually by them... that can only be achieved with high quality and exclusive contents.
Publicity wise GW is completly OFF the mark and if by flooding their mag with only publicity is their idea of making good publicity then they know very little about the subject... Actually most companies that do their own inside publicity only have a distorted prespective of what their potential costumers want... Thats why there are publicity agencies!!!

Just imagine a high quality mag packed with black gobbo kind of articles, golden demons exaustive cover, battle reports infinity style, illustrations and yes some publicity... Who wouldnt get this? even just modellers/painters and gamers of other systems and areas would embrace it.
If you ask me its a ignored chance to boost the interest of people towards GW.

Will the free models be in the magazines on the rack, or only for subscribers? I might pick up that issue if I can get it in the store....