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You guys have it all wrong. These meta builds stand no chance to my VESPID SPAM tau list muahahaha with 2 ethereal's!

I'm still waiting for MechVets (the IG list everyone is talking about as being the new uber list) to show up in the options.

What no one is taking into account is that points levels affect tier level.

2 weeks before Ard Boyz, a lower point level tourney was run in the local area. My army did extremely well ( wolves), while all the guard armies were losing big time.

Ard Boyz comes along, and all the same guard players started winning, and my army got mashed. ( having to add HQ's didn't help...I barely added anything to my force, whereas cheap chimeras and deathstrikes etc were added to the Guard).

I think when we talk top tier, we need to set a value that most GT's etc will be set at.....1750-1850. I think more armies do well at that level then the upper ones. From what Tau players say, at 2500 they are just adding fodder and nothing that helps them win.

General Hobbs wrote:
What no one is taking into account is that points levels affect tier level.

2 weeks before Ard Boyz, a lower point level tourney was run in the local area. My army did extremely well ( wolves), while all the guard armies were losing big time.

Ard Boyz comes along, and all the same guard players started winning, and my army got mashed. ( having to add HQ's didn't help...I barely added anything to my force, whereas cheap chimeras and deathstrikes etc were added to the Guard).

I think when we talk top tier, we need to set a value that most GT's etc will be set at.....1750-1850. I think more armies do well at that level then the upper ones. From what Tau players say, at 2500 they are just adding fodder and nothing that helps them win.

Very true. I know for instance that Necrons, while not necessarily top tier in 5th struggle alot in smaller games, However, at 2500, you can really build something devastating.

Similarly, I have found that Daemonzilla lists do pretty well in 2k and under. But once you get over that, its pretty easy to pick off a 4 wound MC.

And as has been pointed out with IG, the amount of armor the Gaurd can bring at 2500 in devastating. They could have more chimeras than a deathwing army has terminators.(roughly) So basically, points values need to be taken into account.

Lazarus wrote:

Also no Seer Council Eldar?

Most Mech Eldar lists do contain a Seer council - at least the "Top tier" variety do. It's also usually known as the "Super council" as it most often contains Eldrad & Yriel (or "counts as" characters like in my list)

Lazarus.

With a Seer Council army you have then doing all of your heavy lifting and killing. They are so expensive that you get very few tanks, and you use them mostly to keep your troops safe.

In a true Mech Eldar army you spend all of your points on skimmers, and their shooting is what wins you the game.

The obvious advantage that IG has over every army is its ability to field multiple heavy choices in one single force organization slot.


This is the main reason why IG at 2500 has a advantage over almost all other armies.


The ability to field that much armor in those few a slots.

Hollismason wrote:The obvious advantage that IG has over every army is its ability to field multiple heavy choices in one single force organization slot.


This is the main reason why IG at 2500 has a advantage over almost all other armies.


The ability to field that much armor in those few a slots.

Are we talking about Apocalypse ? because 40k and Apocalypse are to different things.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Orkestra wrote:I'm still waiting for MechVets (the IG list everyone is talking about as being the new uber list) to show up in the options.

Haha same here,like i said until someone can prove imp guard are as "great" as there made out,am not buying it.

Seeing as a borrowed my friends Tau and wiped the floor with a guard list am not to keen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

thedarkside69 wrote:You guys have it all wrong. These meta builds stand no chance to my VESPID SPAM tau list muahahaha with 2 ethereal's!

Sarcasm was never your strong point was it?

I just dont see Guard as being top tier. Yes, they are better than they were before, but of the 3 guard players at my 'Ard Boyz this year, not one even came close to getting in the top 6. One player had mechvets, one had horde gunline, and the last had a well rounded list.

The new Guard 'dex has a lot of cool options and new toys, but at the end of the day its still not great. They are still just guard.

I've run mechvet since the book came out (until I started playing dark eldar again), taking part in a 1750 tourney with a high standard of gaming imo (lots of GT players in the field.) and while I think they are a good army they are terribly one dimensional and ork warbosses on bikes/nob bikers (if you don't run psyker battle squads which definately aren't an auto include at 1750) and eldar seer councils are very difficult to deal with. You really lack that combat punch that thunder hammer termies or the seer council have. Ogryns are alright but very expensive and need to charge to be decent at all, they will get smashed by orks or termies imo :(. So often as the game goes on, you need to clear/pull that ork unit off an object and pin it down and mechvets struggles to do that, shooting alone sometimes isn't enough to wipe that mob out before it charges you.

Farmer wrote:

Hollismason wrote:The obvious advantage that IG has over every army is its ability to field multiple heavy choices in one single force organization slot.


This is the main reason why IG at 2500 has a advantage over almost all other armies.


The ability to field that much armor in those few a slots.

Are we talking about Apocalypse ? because 40k and Apocalypse are to different things.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Orkestra wrote:I'm still waiting for MechVets (the IG list everyone is talking about as being the new uber list) to show up in the options.

Haha same here,like i said until someone can prove imp guard are as "great" as there made out,am not buying it.

Seeing as a borrowed my friends Tau and wiped the floor with a guard list am not to keen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

thedarkside69 wrote:You guys have it all wrong. These meta builds stand no chance to my VESPID SPAM tau list muahahaha with 2 ethereal's!

Sarcasm was never your strong point was it?

The Ard Boyz tournament is set at 2500 most tourneys are in the 1750 to 2000 point range.

Hollismason wrote:

Farmer wrote:

Hollismason wrote:The obvious advantage that IG has over every army is its ability to field multiple heavy choices in one single force organization slot.


This is the main reason why IG at 2500 has a advantage over almost all other armies.


The ability to field that much armor in those few a slots.

Are we talking about Apocalypse ? because 40k and Apocalypse are to different things.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Orkestra wrote:I'm still waiting for MechVets (the IG list everyone is talking about as being the new uber list) to show up in the options.

Haha same here,like i said until someone can prove imp guard are as "great" as there made out,am not buying it.

Seeing as a borrowed my friends Tau and wiped the floor with a guard list am not to keen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

thedarkside69 wrote:You guys have it all wrong. These meta builds stand no chance to my VESPID SPAM tau list muahahaha with 2 ethereal's!

Sarcasm was never your strong point was it?

The Ard Boyz tournament is set at 2500 most tourneys are in the 1750 to 2000 point range.

I see,thanks for pointing it out,and i didn't know that "Ard Boyz" tournaments where 2500 pts since i haven't been to one unfortunately

Demogerg wrote:I just dont see Guard as being top tier. Yes, they are better than they were before, but of the 3 guard players at my 'Ard Boyz this year, not one even came close to getting in the top 6. One player had mechvets, one had horde gunline, and the last had a well rounded list.

Horde gunline is completely rock-paper-scissors and therefore terrible for tournaments, and the only thing well-rounded about a "well-rounded" IG army is the variety of other competitive builds that will stomp it into the ground.

You don't have to run mech vets to make a good guard army, but you do need play their strength, which is fielding tanks. Because of the squadron rules, IG scales past 2k better than any other army. You never have to field sub-optimal units if you don't want to. Most players will curl into a ball and cry if they have to fight armies like the ones Shep and bigtmac have been using.

no he wasn't talking about apoc he was referring to getting LRBT in sduadrons of 3 per one slot

caesar_uec wrote:no he wasn't talking about apoc he was referring to getting LRBT in sduadrons of 3 per one slot

I see,so you could have 9 lemon russes