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My problem with GW scenery isn't so much that they do it, but how bad it is. The trees are one example, with those horrible plastic leaves. I'm also not impressed with the Planetstrike pieces all that much, and the plastic house kit for Warhammer is simply overloaded with superfluous gubbins and details.

GW does a service by offering some of their universe-specific terrain pieces for purchase and yes, there IS some great quality in there. They try to line their own pockets by offering some crap for sale as well. Some call it business, some call it thinly veiled graft. I call it both, and merely put my money where my mouth is.

My concern is for the damage they are doing to the hobby. Having some idea and capability about making terrain (matrerials to use, where and how to get them) is a big part of wargaming. Looking at some of GW's pieces, some look great for it, others look like crap, but terrain building for wargaming is a skill that needs some development. Sure, a lot of it is pretty simple, but some of it is not obvious at first glance ot all. These skills need to be developed and maintained in the wargaming hobby as a whole. I think they do a diservice trying to use only their own terrain pieces, because they will not build terrain for everyone, for every possible game board or theme that comes up.

No, I am not saying that GW will destroy independent terrain making as a whole in wargaming; but I DO say that they would if they could.

I don't have a problem with GW terrain kits, for the most part I like them and want more race-specific stuff. The trees and hills aren't very good in my opinion, but that's stuff that you should be making yourself anyway.

I just wish we could get some cool hobby content again, instead of constant advertisements for their generic tree or hill kits.

I just read two issues of WD. Virtually every picture took place on the RoB board.

I hate that.

It amazes me the hammering that people give game companies. The big decline in board games and table top minis is pretty obvious, PSIII and DS. The general pop sits there kids down in front of a system and then voila, instant baby sitting. The other argument that I love is how much GW costs and how they are not doing the old stuff. Has anyone bought gas lately? The figures are made of oil and the price of oil is up last I checked. How about those DS and PSIII consoles, how much are they, $200 to $400 dollars? Then that's not all, every game is what $20 to $50? And how about the next game system that comes out, all that money is now wasted, time to upgrade and spend another $1000 on a new console and games. When I first played 40K my opponent was using a Dreadnought that he bought when the game first came out some 15 years ago, let's see that would be SEGA system days I believe, anyone still using that game system? How many game consoles have been since then? When I think in those terms I feel my Games Workshop stuff is inexpensive and long lasting.

Oh, the articles people want to see in White Dwarf, maybe people should write them and send them in for publication, this is a small hobby, I am pretty sure they would dress up the article and put it into the mag.

Thanks for listening.

Fist guy

sgtpjbarker wrote:

Oh, the articles people want to see in White Dwarf, maybe people should write them and send them in for publication, this is a small hobby, I am pretty sure they would dress up the article and put it into the mag.

Thanks for listening.

Fist guy

You must me new to the whole GW scene.

Once upon a time GW use to publish a lot of fan produced articles. Not just in White Dwarf, but in the now defunct Citadel Journal, and later a series of mags dedicated to Necromunda, Epic 40k, BFG, BB, and Mordheim. GW use to have a great little section on there website called Black Gobbo, dedicated to there DIY fans. They got rid of all of this.

Sadly GW has done away with all of that. They really don't care what there customers have to say nor do they desire our input.

What they do care about is promoting there brand and selling product. There is nothing wrong with that they are public owned company who are in the end responsible to there share holders not the people who buy there products.

grizgrin wrote:My concern is for the damage they are doing to the hobby. Having some idea and capability about making terrain (matrerials to use, where and how to get them) is a big part of wargaming.

Says you. That is just your opinion - I believe it has next to nothing to do with wargaming and is a PITA that I would not rather have to deal with in any shape or form. It is bad enough I have to paint 2pt models that should come in colored plastic.

Looking at some of GW's pieces, some look great for it, others look like crap, but terrain building for wargaming is a skill that needs some development. Sure, a lot of it is pretty simple, but some of it is not obvious at first glance ot all. These skills need to be developed and maintained in the wargaming hobby as a whole. I think they do a diservice trying to use only their own terrain pieces, because they will not build terrain for everyone, for every possible game board or theme that comes up.

No, I am not saying that GW will destroy independent terrain making as a whole in wargaming; but I DO say that they would if they could.

I am happy if they produce cheapish quickly throw together reasonable looking terrain. If I can buy a hill spray it and drybrush it I am v. happy rather than dicking around with foam and foam cutters, hot gluing it, thin covering of POP and then adding rock etc to it. I have more important things to do - like spend time with my wife, homework and keeping the time spent at my hobby table to a minimum when it could be spent playing.

I think this is all overblown. I realize GW is making more and more terrain but they still have articles and examples for us hobbyists to make our own stuff; they're just not online.

In Planetstrike, a rulebook that serves as an advertisement for the new GW kits, they have pictures and text talking about making Xenos terrain like Eldar stuff. For an older example the hardcover rulebook has pics about Ork bunkers.

GW's online articles are pretty short and seem like White Dwarf-lite than anything else especially since there's a lot more picture space than text.

fullheadofhair wrote:I am happy if they produce cheapish quickly throw together reasonable looking terrain. If I can buy a hill spray it and drybrush it I am v. happy rather than dicking around with foam and foam cutters, hot gluing it, thin covering of POP and then adding rock etc to it. I have more important things to do - like spend time with my wife, homework and keeping the time spent at my hobby table to a minimum when it could be spent playing.

Emphasis mine. I actually agree with you on that one, I only think nothing they've made up to now actually qualifies.

More varied terrain is a great thing.

The durability and quick process of getting good looking stuff on the table is the selling point for me.
(certain craters not included)

Cities of death = Awesome stuff, if you play 40k and haven't got this, you've missed out, pure and simple.

Gaming hills =Good quality and looks better than 100% of the homemade insulation foam hills i've seen.
pricy for what is basically a lump on the table.

Gaming board.. the price makes it an investment best split amongst friend that regularly game together. (not so bad split 3-4 ways)
good construction and features stuff most players can work with. I don't like static boards though.

planetstrike stuff= It's a bit out there but i can go for the bastion at least.

Woods= Looks like old knotted trees should, leaves are a bit weird, but adds a lush appearance without being a nightmare to assemble.
Good quality, good sculpts (some jointfixing though)
Beats any other variety of miniature trees i've ever seen done by laymen.



the limited ed. blastscape is the first piece of terrain i've seen in a good while that wasn't acceptable.



finishing note: they are a company that tries to make some money by taking a bite out of the terrain market, so ofcourse theyre gonna tone down the DIY terrain articles.
(at least those that don't contain gw bits)

Arguably I think its all about relative size. Back 10, or 15 years ago Games Workshop was merely a small company, and acted using perhaps a maximum of 50 shops in the UK, more in the US and so on. Now GW products have spread and they have a huge number of stores internationally, aswell as independent retailers which they constantly promote. Over time the hobby has only got bigger and bigger, and the scope of GW (and therefore the profits) has enlarged aswell. This has resulted in less dependency on scratch building, or other products as GW is now able to make their own.

As is their right, (since they are a business and businesses are designed to make money) they release boxed sets of pre-made scenery. Not all of this is good. I remember back in The Armageddon Campaign not so long ago they had an entirely scratch built board, replete with tank factory that looked amazing. Now I see boards constructed entirely of their cities of death products. I wish there was some kind of balance, but there we go..

fullheadofhair: switch to decaf m'man. You're right, it's my opinion; I wasn't trying to lay it out as Universal Law. If you are happy with the stuff then by all means roll on big dog. But I would recommend trying the foam board to you. Really, the stuff is simple to work with and doesn't take the boatload of time you seem to think it does. Just a suggestion, not tryin to tear you from the arms of your loving wife or school books and force you to your hobby table.

GW produces and sells a book all about making your own terrain, out of materials laying around the house. Problem is that it's been out forever so it doesn't get a lot of advertising. It's still available, my local store still keeps a copy on the shelves. Now they are showing how to use stuff that they produced. Don't really see an issue.