Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Timmah wrote:How exactly are you getting in range to tank shock with your redeemer?

At 650 points if you spend 250 on a landraider, the council is going to ignore it and mop up the rest of you list. It then might come back and attack the raider.

However even a council will be a raider after a couple turns. As soon as the raider can't move 12 inches its pretty much game over.

At 650 points they can no more ignore my redeemer than I can ignore their 300-400 point jetbike council. They still need 2 troops choices, and that's 2 easy KPs for the land raider if it's left alone.

The autarch is not effective in almost all circumstances ...... however one of the places he could be very effective is joining a jet council in a game against SMs. The council wounds on a 2+ with their attacks but they do not use power weapons, so a 2+ or 3+ save is tough for them to get past. But that is the one thing that an autarch does very well, kill models with good normal armro saves.
Autarchs are extremely fragile for what they do. And against average troops they can easily be outperformed by other cc choices.


The reason that range isnt so important is that the 24" range on the hood is just enough. If the jet council is going to be within range to assault the librarian's unit, then the council is going to be within 24" of the librarian at the start of the turn (barring any silly deployment pattern by the SM player). So any turn that the council is going to assault the librarian they have to get Fortune to sneak by the hood.

Dont worry about nullzone tho, it only operates until the end of the SM player's turn so its not going to be especially useful in any kind of assault involving the council. Unless the librarian takes a jump pack and joins some assault marines..... that could get a bit interesting but Im not sure assault marines would do the job. The 650 point limit really stops several ideas.


Sliggoth

Callidus..

Inquisitor with psychic hood.

Don't you mean Culexus?

Ironhide wrote:Don't you mean Culexus?

No.. I mean Callidus.

She is able to ignore invulnerable saves and can charge the turn she arrives. Lot of good fortune does against that.

"Word in your ear" can potentially allow you to kill the council before your opponent gets to cast fortune. At such a low point level though you might just be better off taking a couple vindicators.

IG is fairly easy, hydraflaks and sniper vet squads, In 650 3 bar bones flaks are only 225, then take 2 Vet squads with snipers at 85 points, we are up to around 400 points, grab a 70 point HQ choice, Lord Commisar or Primus Psyker. Then take 100 points of what ever you want, perferably somehting with template weapons or a lot of shots, like another hydraflak or a some HQ upgrades. He only has a 4+ invul save and a 3+ armour save, also I think that people may be playing that wrong and the eldar jetbikes only give a +1 to existing armour which means that they get a 6+ reg save being they have no reg armour save. Can't confirm that due to not haveing a eldar codex in front of me. Also at that points he is most likley only going to have a few small units as troops, probably guardian squads.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So iguess as many hi strength shots as you can shoe horn in.

doubled wrote: I think that people may be playing that wrong and the eldar jetbikes only give a +1 to existing armour which means that they get a 6+ reg save being they have no reg armour save.

Wrong.
Eldar Jetbikes give +1 T and a 3+ armor save.

OK wasn't sure don't have the current codex

The old codex was the same....

The problem with seer bikes is that they have a 3+ armor save and 4+ invulnerable save. When they reroll those using Fortune, the saves get ridiculously high -- they save vs. normal attacks 8/9 (~89%) of the time and invulnerable saves 3/4 (75%) of the time. This means that generating an invuln save has over twice the chance of causing a wound, but is still pretty low.

Given the overall cost of AP3 or better weapons, its a better option to push for the normal saves. Given a choice between a plasma gun shooting at 2 of them, or a flamer hitting 5, the flamer would be the safer bet.

The challenge you will have with using small arms fire to generate these saves. Seer bikers move 12" normally, then another 6" in the assault. You will get one or two rounds of firing tops to counter this. One tactic you can use is to use your squads in combat squads to sacrifice to whittle him down. Accept that he will wipe our a 5 man squad every round while you shoot him.

As you know he will push for the assault, another tactic would be to use assault squads to generate wounds on him. Assault squads, vet squads, etc.. When each model has 3 attacks, and 4 on the charge, that will cause enough wounds on the seer council to where they will start failing saves. This is why seer councils fall apart when charged by an ork squad of 30 sluggas.

Finally, remember the game is not about killing your opponent. Its about scoring objectives or winning VPs. If he has a seer council squad in a 650 point game, he probably just has 2 small ranger squads for troops. Ignore his seer squad, and attack his troops. Wipe his small squads of troops and claim more objectives than his seer squad can contest. If you need to, start the entire game in reserve to give him less turns to wipe out your squads. Only in 1/3 of the games will he have the KP advantage, the rest of the time, the advantage will be to you.

For IG: Straken CCS, 5x Guard squads with plasmaguns and power weapons, commissar, IQ Lord w/psychic hood. (Some other troops choice too...Vets or Penal Legion.)

You might have trouble getting him to stand and fight, but if you get him in CC that'll be the end of the game. If he tries to shoot it out, you rapid-fire him to death with FRF. Basically just walk the giant blob onto the objectives and sit, or in KP gun down his troop choices and dare his council to come to you.

Just remember to stay spread out enough that you don't get trashed by Destructor...

ketsugami wrote:For IG: Straken CCS, 5x Guard squads with plasmaguns and power weapons, commissar, IQ Lord w/psychic hood. (Some other troops choice too...Vets or Penal Legion.)

You might have trouble getting him to stand and fight, but if you get him in CC that'll be the end of the game. If he tries to shoot it out, you rapid-fire him to death with FRF. Basically just walk the giant blob onto the objectives and sit, or in KP gun down his troop choices and dare his council to come to you.

Just remember to stay spread out enough that you don't get trashed by Destructor...

Yes, if you get a Jetseer Council into CC with any guard list, that will be the end of the game...for the Imperial Guard.

Really? Strakken CCs vs. Jetcouncil in CC? That is a matchup that you actually think that an IG player would welcome? Not a chance. The Eldar win that fight every time, and would gladly charge Strakken's unit. The Eldar go first, hit on 3's and wound on 2's...vs. Guard armor saves. Then when they get hit back (if they get hit back), they save on 3+/4++ rerollable...think about it.

The Inquisitor, however, is a good choice, as I have been saying form the beginning