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EagleArk wrote:Look the reason for shotguns is they go BANG really really loud.

I'll say, I like they way you think

Madman49 wrote:Whats the point of space marines taking shotguns anyway, scouts don't charge, they sit in tree's racking up counts with heavy bolter and sniper rifle

It’s easy for infiltrating units to get into assault quickly, and against the right opponent it can be effective.

Madman49 wrote:Scouts have bolt pistols anyway, and if they have shotguns they're going to have to be in charge range, so there's no actual point when you could do a lot more damage giving them combat blades anyway, I've had a 10man sq of scouts take down a carnifex in cc

They can get the advantage of double tapping in the first turn, as they move inside 12” for the charge in the next turn. They fire again before charging, so with shotguns you can get 4 shots over two turns before charging, whereas with a pistol and knife you get two shots, but this is countered by the extra attack when you’re in combat, and the fact that you don’t always get that first round of shooting before the turn you charge (enemy might initiate and move inside your charge range, might have had to run to get there…)

Either way the benefit is marginal to a unit that’s not that great or that common. Basically you should take shotguns if you think they’re cool.

As to versatility the military has a shotfun round designed for door breeching. I giggle like a school girl when I think of a shotgun blowing the entire door mechanism out then immediately racking the slide for a slug round.

Still don't quite get the difference between SM and guardsmen. The bore difference is not so significant that a guardsmen would be unable to handle it even with training. I do kinda get the ogryn boom gun being out of range to a guardsmen, but its also beyond a space marine which is surprising.

Samus_aran115 wrote:Who cares? Shotguns will always suck. S3 can barely kill guants or orks. Totally useless.

Anyway,sorry if that sounded mean.

yeah.

you're not allowed to talk now.

Melissia wrote:Right. You use two flamers, a heavy flamer, six shotguns, and a shotugn/powerfist sergeant on a grenadiers veteran squad. Fire those flamers, and all those shotguns, and assault.

I run almost exactly this, to pretty good effect. They cruise around in a chimera (with 2 more heavy flamers) and burn mofo's off of objectives.

Assaulting is always a nice thing to do. But, IMHO, boltguns and snipers are more effective on SMs.

I had this thought myself once or twice, being an IG player for all of my 40k career. My thought was to make the shotguns twin linked to represent that they spread. Then just charge a few points to upgrade a veteran to balance out that they're better.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

fa1lanx wrote:

Melissia wrote:Right. You use two flamers, a heavy flamer, six shotguns, and a shotugn/powerfist sergeant on a grenadiers veteran squad. Fire those flamers, and all those shotguns, and assault.

I run almost exactly this, to pretty good effect. They cruise around in a chimera (with 2 more heavy flamers) and burn mofo's off of objectives.

Why not use a plasma pistol with the sergeant? Not trying to be critical, just curious.

I'm confused, are we even talking about if guard shotguns should be str4 anymore, because from what I gathered it's now about using flamers and shotguns together and assulting people running out of charge range.

Ahh my head hurts.

ryanjh wrote:Why not use a plasma pistol with the sergeant? Not trying to be critical, just curious.

Because my Gets Hot! rolls are notorious among my group

cosmic pixie wrote:Assaulting is always a nice thing to do. But, IMHO, boltguns and snipers are more effective on SMs.

10 Scouts, 9 with Snipers and 1 with Heavy Bolter with Hellfire rounds.
Last game I played, took out the Nightbringer in two turns of shooting. Totally worth it. (then again, we gave the Nightbringer a 2+ armor for purposes of the game. Had we not, my Purgation Squad with 4 Psycannons would've shredded him much quicker. Hit on 3+, wound on 6+, no saves. 12 shots at 36" )

Shotguns should have the special rule Withering Fire: If a unit takes a wound from a shotgun, it suffers -1I and -1Ld until the end of the turn.

This means that blasting with a shotgun will give you a boost to your combat ability (enemy is pinned down/buckshot that doesn't kill leaves them vulnerable), and makes it more powerful while keeping flavor in tact (give 'em both barrels then assault) and not fighting for bolter's job (dakka dakka). It keeps it from being a shuriken catapault, too.

It shouldn't rend, because then it could blow up tanks, and come on, it doesn't do that. It doesn't pierce armor (much), it hits you right in the armor and knocks you over.

Bigger guy ----> Bigger shotgun ----> More damage