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Seriously, the spoiler tags are unnecessary. The title of the thread implies spoilers, and the broader events of the Horus Heresy are common knowledge. It's like discussing Hamlet, but taking desperate measures to ensure that his death doesn't get spoiled for anyone reading the discussion (not that I'm implying any of BL fiction is comparable to the work of the Bard). Here, I'll even edit the thread's title if it makes you happy.

As for whether Fulgrim meant to kill Ferrus or not, the novel contradicts itself:

Fulgrim’s blade seemed to move with a life of its own, but it had no need of such impellents, for he swung the blade of hisown volition.The silver blade clove the air as it swept towards Ferrus Manus,and Fulgrim felt the ancient triumph of the presence that he nowknew had dwelt within it all this time. He tried desperately topull the blow, but his muscles were no longer his own to control.

So it seems he made the conscious decision to kill Ferrus, but instantly regretted it, but by then it was far too late.

Fulgrim wanted to be victorious in battle over another Primarch to display his own martial skill. Earlier in Fulgrim , he contemplates destroying Horus' fleet when he comes out of warp translation since he was in prime position sneaking up on Horus. Fulgrim was one who treasured perfection in war, and defeating a fellow Primarch displayed that perfection. Think of it like samurai when they stop there sword right before the blow strikes. That's where Fulgrim wanted to get, but the daemon possessing him pushed the blow through.

Omegus wrote:
I must say though, the last few pages of Descent of Angels threw me for a loop. The Lion's action seems to make no sense at all. I do hope Fallen Angels clarifies why he did what he did.

Nemuel figures it out. (I think that's Zahariel's cousin's name)

It's kind of shocking, but when you think about it, you should have been expecting it.

I really enjoyed the first 3 books. Horus Rising, Flase Gods, and Galaxy in Flames. I just loved the characters of those books and I was sad to see Loken go. I also enjoyed Flight of Eisenstein but I got about 100 pages through Fulgrim and just stopped reading Horus Heresy books for a while. I never really thought about skipping around books like some on this thread have done, it just feels....unatural to skip books to me. I have just recently gotten back into reading the series though. Just have to finish Fulgrim...but ive also heard Descent of Angels is not that good either...ugh

DarknessEternal wrote:

Omegus wrote:
I must say though, the last few pages of Descent of Angels threw me for a loop. The Lion's action seems to make no sense at all. I do hope Fallen Angels clarifies why he did what he did.

Nemuel figures it out. (I think that's Zahariel's cousin's name)

It's kind of shocking, but when you think about it, you should have been expecting it.

Hmm, I must have missed that part. I freely admit that I found the entire Forge World portion of the book tedious, except the lulzworthy part at the end. The whole morphing heavy bolter/meltagun, regenerating helmets and rhinos thing just reminded me too much of He Who Must Not Be Named.

What did he figure out, exactly? I remember a mention early on of the rumors that circulated about why they were sent home, but it was a throw-away line.

DarknessEternal wrote:
Those latter four guys joined up with the Heresy to fight against the Emperor and his Imperium. The former 4 guys thought Chaos was dandy keen.

Ok, i didn't mean that they knew that they would be shaking hands with Daemons, but they knew that turning on the Emperor wasn't going to be a nice pleasant experience.

Poor explanation on my part

moonshine wrote:
No, most thought they would kill the emporer by joining Horus. Fulgrim was the only one to get possesed

As above and not entirely true, by the end of the Heresy and the final battle on the Vengeful Spirit Horus was possessed by all four Gods and more than likely under their sway after Davin. Whether it's still the same case we don't know though until the series ends.

moonshine wrote:but he regreted it in the end and wanted to un-do what he had done because he did not know how he would feel once he killed Ferus Manus whch proves not all the primarchs knew what following Horus would involve .

Oh come on. Primarchs bred for war not knowing what betraying their father would involve. Pats on the back, colourful flowers?

Fulgrim knew that only one of them was going to walk away from that fight with Ferrus, shame it wasn't him or Ferrus

DarknessEternal wrote:

biccat wrote:

Spoiler:

Like the Emperor did.

You'll note only chaos daemons are making that claim. Unreliable Narrator in action.

I don't know of any 40k books that don't include an unreliable narrator. Most of the fluff is directly from Imperial propaganda that people have no problem accepting at face value.

I think that's what helps make the world so interesting, you never know how much is true.

I've seen plenty of people dismiss a certain piece of fluff simply because it's from a different point of view than the army it concerns.

Omegus wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:

Omegus wrote:
I must say though, the last few pages of Descent of Angels threw me for a loop. The Lion's action seems to make no sense at all. I do hope Fallen Angels clarifies why he did what he did.

Nemuel figures it out. (I think that's Zahariel's cousin's name)

It's kind of shocking, but when you think about it, you should have been expecting it.

Hmm, I must have missed that part. I freely admit that I found the entire Forge World portion of the book tedious, except the lulzworthy part at the end. The whole morphing heavy bolter/meltagun, regenerating helmets and rhinos thing just reminded me too much of He Who Must Not Be Named.

What did he figure out, exactly? I remember a mention early on of the rumors that circulated about why they were sent home, but it was a throw-away line.

You said you hadn't read Fallen Angels yet, it's in there.

I did read it, that's what I'm talking about.

As above and not entirely true, by the end of the Heresy and the final battle on the Vengeful Spirit Horus was possessed by all four Gods and more than likely under their sway after Davin. Whether it's still the same case we don't know though until the series ends.

No Horus was not possesed, the Cabal says that if he wins then he will eventually be so ashamed and mad at himself that he would cause humanity to destroy itself.

Oh come on. Primarchs bred for war not knowing what betraying their father would involve. Pats on the back, colourful flowers?

Fulgrim knew that only one of them was going to walk away from that fight with Ferrus, shame it wasn't him or Ferrus

Fulgrim did not want to kill Ferrus at the end of the fight and Ferrus did not want to kill Fulgrim bur Ferrus knew that if Fulgrim let him live then he would have to kill him. Fulgrim killed Ferrus because he had no other choice at that point. Though I wonder why Horus did not realise Fulgrim would find it too dificult and not just let Angron do it.

moonshine wrote:
No Horus was not possesed, the Cabal says that if he wins then he will eventually be so ashamed and mad at himself that he would cause humanity to destroy itself.

Collected Visions amongst other sources, though older, would disagree with you. But as we're on the actual series, we don't know yet. The Cabal didn't know all eventualities, the Acuity also peers into the realm of the Daemon, what better way for Chaos to convince them that they are doing the right thing?

moonshine wrote:
Fulgrim did not want to kill Ferrus at the end of the fight and Ferrus did not want to kill Fulgrim bur Ferrus knew that if Fulgrim let him live then he would have to kill him. Fulgrim killed Ferrus because he had no other choice at that point. Though I wonder why Horus did not realise Fulgrim would find it too dificult and not just let Angron do it.

Ferrus wanted to kill Fulgrim, that much is quite apparent. Fulgrim on the other hand might not have wanted to, but knew he had too. The Daemon only influenced him so far, like Ingethel with the Word Bearers, like Horus. All they needed was a nudge to make them theirs.

Yes but Collected visions says Torgaddon turned to chaos, I think Collected visions is outdated beyond belife now.

I thought Nemesis was very good indeed, despite not having enjoyed Mr. Swallow's work before.

Dont react hes a troll
any way i loved mechainum

moonshine wrote:Yes but Collected visions says Torgaddon turned to chaos, I think Collected visions is outdated beyond belife now.

That image could be the vision of Torgaddon that Loken saw after discovering the Book of Lorgar in the place that upheld the ideals of the crusade.

It is a mix of stuff that has been re written, but it also has a lot of stuff that hasn't, which is the foundation for the Heresy series. The part where we find out whether or not Horus is or isn't possessed, we are no where near so we'll have to wait and see. At this moment in time there's fluff to say he is and he isn't.

MrDAKKA wrote:Dont react hes a troll