Blood Angels and Necrons.

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**Revenent Reiko**

pretre wrote:Also, YAY, this thread again.

I thought that.... hence my copy paste of the actual quote from the BA Codex from the last time this came up

**pretre**

Revenent Reiko wrote:
pretre wrote:Also, YAY, this thread again.

I thought that.... hence my copy paste of the actual quote from the BA Codex from the last time this came up

I guess I need to agree and add that if anyone actually read the books rather than knee-jerk internet raged, these debates would be a lot more interesting.

**Revenent Reiko**

pretre wrote:
Revenent Reiko wrote:
pretre wrote:Also, YAY, this thread again.

I thought that.... hence my copy paste of the actual quote from the BA Codex from the last time this came up

I guess I need to agree and add that if anyone actually read the books rather than knee-jerk internet raged, these debates would be a lot more interesting.

My apologies, didnt realise it at the time, but my post came off a bit snarky towards you. I was whole-heartedly agreeing with you, and am doing so again.

Honestly, read what you are arguing about people, its not difficult and you could even learn something.

**AustonT**

Revenent Reiko wrote:
Harriticus wrote:
Platuan4th wrote:
Harriticus wrote:The main problem is while you can technically justify while the alliance took place, it just doesn't fit nor does it feel right. The Necrons are supposed to be a cold, inhuman, terrifying foe and having them reduced to allying with Space Marines produces an aura of softness and relateability that they shouldn't have.

Fighting the same enemy =/= allying.

It's specifically described as an Alliance in the Blood Angels Codex. The exact word "alliance" is used.

Just to fully answer this again, and to put the full quote in:

Blood Angels Codex Pg.16 wrote:Commander Dante and the 3rd Company battle against the Necrons Legions of the Silent King amidst the dusty wastes of Gehenna. For three weeks, neither side can seize he upper hand, with Dante's tactical brilliance stretched to to limits in countering the time-space manipulations of the Silent King. The stalemate is broken only when a Tyranid splinter fleet enters orbit, forcing the two armies to breal off hostilities and fight the common foe. The impromptu alliance proves to be the Tyranids undoing. Following the final battle at Devil's Crag, Dante and the Silent King go their separate ways, both forces now too batteworn to guarantee victory over the other, and, at least for the BAs, the idea of turning on those they has so recently fought alongside, a rather distasteful one."

Emphasis mine, notice how it isnt really an alliance...

im·promp·tu
[im-promp-too, -tyoo]
- adjective, adverb
1. without preparation
The unplanned alliance proves to be the Tyranids undoing.
See how it's still an alliance? Oh, wait.
al·li·ance
[uh-lahy-uhns]
- noun
1. formal union for mutual benefit
2. close relationship
The unplanned formal union for mutual benefit proved to be the Tyranids undoing.
When you put it like that it's downright chummy. Aren't words FUN?!

**Revenent Reiko**

(excerpt of full definitions)

alliance [əˈlaɪəns]
n
2. a formal agreement or pact, esp a military one, between two or more countries to achieve a particular aim

(emphasis mine)

im·promp·tu (m-prmpt, -ty)
adj.
1. Prompted by the occasion rather than being planned in advance
1. unrehearsed; spontaneous; extempore

Why not try using the actual words used instead of synonyms?

**pretre**

If we're breaking out the dictionaries, then we've already lost.

**Revenent Reiko**

Indeed

**AustonT**

I like dictionaries, not being a native English speaker they tend to clarify things.
You can post a definition from a different publisher or edition, and still not escape the fact that an alliance, impromptu or de facto is still an alliance.
/brofist
End.

**Revenent Reiko**

*sigh*

the 'impromptu' tells us that is neither planned, nor long-lasting, and therefore not a true alliance.

it was an alliance of convenience, made at the time to combat the greater threat of the Nids, there is no standing alliance between the BAs and the Necrons.

Notice how in my definitions, there is a specific military example relating to the problem at hand (the Nids), and a reference in the impromptu definition to being forced by circumstances.

Also notice how there is never mention that they fought side by side...

**Wulfen Andy**

flota wrote:

matt ward

Lol!!!

Couldn't agree more!!!!

**flota**

brofist

**IXBEHEMOTHXI**

about the c'tan fluff and the BA and tyranids, If I wrote that, I would say that the C'tan would seek the largest harvest of life essence, therefore going for the nids first as they are larger in number, and well, I would all out leave the BA because there side of the story makes almost no sense to me, so what im saying is I would have the necrons assault a part of the hive fleet after the tomb world awakened, at least that would be the "biggest harvest" part of the fluff, but again I would all out leave the BA, because to me they served no purpose in that piece of Matt ward herecy.

**master of ordinance**

IXBEHEMOTHXI wrote:about the c'tan fluff and the BA and tyranids, If I wrote that, I would say that the C'tan would seek the largest harvest of life essence, therefore going for the nids first as they are larger in number, and well, I would all out leave the BA because there side of the story makes almost no sense to me, so what im saying is I would have the necrons assault a part of the hive fleet after the tomb world awakened, at least that would be the "biggest harvest" part of the fluff, but again I would all out leave the BA, because to me they served no purpose in that piece of Matt ward herecy.

well said IXBEHEMOTHTHXI
i agree

DarknessEternal wrote:
master of ordinance wrote:actualy necrons know no emotion.

if they did it would be fear.

i mean if they dont feed the C`Tan then theirpretty much fetht...

Please read any of their background, none of what you claim is in it.

I read this peice of fluff that they harvest their victims escence to feed the C`Tan.
essentialy the C`Tan get hungry every now and then and send the necrons out to get some munch for them.
living escence munch.

**somecallmeJack**

Azure wrote:The key problem I think most people run into is his tendency to just go that extra inch to far. Draigo trapped in the warp, totally fine. There are people, planets, and all sorts of other things trapped in there forever. Draigo running around killing daemons of the warp, little odd But it's saved as they all come back. So this part, while odd, is self balancing. Carving a predecessor's name into a Primarch? No, Primarchs were gods among men and one was said to have unimaginable strength. For one man a single one was impossible to best, for a small army, a formidable foe.

Concerning Necrons and BA. Fighting eachother in a large war, acceptable for both fanboys. It's a newly awakened Tombworld which is why the Necrons didn't decimate them and BA didn't send down an entire chapter to end the Necrons which seems to be what is commonly called for, or at least several companies. Where it gets weird is not the ignoring of eachother to fight off the 'nids, though this fact is slightly odd, it;s the lack of continued fighting afterwards that gets people. Necrons are on a Tombworld, until it blows up they are Not out of resources. The BA would have been reinforced during the Nid/Necron conflict I'm Sure and therefor should have been ripped and roaring to continue the fight with them just as soon as the 'Nids were gone

This. Sums up my feelings about his fluff. He doesn't know how to quit when he's ahead on a cool concept.

Draigo shouldn't have even gotten close to Mortarion.

**master of ordinance**

somecallmeJack wrote:
Azure wrote:The key problem I think most people run into is his tendency to just go that extra inch to far. Draigo trapped in the warp, totally fine. There are people, planets, and all sorts of other things trapped in there forever. Draigo running around killing daemons of the warp, little odd But it's saved as they all come back. So this part, while odd, is self balancing. Carving a predecessor's name into a Primarch? No, Primarchs were gods among men and one was said to have unimaginable strength. For one man a single one was impossible to best, for a small army, a formidable foe.

Concerning Necrons and BA. Fighting eachother in a large war, acceptable for both fanboys. It's a newly awakened Tombworld which is why the Necrons didn't decimate them and BA didn't send down an entire chapter to end the Necrons which seems to be what is commonly called for, or at least several companies. Where it gets weird is not the ignoring of eachother to fight off the 'nids, though this fact is slightly odd, it;s the lack of continued fighting afterwards that gets people. Necrons are on a Tombworld, until it blows up they are Not out of resources. The BA would have been reinforced during the Nid/Necron conflict I'm Sure and therefor should have been ripped and roaring to continue the fight with them just as soon as the 'Nids were gone

This. Sums up my feelings about his fluff. He doesn't know how to quit when he's ahead on a cool concept.

Draigo shouldn't have even gotten close to Mortarion.

Agreed.