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Made in us
Imperial Admiral




I'd like to see less emphasis on named Special Characters, and a combination of the chapter traits system and the Space Wolf Wolf Lord sagas.

I'd like to see bolters get better. Blood Angel Assault Marines are "better in every way" than standard Tacticals because Tacticals are nothing more than heavy/special weapons teams with ablative wounds. Nobody misses losing bolters in favor of bolt pistols in going from Tacs to ASMs because bolters suck.
   
Made in fi
Roaring Reaver Rider




My personal secret lair

I wouldn't say that bolters suck. It is more of a matter how to use them.

I shall rule the world someday utilizing my cuteness. And I already have one minion to help me do it!

Hollowman wrote:

Of course it makes sense. When there are a bunch of BDSM clowns doing Olympic gymnast routines throughout your unit, while also cutting off heads, you tend to get a bit distracted.

 
   
Made in gb
Tough-as-Nails Ork Boy




UK

Just my two cents... to make your army stand out, why not allow a customisation option at the start.
(This is obviously open to abuse but worth a crack), I dont know if this already exists for marines or anything similar as I only play Orks but why not allow a selection of benefits, but they must be tied with a downside.

EG:
+1 Toughness, but at the cost of -1 BS.
+1 WS, at the loss of -1 BS.
Tacticals get one free HW, but they cant take flamers.
+1 BS, at the loss of -1 WS.
All melta weapons have a -2pts reduction, but All other weapons cost +2pts
All troop choices can take one additional flamer on top of what they are allowed, but they cant take krak grenades

Now an example of the mixture:

Angels of Fire
+1 Flamer / No Krak Grenades (Troop Choices)
+1 Toughness / -1 BS

Angels of Fire become Puromaniacs who are better up close and personal than shooting, and they think Grenades are a waste of time.

(note, this might be a completely stupid idea but thought I would throw it out there)

We need MOAR Dakka!
 
   
Made in se
Ferocious Black Templar Castellan






Sweden

mwnciboo wrote:EDIT - Codex Space Marines only has one Character for the IMPERIAL FISTS? I am no IF fan but i do respect the fact that they were the final Bulwark at the Gates of the Imperial Palace. They Teleported onto Horus's Battle Barge with the Emperor, Sanguinius and Custodes for gods sake. I mean Rogal Dorn carried the Emperors shattered remains to the Golden Throne. But the BA's well they were there and they get their own codex...Go figure.


At least part of the Legion is represented in the Black Templars Codex, but yes, it's a bit silly. They could at least get Pugh in there as well TBH.

For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back. 
   
Made in us
Perfect Shot Ultramarine Predator Pilot





Blood Angel Assault Marines are "better in every way" than standard Tacticals because Tacticals are nothing more than heavy/special weapons teams with ablative wounds. Nobody misses losing bolters in favor of bolt pistols in going from Tacs to ASMs because bolters suck.


They aren't better in EVERY way...but in 99 of the 100 ways that matter, that's pretty much dead on.

The tac squad has a theoretical edge in shooting over a BAASM squad, in that they can sit there, the heavy weapon and bolters can throw out bullets to 24", and plink the enemy down. Except, funny thing, while the Tac squad has 8 bolt rounds, a special weapon shot (only with plasmagun.) and a heavy weapon shot outbound at a target 12+ inches away, the BAASM squad is moving up 12, disembarking, and hitting it with 2 meltagun or 4 plasmagun shots and...oh...8 bolt rounds. The GH squad can do the same with a rhino, move up 12, disembark, two specials and -16- bolt rounds on a target that was 2 feet away at the start of the turn.

The additional mobility afforded by a transport or jumppack for BAASM and GH almost completely offset their lack of a heavy weapon or downgrade from bolter to bolt pistol in most of the situations you are likely to run into with your non-terminator infantry. The remainder? Well, I suppose that 170 point tactical squad makes a real nice boat anchor for the heavy weapon.

I know, I know, I can hear it now. "Combat squads, you noob! What, don't you know anything?!" Yes. I do know something. I know that CS was a pathetic gimme for the gutting of the 4e tactical squad, and in no way makes up for a true MSU-capable unit if one wants to run their army this way. To make matters worse, while you are mucking about with combat squadding and buying a razorback brand X and Y have very nearly paid for the transport on their second MSU.

"But you can sit and shoot out the top hatch of a rhino and never expose yourself to enemy fire, like the BAASM/GH units do to perform the 24 inch WTFBBQ manuever!" Yes, this is true. Until the transport moves. Or is moved. Or is shaken. Or stunned. Or really just looked at funny. If everything goes -perfectly- you can fire the heavy weapon. If anything, anywhere goes pear shaped, you are SOL for that weapon contributing anything to the battle this turn. The competition? Whether anything happens to that rhino or not, they always have the option of getting out and firing their heavy hitters. Which don't really hit any less hard than a heavy weapon.

"Well, tactical marines can pull this rhino + disembark BS too, so clearly you just don't know how to use them! Put a combi weapon in the squad!" Yes, they can, as decently in the shooting phase as grey hunters..sort of. However, then comes the point at which you take incoming fire and charges. Incoming fire is a wash, you are no less durable...but ASSAULT...Well...I think it's pretty clear that both BAASM and GH fare just a little bit better when things go hand to hand. I won't get into that here and now, maybe in a few hours.

Give tacs SOMETHING GW. I don't care if it's the ability to take "Bolter drill" from lysander, or some sort of special ammo, or "Once per game, you can elect to subject a unit charging your tacticals to a free round of shooting, counting as the unit being stationary." or two heavy weapons per ten men. But do SOMETHING to make them more than a Meh unit that you take more as a tax than a choice.


This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2011/10/26 10:00:16


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut



Beaver Dam, WI

Brotherjulian wrote:Stormshields are overpowered, they should go back to being (as they always used to be) only usable in CC


Agreed or a 4++ save. Think what makes the choice of a stormbolter and powerfist about an equal choice. As long as TH/SS is a no-brainer selection, we will not see standard termies.

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WIP
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Made in gb
Steadfast Ultramarine Sergeant





Liverpool, England

As a few people have said, I think it's just that the specialist chapter codicies are abit too OTT. I like the Ultramarines codex (let's not beat around the bush, that's what it is.)
But I do like the idea of SW scouts, the Chapter Tactics being a generic points bought HQ upgrade, not character specific.
I like the chapter traits thing from 5ed, but maybe just alter it to chapter tactics as stated above?
Here's one I'd like to see though, you know how a big banner someone holds in their hand gives bonuses? How about the little banner on a backpack can give a small bonus for a points cost? Something to personalise squads, in line with the fluff. I mean let's face it, they're supposed to be all unique, why not let each sergeant have the option to give his squad a speial rule whilst he lives? It'd make me want to paint these banners I have.
   
Made in gb
Lieutenant Colonel







Thus far i am convinced (by many of your suggestions) of several small changes...Points values remain the same.

1. Tactical Squads should get "Bolter Drill" or a Free Rhino.
2. Tactical Sqauds can trade their HW for another Special.
3. Scout Squads can have a Storm as a transport not a FOC choice.
4. Traits for Chapters.

Oh and on the subject of Characters and having to many and costs of development....I say nonsense....

http://www.box.net/shared/jr5h5sbait

BOLS did this off their own back, unpaid and free to download. Now tell me you couldn't do better with a Staff, Studio and Publishing, GW must up their output and quality and stop increasing prices.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/10/26 16:28:18


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Made in us
Perfect Shot Ultramarine Predator Pilot





Stormshields are overpowered, they should go back to being (as they always used to be) only usable in CC


Disagree -10. The stormshield change was one of the few really good changes in the 4e-5e switch in my opinion. Previously, the "no brainer" choice was tactical terminators with tank hunting ACs or CMLs per five men. (5E psycannons before psycannons! WEEE!) and having both the 3++ and 2-per-5 as options for ones elites would've been decided more on what kind of army you want rather than "One sucks, one doesn't." See: Current black templars.

Then GW took the good half-job they did and ruined it by dropping the amount of heavy weapons for small squads and dropping the veteran skill, thus swinging the pendulum to the opposite extreme. Great job folks, you people have a future in government when you are done writing codices.

I do not long for a return to the days of "Oh, 200 points in ATs. BRB, getting 30-50 points in plasma to knock them over." Having a slow moving (or even more ridiculously expensive when transport is factored in) unit with no guns and no durability against shooting is a recipe for "Never leave the shelf again."....Kinda like they were in 4E.
   
Made in us
Long-Range Land Speeder Pilot





In the battlefield

I have little to no complaint with our current codex. I have great success with it as of now. even the so called OP codices like BA, SW, IG, GK don't even give me a hard time.

and as such i wan't nothing to do with those in my book I.E. assault marines like BA is a stupid lazy thought. I love my assault marines just the way they are.

I would however like to see a combat blade on our bike squads and tac marines. so they can be a little more viable in CC other than that I have no problem with the codex.


for a new 6th. just add in more special characters maybe move some points around or w/e.
I do like the 4th ED codex with making your own chapter that was always cool.

You are not free whose liberty is won by the rigour of other, more righteous souls. Your are merely protected. Your freedom is parasitic, you suck the honourable man dry and offer nothing in return. You who have enjoyed freedom, who have done nothing to earn it, your time has come. This time you will stand alone and fight for yourselves. Now you will pay for your freedom in the currency of honest toil and human blood.  
   
 
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