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KingCracker wrote:I run shoota mobs of 20, so normally Ive got between 2 (in small gameS) and 4 in average games, and they all have 2 rokkits each unit. I run rokkit buggies like a mofo, typically I run 9, but in small games Ill make it 6. I never have problems with not having enough rokkits. My rokkits are everywhere, and every unit I have, has a chance of popping a transport. Im also a fan of Lootas

So my typical build, is very shooty to begin with, regardless of what Im facing, they are eating lead or rokkits or both.....and they still have the privilege of facing my horde in CC

Rokkit buggies are great; if you have to kill an MC, rokkit buggies are arguably the very best way to do so.

I don't like rokkits in foot mobs, though; the boyz should be focused on killing infantry, leave the big stuff to units more suited to killing them. Buggies, Lootas, Ghazzy, etc.

Great White wrote:Nobs with power claws in big squads of boyz.

This thread could have been over after one reply.

It's the same way orks kill anything.

DarknessEternal wrote:

Great White wrote:Nobs with power claws in big squads of boyz.

This thread could have been over after one reply.

It's the same way orks kill anything.

While I use this tactic, I'm wary to recommend it as an outright army-list design decision - as is evident by my previous post. Conversely, MC's can be used to tarpit entire mobs of boys, helping to hold back a lot of the Ork momentum, not to mention bringing in other nids to help with the fisticuffs. Ideally, to avoid such a situation, I'd recommend that MC's are dealt with at range so that one's boyz can be used elsewhere.

BeRzErKeR wrote:

KingCracker wrote:I run shoota mobs of 20, so normally Ive got between 2 (in small gameS) and 4 in average games, and they all have 2 rokkits each unit. I run rokkit buggies like a mofo, typically I run 9, but in small games Ill make it 6. I never have problems with not having enough rokkits. My rokkits are everywhere, and every unit I have, has a chance of popping a transport. Im also a fan of Lootas

So my typical build, is very shooty to begin with, regardless of what Im facing, they are eating lead or rokkits or both.....and they still have the privilege of facing my horde in CC

Rokkit buggies are great; if you have to kill an MC, rokkit buggies are arguably the very best way to do so.

I don't like rokkits in foot mobs, though; the boyz should be focused on killing infantry, leave the big stuff to units more suited to killing them. Buggies, Lootas, Ghazzy, etc.

Your correct boyz are meant to tackle infantry. But theres been more then a few times, that I had to many targets for lootas/buggies or bad shooting, where having the boyz mob actually do the popping, and then assault the unit inside, that having the 2 rokkits per mob has been invaluable. I like making sure that in my army builds, every unit, can pretty much do everyone elses job, and since transports are the big thing, having every single unit I take, have the ability to pop them, seems the smart thing to do

2 big shootas have statistically about the same same chance as popping av 11 as 2 rokkits do and can do it at 36" instead of 24" and cost 10 points less.

Edit:
Sorry I am drinking vodka. Ignore me.

Oddly enough when i first started building orks I was thinking along your same lines King, but for last few months, I have been taking rokkits out of my boyz. It's such a low % chance at BS 2, but I guess if you spam them through 4 mobs of boyz it's not a bad idea.

I don't use rokkits ony boyz anymore because I never hit anything. And I'm not exaggerating, I really have yet to kill anything tougher than a guardsman or a dire avenger with a rokkit shot by a boyz mob.

Its funny, because forever ago, when I played CSM, I stopped taking Lascannons, because no matter what, I couldnt hit a fething thing, and in the incredibly rare chance Id hit something, Id always roll 1s, not even a joke.

But I hit fairly regularly with my boyz rokkits.

I play a slightly off the norm list when I play against nids. My Kans, Dreads, and heaps of boys do very well against nids, but the monsterous bugs were always a problem....until I built two units of what my army calls the dakka wing. Basically, I field 2 units of 5 deff koptas with rockets and no buzz saws. I use these units to pop a cap in the big bugs. I've found that when teamed together I am very capable of dropping the big bugs in a single turn. This works well as the nid player I play likes to run 3 tervigons.

If the nid player ran more massive units instead of the big bugs I would probably say go with the lootas in a shooty spot or even burnas in a wagon. They have a great chance of doing some awesome crowd control.

Well if your just running them for rokkits, you should use rokkit buggies, they are cheaper, and are armor (which has both pros and cons) but I use my rokkit buggies as a wall instead of Kans, opening up my heavy support section.

Chowderhead wrote:Ghazzy in a Deffrolla Battlewagon with diversified Nobs.

It's how Orks deal with everything. It doesn't matter what it is.

Except for GKs

Thats a moot point really, the GK are the counter to everything and for cheaper points.

TedNugent wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:Ghazzy in a Deffrolla Battlewagon with diversified Nobs.

It's how Orks deal with everything. It doesn't matter what it is.

Except for GKs

Oh, you can bet on that unit ripping any GK units heads off and putting them on a pole. Outside of paladins of course, you can't beat the hardest rock in the game with a single unit of anything.

But a gak load of boyz is a decent start

BeRzErKeR wrote:
The rest of those two paragraphs that you didn't quote answered this quite well...

It's not a serious problem. Ghazghkull makes it practically a non-issue

Yes, If you do run ghaz it makes it practically a non-issue. (I really couldn't be buggered mentioning the variables in your argument, I'd rather point them out on the table)
But here's the hint I've been trying to get across - not everyone plays with ghaz.


Just deal with MC's the same way orks deal with everything- shoot it with lots of effective shots, chop it with lots of effective chopperz. Shoot and chop.

Ehh.....its not so easy with shooting and chopping unless a PK is involved. Your rolling 4+ on average to hit, and 6s to wound a MC with a shoota/slugga and with a standard Ork attack. So no, not very effective at all

Yep, even three full mobs of shoota boyz can easily fail to put a single wound on a MC with a decent armor save. I've gone to shooting gaunts/genestealers or bloodletters/pink horrors instead.

Jidmah wrote:

TedNugent wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:Ghazzy in a Deffrolla Battlewagon with diversified Nobs.

It's how Orks deal with everything. It doesn't matter what it is.

Except for GKs

Oh, you can bet on that unit ripping any GK units heads off and putting them on a pole. Outside of paladins of course, you can't beat the hardest rock in the game with a single unit of anything.

How? GKs strike at higher initiative, and they instant kill, and they ignore FnP, and they ignore armor saves.

The Deffrolla and Ghazzy would tear the beans off of anything (assuming Ghaz's Wagh), but Nobz are anything but a good counter to GKs, and the diversification isn't going to help much against activated force weapons.

KingCracker wrote:Ehh.....its not so easy with shooting and chopping unless a PK is involved. Your rolling 4+ on average to hit, and 6s to wound a MC with a shoota/slugga and with a standard Ork attack. So no, not very effective at all

4+ to hit and 6s to wound with slugga boyz is still 4 attacks on the charge, at only 6 points a model, your chances could be considerably worse, and with a hidden PK Nob, you can at least get 3 S8 PK attacks and 4 S9 attacks on the charge. That's not bad

No, it really is kindda bad. So if your lucky, youll wound a typical MC once, and thats with the PK, maybe twice. Ive tried it before, a few times figuring out how to beat my wifes Nids, and all it got me was a slowed down mess. Like Jidmah said, Ive gone to using the boyz to shoot down the easier to kill bugs, like stealers and gaunts, doing that is fething easy. Then I save the rokkits and such for any MC there is


Automatically Appended Next Post:

How? GKs strike at higher initiative, and they instant kill, and they ignore FnP, and they ignore armor saves.

The Deffrolla and Ghazzy would tear the beans off of anything (assuming Ghaz's Wagh), but Nobz are anything but a good counter to GKs, and the diversification isn't going to help much against activated force weapons.

Notice how in your quote, Chowder is talking about having Ghazz in there with nobz. So yes, Gahzz himself would trounce them. The thing is, Im willing to bet, most players would pour their attacks into Ghaz to try and neutralize that threat, and mostly leave the Nobz alone. Problem with that? Its Nobz, and they kick as much ass as Ghaz can. So whats your argument again?

TedNugent wrote:

Jidmah wrote:

TedNugent wrote:

Chowderhead wrote:Ghazzy in a Deffrolla Battlewagon with diversified Nobs.

It's how Orks deal with everything. It doesn't matter what it is.

Except for GKs

Oh, you can bet on that unit ripping any GK units heads off and putting them on a pole. Outside of paladins of course, you can't beat the hardest rock in the game with a single unit of anything.

How? GKs strike at higher initiative, and they instant kill, and they ignore FnP, and they ignore armor saves.

Simple. GKs still need to actually cause wounds and get their NFW off to successfully kill anything. After a 4+ to hit, a 4+ to wound and a 5++ invul save only every sixth attack will actually cause instant death - and wounds caused to Ghazzy will never do that. So even if you charge ten nobz and ghazzy into ten GK Terminators with a banner (don't do that), you will most likely lose 4-6 of them, with 4-6 and thrakka remaining to beat them to death. Even in worst case, that's 7 PK attacks and 16 regular attacks, wounding on 3+ or better. Any other GK unit is weaker than their terminators, due to less NFW attacks and worse saves.

Really, just proxy yourself some purifiers, charge them with your nobz and resolve the fight like you would in a real game. More often than not, you will find the nobz winning the clash.

You could either spam boyz mobs at it until it dies, that lone PK nob could, with a bit of luck, take out a MC on the charge alone. Another option is a PK nob squad with a PK warboss. Most Tyranid MC don't have invulnerable saves so S8-10 power weapon attacks are going to kill them dead. The only problem is he will strike first and kill about 2-4 of your nobz. If I remember correctly, (apart from carnifex's of course) Tyranid MC don't have as high as S8 so you won't be suffering instant death, without factoring in bone swords that is. But finally when you do get round to attacking you'll be hitting on 4+, wounding on 2+, and no armour saves. For the amount of men that will die it'll be a worthwhile loss.

Ruarinator2

I personally wouldnt toss a nobz mob at one unless there wasnt really anything else in the neighborhood to throw them at. Nobz are a bit pricey, and better used on other things. Personally though, if I know Im playing against Nids (like my wife for example) TBH I dont even take Nobz most the time. They just dont seem worth it against Nids most times, their skills are either out weighed by sheer numbers and speed, or they are crushed by big ass bugs. When it comes to hordes, I tend to shoot the piss out of things.

Great White wrote:Nobs with power claws in big squads of boyz.

I have been an Ork player for 15 years, and this advice is spot on.

Power Klaws are certainly the best way, especially when you consider that they're so common. How you deal this PK-Death depends on the army and monsters you're facing though. Sometimes it's best to hold up the MCs with a large mob of Boyz whilst the Nob hacks the MC apart with it's PK. However, this won't work against shooty armies, as your mob will be substantially weakened before closing in. In this case, put your PKs on Deffkoptas or Nob Bikers, or something in a Trukk/BW

KingCracker wrote:Ehh.....its not so easy with shooting and chopping unless a PK is involved. Your rolling 4+ on average to hit, and 6s to wound a MC with a shoota/slugga and with a standard Ork attack. So no, not very effective at all

I meant in mass numbers. One unit might have a problem- but if you pour enough firepower into an MC, it will soften it up enough to charge in and finish it with an armful of chopping dice.