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biccat wrote:

Tadashi wrote:And ever heard of Multiple Worlds Hypothesis, if I use that, I don't need to worry about paradoxes.

Well, then I'm going to assume Superman also exists, and he comes and saves the day.

He flies around the planet, reversing its spin (and therefore time), and then takes out the ships before they have a chance to react.

Advantage: Earth.

The dozens of psykers kill themselves tearing open a warp portal suddenly in front of Superman sending him into a one-way trip into the warp.

Advantage: the Imperium

man, even if a Titan was an unstoppable force of destruction that could stop a barrage of missiles with its shields and retaliate in such a way that you couldn't defend yourself it's still going to run out of ammunition eventually. though that's not to say the Techies and thier dudes on board would wait until they've completely exhausted thier Feul and Ammo, but without a strong suply line (or a reliable chart detailing where to find what they need) then there would be too many moments of opportunity to take advantage of thier lack of resources.

I'd say 4 capitals.

Tadashi wrote:

biccat wrote:

Tadashi wrote:And ever heard of Multiple Worlds Hypothesis, if I use that, I don't need to worry about paradoxes.

Well, then I'm going to assume Superman also exists, and he comes and saves the day.

He flies around the planet, reversing its spin (and therefore time), and then takes out the ships before they have a chance to react.

Advantage: Earth.

The dozens of psykers kill themselves tearing open a warp portal suddenly in front of Superman sending him into a one-way trip into the warp.

Advantage: the Imperium

Then a blood thister is about to eat Lois Lane, and superman goes all sick house, kills the blood thirster, rescues his girl, punches a whole through the immaterium, body slams the Titan, and throws it into low earth orbit where it collides with the imperial vessels, setting off a chain reaction which destroys the entire imperial invasion force. Hooray!

GreatGunz wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

biccat wrote:

Tadashi wrote:And ever heard of Multiple Worlds Hypothesis, if I use that, I don't need to worry about paradoxes.

Well, then I'm going to assume Superman also exists, and he comes and saves the day.

He flies around the planet, reversing its spin (and therefore time), and then takes out the ships before they have a chance to react.

Advantage: Earth.

The dozens of psykers kill themselves tearing open a warp portal suddenly in front of Superman sending him into a one-way trip into the warp.

Advantage: the Imperium

Then a blood thister is about to eat Lois Lane, and superman goes all sick house, kills the blood thirster, rescues his girl, punches a whole through the immaterium, body slams the Titan, and throws it into low earth orbit where it collides with the imperial vessels, setting off a chain reaction which destroys the entire imperial invasion force. Hooray!

Then the Emperor, the Powers of Chaos, the Hive Mind, the remaining Eldar Gods, the Ork Gods, and the C'tn join forces, force superman into a kryptonian prison, send lois lane into the circles, and this planet becomes Inter-40k gladiatorial stadium 1. Number One entertainment in the galaxy whether you're human, alien, imperial, chaos, or anything else!

Joey wrote:

AtoMaki wrote:^ I'm not talking about military potence. A nicely planned airstrike could wreck a titan easily. I'm just saying that nobody would call down that airstrike because of (mostly) political reasons.

What? They won't kill a titan for "political reasons"? Are you saying the Republicans would actually be in favour of an enormous killing machine rampaging across the Mid-West?

Republicans love guns --> Titans have lots of guns --> Republicans have lots of things to love

40k technology is basically what happens when you take American Civil War technology and tactics and focus on making things look really cool for 40,000 years and don't worry about making things effective.

A Titan would be handled quickly and easily by just about any military force on Earth. And, even if it blows up, it only damages things within 8d6" (average of 28"), which is like 100 feet in real life. So, maybe it will take out a football stadium, but not a city unless it gets a surprise attack.

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:

Joey wrote:

AtoMaki wrote:^ I'm not talking about military potence. A nicely planned airstrike could wreck a titan easily. I'm just saying that nobody would call down that airstrike because of (mostly) political reasons.

What? They won't kill a titan for "political reasons"? Are you saying the Republicans would actually be in favour of an enormous killing machine rampaging across the Mid-West?

Republicans love guns --> Titans have lots of guns --> Republicans have lots of things to love

Ha ha. This is so cute. And you are way wrong. If you honestly believe that a political party in any country as whole would be against taking out something destroying their country, you are seriously messed up.

Anyways, I think that some of you are confused as to how big a Nuclear explosion is... There have been some posts saying that entire states would be destroyed in an explosion. No. Just no. Entire cities? Yes. Entire states/ smaller countries? No. So there would be pretty much nothing to fear from a Titan exploding. It would not cripple the United States economy in the slightest, and nor would it be even close to the same scale as Katrina in terms of total humanitarian aid needed (refering to the explosion of course, perhaps the titan itself could cause enough damage to rival the hurricane).

If Will Smith can take on an alien invasion with massive disk space ships with nuke proof shields I'm sure we would find a way.

If all else fails wrap it with an airship carrying a tow cable and that it down like an AT-AT.

A titan is in all purposes a god of the battlefield. In order to take one out without another titan or starship is ordinance. With enough volume of fire a titan could be brought down and the us has that amount of ordinance with airforce and army units. The titan will probably manage to take out about 4 major cities on the eastern seaboard before being brought down (one pre emptive strike, 2 failed attempts to destroy it and the final victory but the titan goes nuclear from its reactor). As for the question of Nuclear weapons against it....forget it the titans void shields are prove against the blast and the only inconveniance it would produce is that the emp will probably shut it down for an hour. If this an emperor titan then add two more cities as they are harder to destroy with the aa batteries and the army of skittarii in its legs.

I think a steady volley of bunker busting bombs would bring it down. it wouldn't happen easily.


but I bet these could dig through it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuniKsBxZ10

I think that one thing that is being forgotten here: WE live on "Holy Terra" so an Imperial titan would not be just showing up to cause carnage on our planet...


That being said now, a CHAOS titan on the other hand, would... But, I don't think that we would have as hard a time as some folks have thought... we have Paladin Tanks, Abrams tanks, (used to field) MLRS... and thats just on the ground. We also can use our Apaches and A-10s... If the amount of rounds hitting the shields doesnt pop them, then we'd want bigger and badder weapons.

Its also the fact thattitans are very rarely unsupported and a whole army normally accompanies them not to mentio that a titan demi legion is normally used in the fluff.

GentlemanGuy wrote:Its also the fact thattitans are very rarely unsupported and a whole army normally accompanies them not to mentio that a titan demi legion is normally used in the fluff.

Hence why he said "one titan".
A legion of titans wouldn't beg the question.

Paladins aren't tanks. They don't have enough armor to stand up to front line combat - what they are is mobile artillery platforms housing a 155mm smooth bore cannon fixed front.

I'd say the titan would be able to destroy quite a good chunk of wherever it landed. Nuclear strikes would be the absolute last response, and thanks to bureaucracy it would most likely have time between each attack for its void shields to recover.

If it landed in the "breadbasket" then it wouldn't do too much damage - if it landed on the eastern or western seaboard, it would do some pretty severe damage. If it landed in DC, it would be able to level DC and kill everything in it before the president and VP could even escape - thus preventing any kind of nuclear retaliation. The launch codes aren't exactly spread out among a lot of people, and all of those people are in the DC/Richmond/Maryland metropolitan area.

And blast weapons would be extremely effective against our aircraft - just like flak guns in WWII, shrapnel is the bane of airplanes. An A-10 Warthog might be able to withstand the barrage, but only barely, and that's an airplane that's well known as "the flying tank" because of the amount of armor on it and how well it can take a hit (seriously, there've been reports of Warthogs that landed after a mission with almost 40% of their "skin" completely shredded). This is, of course, assuming that the blast weapons have a proximity trigger option.

Going by fluff, I doubt that a titan would run out of ammunition before it ran out of targets to fire its ammunition at.

I say: solid advantage - titan.

Assuming this is a single titan without support, and going by the figure of 60m tall, I stand by my belief that it would be virtually useless vs aircraft. It's arms would be unable to move fast enough to target a high-speed jet, meaning only the Hydra batteries on an Emperor's back would be of much use, and even then they can't swing downwards much. In addition, this thing has a max speed of... not much. 40mph, being optimistic? Meaning it would take decades for it to level the entire US, simply because of the distances involved.
A Titan is also top-heavy and tall. A large enough blast to the torso could topple it, and as soon as it falls, it's not getting back up.
Then there's the size of a city, which a lot of people seem to underestimate. A Titan doesn't have nuclear armaments, so it would take several days to level a moderately-sized city, at least. Probably a week or more. Meaning if it did attack DC, the President and any other VIPs would have plenty of time to escape. Overall, we'd have a hell of a lot of time to organise a defence, and if worst comes to worst we could always nuke it when it's manoeuvring between cities. A titan is incredibly destructive, but it's also very slow and impractical. I'm not saying it's useless, and it would be able to deal severe casualties, but without support it would be ineffective.

Actually now that I think more about it, if you are inside the void shields the shields are ineffective.

So at most it would only take a few Apache's to force a M-Kill, F-Kill, or C-Kill on the titan.

It also depends on how well our military rolls. They could fire everything and just fail to penetrate, or roll all "crew shaken" results!

I would also assume that certain terrain features of the US are not very conducive to Titan movement, and there is a good chance that it would fail its dangerous terrain tests at the Grand Canyon, or perhaps along the Continental Divide.

A single MOAB is all it would take.

Nukes as a first response simply would not happen. They would be effective, but it just wouldn't happen. The fallout would cause far too much devastation, much more than the titan itself would cause.

Now a fuel air explosive on the other hand. Yeah, it's going to wipe out a massive area of land, but it's not going to wreck slith across the country because of a radioactive cloud.

And for everyone who keeps bringing up void shields as a point of contention...

Void shields are absolutely irrelevant against most of the types of weaponry being discussed. In the case of FAE and Nuclear weapons, that's because these are not impact detonated explosives. There is no big missile hitting the ground, and going boom as a result. The void shields will not have a chance to blink the missile out of reality, simple because the missile will detonate once getting within a predetermined distance of the target. Something vastly outside the reach of the Void Shield's sphere of influence.

And if you think Void Shields are all-encompassing, all-protecting, tell that to the Ork who drove his bike through the windshield of a titan. That's canon, folks. A warbike can penetrate void shields, and the glass protecting the crew.. A MOAB would create a massive overpressure wave, followed by a massive fireball, and just when the titan thinks it's done being gakked in the bum, the air is going to cool down rapidly enough to create a partial vacuum which will act like a little hurricane pulling every piece of nearby landscape towards the center of the blast. The center of the blast being the titan, remember? So we're talking about dropping buildings on it, sending telephone poles at it with such velocity that they could penetrate the thick-as-slith armor. And keep in mind, the missile doesn't even have to get that close to the titan to do this. There will be no opportunity for the void shields to do their thing before the bomb goes off.

Aww a titan would be easy to take out, just get a Gundam with a angst ridden teenage pilot to have a go at it. He should get the job done in no time then gunpla can make another model kit... =o\


The one thing that bugs me about the nukes is that some Titans are designed to survive exterminatus and that has to pump out more hurt then anything we got in our stock piles right now.

The Dies Irae survived on Istvaan maybe it's plot armour was a little thicker then the average Emperor Class Titan. --shrugs--


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Grakmar wrote:40k technology is basically what happens when you take American Civil War technology and tactics and focus on making things look really cool for 40,000 years and don't worry about making things effective.

A Titan would be handled quickly and easily by just about any military force on Earth. And, even if it blows up, it only damages things within 8d6" (average of 28"), which is like 100 feet in real life. So, maybe it will take out a football stadium, but not a city unless it gets a surprise attack.

umm you do know most engine fights happen at a range of 5-15 kilometers away. anything closer then that is considered 'Danger Close'.

GentlemanGuy wrote:Its also the fact thattitans are very rarely unsupported and a whole army normally accompanies them not to mentio that a titan demi legion is normally used in the fluff.

This should take care of supporting elements too.






Automatically Appended Next Post:

Lokas wrote:A single MOAB is all it would take.

Nukes as a first response simply would not happen. They would be effective, but it just wouldn't happen. The fallout would cause far too much devastation, much more than the titan itself would cause.

That's true. Then again, we wouldn't have to nuke it to kill it. A carrier battlegroup could do the job just fine from a couple hundred miles away. Likewise a combat air wing from half a dozen miles away. Nuclear bombs are a good starting place for the discussion, though (which is admittedly a bit ridiculous), because it demonstrates that the threat posed by a titan is not all that significant in comparison with what modern weapons can handle.

Tadashi wrote:

biccat wrote:

Tadashi wrote:And ever heard of Multiple Worlds Hypothesis, if I use that, I don't need to worry about paradoxes.

Well, then I'm going to assume Superman also exists, and he comes and saves the day.

He flies around the planet, reversing its spin (and therefore time), and then takes out the ships before they have a chance to react.

Advantage: Earth.

The dozens of psykers kill themselves tearing open a warp portal suddenly in front of Superman sending him into a one-way trip into the warp.

Advantage: the Imperium

Batman.

Advantage: Earth

Kaldor wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

biccat wrote:

Tadashi wrote:And ever heard of Multiple Worlds Hypothesis, if I use that, I don't need to worry about paradoxes.

Well, then I'm going to assume Superman also exists, and he comes and saves the day.

He flies around the planet, reversing its spin (and therefore time), and then takes out the ships before they have a chance to react.

Advantage: Earth.

The dozens of psykers kill themselves tearing open a warp portal suddenly in front of Superman sending him into a one-way trip into the warp.

Advantage: the Imperium

Batman.

Advantage: Earth

No, you're all wrong... THIS is where Aquaman will FINALLY show everyone that he can do something good!

As long as the Imperium attacks the water

GreatGunz wrote:As long as the Imperium attacks the water

most of earth is water lol XD

Nom

I guess thats true lol

Advantage: Earth

I'm going to throw this in favor of the Titan, we would probably end up surrendering if we saw one.

Not to mention the amount of Nuclear weaponry required to destroy it would probably cause more damage than it already had. The Plasma reactors inside of a Warlord Titan are also enough to power about 10 New Yorks, considering the massive amount of energy required to sustain the Titan and it's weaponry would be unfathomable by our current science. Every shot is almost a nuclear blast.

And yes for the sake of the idea now lets change it.


How much damage would 10 Warlord Titans cause supported by say, 2 Imperial Guard Regiments and 1 Company of Ultramarines?

A titans biggest advantage is fear a monsterous robot like that would cause panic not seen since they announced twilight would become a film.

Nom

nomsheep wrote:A titans biggest advantage is fear a monsterous robot like that would cause panic not seen since they announced twilight would become a film.

Nom

So what you're saying is that we get super huge projectors, and blast Twilight in the sight radius of the Titan crew, and suddenly the USofA has a 40 meter, bipedal mountain of death on its side?? Sign me up... (as long as I am issued sound/vision proof objects with which to not subject myself to said Twilight exposure)