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 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Tri wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

No, I'm not. I did not get any impression from that offer that you got any sort of monetary discount, and please don't resort to ad hominem.

Not the fact it was limited time only? Maybe i buy from e-buyer to often but limited time offer = discount.

Does the limited time offer you are familiar with tell you that there's a discount? In my experience, whenever there is a discount it's mentioned somewhere. So to me limited time event =/= discount, discount mentioned = discount. The fact that it's for a limited amount of time does not matter to me. I look for numbers, not marketing hype.

I counter this with the fact that GW had never openly told people how much their box set save. Eldar Battleforce is £70 and to buy them sperately it would cost £89 ... you will not find this figure on this page Eldar Battle Force. This is the whole reason i checked the price of the individual products, to see if it was a good saving ... it wasn't.

 Tri wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Tri wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

No, I'm not. I did not get any impression from that offer that you got any sort of monetary discount, and please don't resort to ad hominem.

Not the fact it was limited time only? Maybe i buy from e-buyer to often but limited time offer = discount.

Does the limited time offer you are familiar with tell you that there's a discount? In my experience, whenever there is a discount it's mentioned somewhere. So to me limited time event =/= discount, discount mentioned = discount. The fact that it's for a limited amount of time does not matter to me. I look for numbers, not marketing hype.

I counter this with the fact that GW had never openly told people how much their box set save. Eldar Battleforce is £70 and to buy them sperately it would cost £89 ... you will not find this figure on this page Eldar Battle Force. This is the whole reason i checked the price of the individual products, to see if it was a good saving ... it wasn't.

Not really a discount though, imo. It's just that the battleforce is cheaper than the individual kits, just as a pack of 3 sponges at the supermarket are cheaper than individual ones combined, or a 500g bag of shredded cheese is slightly cheaper than 2 bags of 250g cheese. I've never seen these larger bags say they are slightly cheaper than the individual kind; just like in the case of the battleforce, you have to do a bit of math yourself to work out how much cheaper it is. In the case of the one click offer, it is not a special set like the battleforce; it's just a way to add all of these things in one go. So continuing my analogy, instead of getting a 3 pack of sponges, you are getting 3 individual ones.

That said, the one click offer is a waste of time, and a clear case of GW having no sense of marketing. It is not, however, the greatest scam ever, nor does it warrant 2 threads full of ire.

The difference is that while one day you may use up all 3 sponges and eating 2x250 cheese is probably healthier then 1x500 , the battle forces are full of stuff you will never use. who cares if you get 2/3 of a unit for free , if it will never see play.

Makumba wrote:
The difference is that while one day you may use up all 3 sponges and eating 2x250 cheese is probably healthier then 1x500 , the battle forces are full of stuff you will never use. who cares if you get 2/3 of a unit for free , if it will never see play.

Only if you aren't creative. There's a reason why conversions exist.

Besides, warhammer isn't solely about the game; there's also the hobby aspect as well.

Out of curiosity, in what battleforce do you not use everything? In the battleforces I got (Orks and Lizardmen), I incorporated every single model into my collection.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Isn't there now some sort of law in the UK that stops monopoly's from having discount and sales? That's what I heard.

The monopoly law there is for predatory price and price gouging. Predatory would be when they sell it for below cost consistently to kill off any competition. Gouging would be raising the price to obscene levels and forcing people to buy it via the situation (AKA selling food after a natural disaster and obscene prices). This means that they can have special offers but it mustn't be a method by which to kill of other companies (take a hit now to solidify their stance later).

 Blaggard wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Isn't there now some sort of law in the UK that stops monopoly's from having discount and sales? That's what I heard.

The monopoly law there is for predatory price and price gouging. Predatory would be when they sell it for below cost consistently to kill off any competition. Gouging would be raising the price to obscene levels and forcing people to buy it via the situation (AKA selling food after a natural disaster and obscene prices). This means that they can have special offers but it mustn't be a method by which to kill of other companies (take a hit now to solidify their stance later).

Ah, I see. Well then, I guess there's no reason why GW can't have sales :/

That's kinda annoying...

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Ah, I see. Well then, I guess there's no reason why GW can't have sales :/

... yep. Now just humor me and go look here www.waylandgames.co.uk .

Notice that many of the products are discounted. In order to do this Games Workshop must be making a profit and so must Wayland Games ... So if Games Workshop is happy to take a smaller cut ... why don't we ever see that? As i mention earlier i add every thing that was in the Games Workshop 24hour bundle and got it for £298.40. Now if i went and placed that order, Games Workshop would get much less as they are sharing less money with another company.

I would also have been a happy customer because the one click bundle would have saved me £108.60. So the other way of looking at this is every body that purchased the bundle was ripped off by at least £108.60 if not more.

That is a good point...out of curiosity, did you factor in shipping?

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
That is a good point...out of curiosity, did you factor in shipping?

£7 Uk, £18 Usa ... oh and £11 France

Only? Odd, I thought it would be higher. I might have to start looking at Wayland then.

Its not only GW. the local sound and lighting company does the same. I had much the same experience with my old Djing hobby. Two mates and I calculated between us to purchase about $16k worth of gear figuring we could get a sizable discount for such a large purchase. We go into the local retailer, explain what we're after - salesman adds it up - ok that comes to $16,000 guys.
We ask - really? Can you offer us any kind of discount?
No..
Not even a dollar?
Not even a dollar guys.
Ok... Bye
Next day we order from an interstate website, save 30%. That was 7 years ago, never bothered with them since.

There's a reason why conversions exist.

\
And you convert a sentinal or a vyper in to what ?

Out of curiosity, in what battleforce do you not use everything? In the battleforces I got (Orks and Lizardmen), I incorporated every single model into my collection.

eldar-vyper
chaos csm-raptors/warptalons
space marines- assault space marines
tyranids-tryranid warriors
imperial guard-sentinal

For the viper, I would place the cannon on the bottom and use it as a special jetbike. It might not be the right size, but hey, it works. Sentinals are a tad trickier though.I guess it could work as a HWP in a admech army.

I've seen people use tyranid warriors, raptors and Assault marines, so I don't see how those are useless.

Just a recap on this because i don't want to start another i hate GWs Pricing thread ...

Don't buy the Apocalypse Formations.

Windrider Host £210.00 ... Contence 1 Eldar Autarch on Jetbike Upgrade Pack; 1 Eldar Jetbike; 6 Eldar Vyper Jetbikes; and 4 Jetbike Squadrons.

If you buy separately on the GW website that's £194.00 ... it also raises the question why would any one buy a single jetbike even for an autarch upgrade. Its only an extra £12 for 2 more jet bikes ... oh and £206 so still cheaper then the one click select...

I think I've given up on the GW website now.

I buy exclusively from Ebay and have for the last year or so...predator "one click collections" aside, I'm not going to buy from them when i can get 20-30% off elsewhere.

I work in sales for a living, I know what different tactics are employed by marketing types and I know how salespeople spin stuff. What GW is doing would be considered slimy by ANY reputable sales or marketing rep. It's deceptive, end of story.

 Tri wrote:
Just a recap on this because i don't want to start another i hate GWs Pricing thread ...

Don't buy the Apocalypse Formations.

Windrider Host £210.00 ... Contence 1 Eldar Autarch on Jetbike Upgrade Pack; 1 Eldar Jetbike; 6 Eldar Vyper Jetbikes; and 4 Jetbike Squadrons.

If you buy separately on the GW website that's £194.00 ... it also raises the question why would any one buy a single jetbike even for an autarch upgrade. Its only an extra £12 for 2 more jet bikes ... oh and £206 so still cheaper then the one click select...

I think I've given up on the GW website now.

Yeah, that is pretty dodgy. It's either they made a miscalculation, or they deliberately increased the price. Either way, this isn't good.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Tri wrote:
Just a recap on this because i don't want to start another i hate GWs Pricing thread ...

Don't buy the Apocalypse Formations.

Windrider Host £210.00 ... Contence 1 Eldar Autarch on Jetbike Upgrade Pack; 1 Eldar Jetbike; 6 Eldar Vyper Jetbikes; and 4 Jetbike Squadrons.

If you buy separately on the GW website that's £194.00 ... it also raises the question why would any one buy a single jetbike even for an autarch upgrade. Its only an extra £12 for 2 more jet bikes ... oh and £206 so still cheaper then the one click select...

I think I've given up on the GW website now.

Yeah, that is pretty dodgy. It's either they made a miscalculation, or they deliberately increased the price. Either way, this isn't good.

They based the price on individual jetbike and viper boxes, not the squadron boxes which save you money, hence the higher price.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Tri wrote:
Just a recap on this because i don't want to start another i hate GWs Pricing thread ...

Don't buy the Apocalypse Formations.

Windrider Host £210.00 ... Contence 1 Eldar Autarch on Jetbike Upgrade Pack; 1 Eldar Jetbike; 6 Eldar Vyper Jetbikes; and 4 Jetbike Squadrons.

If you buy separately on the GW website that's £194.00 ... it also raises the question why would any one buy a single jetbike even for an autarch upgrade. Its only an extra £12 for 2 more jet bikes ... oh and £206 so still cheaper then the one click select...

I think I've given up on the GW website now.

Yeah, that is pretty dodgy. It's either they made a miscalculation, or they deliberately increased the price. Either way, this isn't good.

They based the price on individual jetbike and viper boxes, not the squadron boxes which save you money, hence the higher price.

Now that's just silly. Understandable, but silly.

Even their marketing team have trouble believing that there are bundles, official, on GW site, that actually offer a discount. They probably shut it out of their mind in case they get a severe case of cerebral explosion.

GW doesn't discount on their retail prices because they don't have to. They know full well that people who want to can and will buy for less from FLGSes and online discounters. So you have to ask what does the 1 click bundle get them? They wouldn't do it if it didn't help them do something, and in this case I think it's a sales tool. It is directing traffic to the site, getting people a sneak peek at available formations, and getting people to supplement their armies by knowing what they need from FLGSes in the days before the book releases.

I have said this before, but GW doesn't actually care about new players as primary or secondary goals. They are pricing, designing and marketing to pre-existing customers thus they don't need to discount for you or the newbie. The newbie will buy full price cause they don't know any better, and you will buy at 20% discount but still buy cause your army is just slightly off. $100-$300 impulse upgrade purchase is all they need. GW is living off of pre-existing clients because this strategy ensures steady income. If they wanted to grow the base you'd see really entry level access points and deals. GW has settled into a business model that works. How many new model kits have they released this year? Maybe 20-25 total? Most of them $100-$300 army "upgrades" too expensive for newbies, but just right for us all to upgrade with.

I do not like it, the hobby is expensive, but...I'm addicted to the plastic crack and my dealer knows how to string me along. There is no advantage to discounts no matter how much I want them. Their business model is locked in and working.

@YakManDoo.
GW plc are not marketing to anyone.(They do not have a marketing department! )
Kirby wants the rules (codex) to pimp the latest minature releases to 11 to 16 year old boys.

GW plc charge over 4 times what it cost to develop and manufacture the products.
Because there are people out there who buy GW rules that do not care about game play, and people who buy GW product to keep their kids quiet.
And the addicts who can not quit their expencive plastic crack habit.

^ Actually a website is a marketing device as is WD

They produce marketing videos, and they produce t-shirts and swag...they have a marketing department. A marketing department's job is to increase sales and visibility in whatever form possible.

If you go to their site to look at models or deals, you have just participated in their marketing. No one wants these prices, and if it were really hurting them, then they would stop doing it as they are still a business that likes to make money. They haven't stopped doing it, so something must be working for them.

GW has a discount system it's called Wayland Games, The Warstore and others...THEY ARE THE DISCOUNT PROGRAM. The website works on existing players by driving traffic, showing off the Apocalypse formations, then having people say, "Hey, you know what? I only need unit X, Y, Z the new book, those new templates, and I can play Apoc! Whew I got away with a $300 investment and I'm still up to date! And I will pay 20% less with Wayland or some other discounter." GW still sells product, and oh look! The existing player base still bought models. The newbie, the under-a-rock living, or the non-cash conscientious buys direct and pays zero shipping. The pre-existing playerbase buys from Wayland and low and behold! GW sold you models either way.

My point to the OP is that GW is in fact discounting by having resellers. That is their discount program and their direct sales aren't as much about direct sales as they are a marketing tool to drive traffic that may or may not buy directly. They don't discount? They absolutely do, just not through their direct marketing channel.

If they weren't so hostile toward 3rd party retailers I would agree with that hypothesis

 shamikebab wrote:
I remember the buy two get one free blister pack/box set deals :(

I took advantage of one of those when the Sydney City store had its grand opening. Picked up 6 Chimeras for the price of 4. It was fantastic.

Last sale GW every had in this country.

YakManDoo wrote:
words

EA is The Worst Company in America ... however they do discount.

I have on and off been a supporter of GW since 3rd Edition of 40k ... that's almost 15 years. In the old days ...
I got discounts in from staff for buy lots of stuff
They would help the kid make their army (often letting them use glue and spray models)
If they wanted to shift more of X, they reduce the price a bit and/or have a painting/modeling competition (popular one had a prize of a dread)
If you got a box set there was a discount.
There were sales.
You could order individual parts for conversion.

In short I felt GW was a small company, that cared about having me as a customer. That's gone all that's left is the smiling people behind the till.

Have a nice day now.

YakManDoo wrote:
They produce marketing videos, and they produce t-shirts and swag...they have a marketing department. A marketing department's job is to increase sales and visibility in whatever form possible.

If you go to their site to look at models or deals, you have just participated in their marketing. No one wants these prices, and if it were really hurting them, then they would stop doing it as they are still a business that likes to make money. They haven't stopped doing it, so something must be working for them.

Marketing videos? You know that those videos are 100% private. You cannot find them on YouTube unless you have the link. They only show up because GW puts them on their website. Having a website is not advertising. Selling T-shirts (on your own website) is not advertising.

Advertising is ad-banners on high profile sites like Dakka, Whineseer, Taco Bell and TTGN.

YakManDoo wrote:
GW has a discount system it's called Wayland Games, The Warstore and others...THEY ARE THE DISCOUNT PROGRAM.

No. Those are stockists. Please learn the difference.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

pantsonhead wrote:
It's that GW is very obviously trying to trick people into thinking that they're getting an unusually good price on something.

But...they aren't? It doesn't say anywhere that you are saving money.

The limited time offer and big letters make you think it's a special deal, when in fact all you get is all the products added to your shopping basket with one click instead of several. Savings are never offered but the bundle did make people think there's an offer, either in money savings or something extra added.

So? Did it flat out say that money is being saved? People making assumptions is not GW's fault.

I'm a bit late on the convo but here's my take.

GW is basically hanging a sign outside of a bar that reads FREEofBEER!!!!

its just sad that they cant offer even a SLIGHT break on things like the apocalypse formations sets, you look at it like woah thats a lot of stuff and possibly a good deal, then you total its all up normally and its the same....

They now see themselves as a premium brand, and premium brands don't discount because it makes their product look less valuable and more obtainable than it actually is. GW seem to be thinking that like the perfume and makeup market, people feel they are getting quality when they pay a lot. They pay cheap and they don't value the product. GW would rather destroy excess stock than discount and clear it.

This works, and it is the only reason I can think of that explains why they are still making money. They sell trash like Finecast but insist on telling people it's great, that they are the world's best and that you can pay way more than is reasonable. But people buy in significant quantities so their strategy isn't that wide of the mark unfortunately. People like buying premium product, even when it's rubbish. Works for plenty of other industries.

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
They now see themselves as a premium brand, and premium brands don't discount because it makes their product look less valuable and more obtainable than it actually is. GW seem to be thinking that like the perfume and makeup market, people feel they are getting quality when they pay a lot. They pay cheap and they don't value the product. GW would rather destroy excess stock than discount and clear it.

This works, and it is the only reason I can think of that explains why they are still making money. They sell trash like Finecast but insist on telling people it's great, that they are the world's best and that you can pay way more than is reasonable. But people buy in significant quantities so their strategy isn't that wide of the mark unfortunately. People like buying premium product, even when it's rubbish. Works for plenty of other industries.

The problem with that strategy is we've seen GW's financial reports, and their profit is effectively stagnant ever since the LOTR bubble burst. All the price rises and design changes since then have effectively amounted to nothing but lost sales. Considerable lost sales, in fact, given the scale of their price increases. I'm very curious as to what the next report indicates, as they've seen released the Hobbit to much, ahem, fanfare, changed their codex release rate completely, introduced 1-click bundles for the less savvy customer and aggressively gone after independent stockists.