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 AduroT wrote:
For an additional note, Retribution of Scyrah just won Masters at Templecon, another of the factions that's typically considered on the lower tiers of competitiveness.

Anything can win when Neo or God (pick one based on your point of view) is playing it.

Yes, anything can win any given game via luck. But, it takes more than just luck to win a tournament the size of Templecon.
The same thing can be said about luck with any endevour. You can fall out of a plane at 10000 feet without a parachute and live if you have enough luck. http://www.cracked.com/article_19996_5-insane-falls-you-wont-believe-people-survived.html

I think what I love the most about Warmahordes is that there is no "killer list" that just destroys. Look at the Las Vegas 40k tourney - the winner fielded the quintessential cheeseball Eldar army (Serpent spam with 2++ rerollable saves) and pretty much nobody could stop him because the list was so broken. In a WM/H tourney you have your power lists, but it's not an "I win" button like in 40k.

I think people that have played for a while tend to forget that WM/H is capable of delivering the most miserable experience possible to a new player.
That's what people tend to talk about in a negative way and see as 'cheesy'. The learning curve is intimidating, especially if you aren't playing with 'friends'. You need to know your caster, but then you also need to know every caster you face and all their interactions or you can literally lose in a couple of turns without doing a thing.
This isn't a knock on the game, people just tend to forget the first impression that it can often give, especially when 'those guys' are involved.

 plastictrees wrote:
I think people that have played for a while tend to forget that WM/H is capable of delivering the most miserable experience possible to a new player.
That's what people tend to talk about in a negative way and see as 'cheesy'. The learning curve is intimidating, especially if you aren't playing with 'friends'. You need to know your caster, but then you also need to know every caster you face and all their interactions or you can literally lose in a couple of turns without doing a thing.
This isn't a knock on the game, people just tend to forget the first impression that it can often give, especially when 'those guys' are involved.

This is jist of it really.

ideally you need quite a few battlebox games to get the hang of the rules and then start increasing the game size slowly. I played a 50pt game recently and it got very messy, very different from the journeyman league games where i'm doing better going up in increments.

The main thing that must be pointed out to new palyers coming from a GW background is that filthy tricks and cunning combos are part of the game and they will screw you up when you are new. Moreover timing is more essential, i lost a game by trying to do an assassination run with scorcha a turn early, left his caster on 1 HP and splat... oh well Its these situations that create the chess dynamic, which is actually in my view very good as it enables analysis of where you went wrong without at first blaming the army list you brought along. Prime example in that 50pt game i was getting battered until my opponent made a misake and moved a little too close... Butcher activated cast his feat+ full throttle and one angry spriggan warjack spalttered harvenger in two hits. A rather juicy abuse of the reach rules, those extra 2 inches...

Thats what makes the game very appealing, there maybe a steep learning curve but once you begin to remove the GW prejudice of uber lsits and waac palyers, things go along better. As page 5 makes clear, you give your best but don't be a [i'll leave that to your imagination] and have a good time. I've found most folks who play it to be rather nice and a good laugh is had when things go wrong on both sides without the recriminations about "cheese" etc.

Personally I find wm/h to be the superior tournament game due to the tighter rules set and the fact that you can get official answers to rules questions. I only wish it was more accessible to me where I am since the local group plays on a night I can't make it down :(

 plastictrees wrote:
I think people that have played for a while tend to forget that WM/H is capable of delivering the most miserable experience possible to a new player.
That's what people tend to talk about in a negative way and see as 'cheesy'. The learning curve is intimidating, especially if you aren't playing with 'friends'. You need to know your caster, but then you also need to know every caster you face and all their interactions or you can literally lose in a couple of turns without doing a thing.
This isn't a knock on the game, people just tend to forget the first impression that it can often give, especially when 'those guys' are involved.

This. 100 times THIS
I went into a game night for WM/H for a battlebox game. No one wanted too. They sai they could borrow their army so I can play. Boom 5 min later my caster is dead. They knew I was just learning. So yeah.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 plastictrees wrote:
I think people that have played for a while tend to forget that WM/H is capable of delivering the most miserable experience possible to a new player.
That's what people tend to talk about in a negative way and see as 'cheesy'. The learning curve is intimidating, especially if you aren't playing with 'friends'. You need to know your caster, but then you also need to know every caster you face and all their interactions or you can literally lose in a couple of turns without doing a thing.
This isn't a knock on the game, people just tend to forget the first impression that it can often give, especially when 'those guys' are involved.

This. 100 times THIS
I went into a game night for WM/H for a battlebox game. No one wanted too. They sai they could borrow their army so I can play. Boom 5 min later my caster is dead. They knew I was just learning. So yeah.

Have you talked to the local PG about battlebox games? That's what they're their for. If he/she is turning you down for demo games, contact PP and file a complaint as he's not doing his job.

He isnt there on those nights often. I know him and he is awesome. But i dont think he is there often. The times I have met him and played he was great.