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Made in gb
Mighty Vampire Count






UK

 Sigvatr wrote:
 Mr Morden wrote:
 Sigvatr wrote:
Can we get less Daenarys and more Tyrion scenes please? :(


Why? Best bits in the show imo - her feeding the dragons was a glorious scene............ Tyrion / Jorah was good but Dany asserting herself was a joy to behold........



Daenarys isn't interesting. She is a terrible leader and while the books portray it better, even in the series, she just sucks at the job. The dragon feeding scene was bad, in my eyes, as it tried to make her look "badass" when in fact, we have just seen her incompetence and immaturity in the last episode. Extremely uninteresting character. Not as bad as Dorne or, gods beware, the magical Stark boys, but very meh-ish.

My main problem is the poor portrayal in the series. Her character doesn't feel genuine because we are shown two very different sides. The series tries to make her look more empowering and less of a "victim" than she is in the books, but that doesn't rhyme with her immense incompetence. Her (series) character has a few very rough edges.


Ah well each to their own - but I completely disagree with everything you wrote

One of the many many problems with the most recent books was the lazy and retrograde depiction of Dany as a feckless teenager only obsessed with her merc lover...... in contrast the show shows that she has grown and evolved through bitter experience from her victimised start to a strong and powerful queen, a little touched by her families madness but someone in control and making the right decisions - by and large.

In the books - she is only a victim when her brother is alive and then again in the terrible Dances with Dragons.

She could have gone down the "lets kill them all" like her lover suggested but showed both her true power (Dragons) on one hand williness to compromise on the other (Open the pits and marriage on the other. Ot also reminded everyone that she was a Valyrian still and as her lover said - without her Dragons she was no queen. That feeding scene showed her taking back command and also showing the Masters the alternative to working with her -0 which she still offered.

People do foolish things - look at everyone else in the world - they make really really bad choices for what they think of as good reasons - case in point is Ned Stark - because he won;t compromise his precious honour he drives the realm to civil war and gets most of his family slaughtered - it scarcely mattered whose son Joffrey was to the majority of the people...............

But I am bais as she is my fav character in the show and books

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
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"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

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North of your position

Right decisions?

Remember when she crucified hundreds of people without trial?

   
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Well, they (head of households of the ruling class) knew they were screwed when she launched barrels of chain bindings collected off the dead slaves lining the road to the city

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 thenoobbomb wrote:
Right decisions?

Remember when she crucified hundreds of people without trial?


And then gets her knickers in a twist when a member of the Sons of the Harpy is murdered by a vengeful freed slave angry over the massacres being perpetrated by them.
   
Made in gb
Mighty Vampire Count






UK

 thenoobbomb wrote:
Right decisions?

Remember when she crucified hundreds of people without trial?


Trials - she is a Queen - thats not how it works in her world. Rulers make judgements and act on them. Trials are held for poltical reasons - who in the show or books ever had a trial who was not noble born?

and? They were the ones who crucifed the children as mileposts......

Quite in keeping with her world and how it works -and in doing so won the adoration of tens of thousands. It also gave a focus for the anger of the slaves - you will recall the ones whose children had been crucifed - many many more owuld have died if the slaves had simply been aloowed to vent their anger on the "feee people"

And then gets her knickers in a twist when a member of the Sons of the Harpy is murdered by a vengeful freed slave angry over the massacres being perpetrated by them


Ah well yeah that was a bad call - she should have banished him or something but was trying to show "fairness" - she should have fed a few Masters to her Dragons earlier as an example of what it was to defy her rule.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/05/13 19:01:11


I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

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North of your position

Not all of them did that. She was basically just going all out "All X are Y!".

A true king or queen would have given them a fair trial, or at least would've spared the innocent.

   
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What I'm getting at is that it was an abrupt U turn.

When the slave children were crucified en masse by the Masters, she crucified the Masters en masse regardless of their guilt.

But now that she's got to worry about keeping the peace in Meereen, she's agonising over the murder of a known member of the Sons of the Harpy, executed the murderer thereby straining the loyalty of the slaves who once called her "Mhysa!".

The show might be streamlining the process a bit, but she is definitely an ineffective ruler at this point, flailing about trying to do something, anything to fix things. This is the Danny of the books.

I'm looking forward to the upcoming battle in the fighting pits and Drogon cameo. She'll be getting a new Khalasar next Season.



 Mr Morden wrote:
Ah well yeah that was a bad call - she should have banished him or something but was trying to show "fairness" - she should have fed a few Masters to her Dragons earlier as an example of what it was to defy her rule.


Daenerys Targaryen: wrote:"You have been tried and found guilty. I hereby sentence you to death by Dragon!".




This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/05/13 21:15:17


 
   
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 thenoobbomb wrote:
Not all of them did that. She was basically just going all out "All X are Y!".

A true king or queen would have given them a fair trial, or at least would've spared the innocent.


Which King or Queen in the show / books would have bothered with a trial in the same situation - Her ancestors wouldn't, Robert? Cersei? Joffrey? Stanis? Nope........... Nearest to "true Fair King" is Stanis - and he burns people -alive to appease Melisande.

She needed to show the freed slaves the new order and impose her will on the former masters - lastly she took vengeance on all their behalf - in the hope that they wuld not do worse. It was a conquered city - bad things happy to conquered cities in history and /or fantasy.

We need to judge her by the standards of her world - ot ours................ She killed how many people - a hundred or so was it - and took a city without massive bloodshed.

"Fair and honourable" men like Ned Stark caused the deaths of thousands and achieved nothing.

What I'm getting at is that it was an abrupt U turn.
That was a mistake - she should have kept her followers happy and said something along the lines of - "he did wrong" but I will show mercy etc ........banished him - kept the former slaves happy.

No the Dany of the books was manipulated left and right by advistor and later husband, weak at te knees over her merc lover and terrified of her own Dragons - the show one is regaining control over them all.............

I hope they keep the changes and don;t do the character reset to the back to the Dothraki - Drogon has already visited her once and hopefully will do again - if they ignore all the slave caravan crap GRM came up with just to keep her and Tyrion apart she will have a wiley advisor if she still want to return to Westros. Show her Dragons to the people of her city......

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/05/13 21:25:39


I AM A MARINE PLAYER

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"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

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North of your position

Meanwhile, Daenerys kills a lot of innocent, destabilises an entire region, and incites a bloody civil war.

   
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 thenoobbomb wrote:
Meanwhile, Daenerys kills a lot of innocent, destabilises an entire region, and incites a bloody civil war.


You can't make an omlete without breaking a few eggs.

Daenerys freed tens of thousands from brutal and unrelenting slavery and death, gives them hope and perhaps a new realm. Again who are you comparing her to in her world - Stanis, Cersie? Robert? Joffrey? The Boltons? Thats the people whose world she lives in?

There is no civil war - those who lost thier position and power are trying to take it back - they need to be winnowed out and killed. You remember the ones who crucify hundreds of children to make a point ?

What did Fair and Honourable Ned Stark achive except death and misery for everyone?

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/05/13 21:33:33


I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

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I thought it was pretty kool the guy that got volunteered by her to marry was already on his knees

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 Jihadin wrote:
I thought it was pretty kool the guy that got volunteered by her to marry was already on his knees


It was nicely done - as she remarked upon

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

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North of your position

 Mr Morden wrote:
 thenoobbomb wrote:
Meanwhile, Daenerys kills a lot of innocent, destabilises an entire region, and incites a bloody civil war.


You can't make an omlete without breaking a few eggs.

Daenerys freed tens of thousands from brutal and unrelenting slavery and death, gives them hope and perhaps a new realm. Again who are you comparing her to in her world - Stanis, Cersie? Robert? Joffrey? The Boltons? Thats the people whose world she lives in?

There is no civil war - those who lost thier position and power are trying to take it back - they need to be winnowed out and killed. You remember the ones who crucify hundreds of children to make a point ?

What did Fair and Honourable Ned Stark achive except death and misery for everyone?

Stannis, of course. He wouldn't crucify the innocent to make a point - even those that are burned by Melisandre are guilty of crimes.

The whole war in the streets certainly seems like the start of a civil war, eh? As for those children, I guess the masters needed to make a point, too - which means it's perfectly fine, right?

   
Made in gb
Mighty Vampire Count






UK

 thenoobbomb wrote:
 Mr Morden wrote:
 thenoobbomb wrote:
Meanwhile, Daenerys kills a lot of innocent, destabilises an entire region, and incites a bloody civil war.


You can't make an omlete without breaking a few eggs.

Daenerys freed tens of thousands from brutal and unrelenting slavery and death, gives them hope and perhaps a new realm. Again who are you comparing her to in her world - Stanis, Cersie? Robert? Joffrey? The Boltons? Thats the people whose world she lives in?

There is no civil war - those who lost thier position and power are trying to take it back - they need to be winnowed out and killed. You remember the ones who crucify hundreds of children to make a point ?

What did Fair and Honourable Ned Stark achive except death and misery for everyone?

Stannis, of course. He wouldn't crucify the innocent to make a point - even those that are burned by Melisandre are guilty of crimes.

The whole war in the streets certainly seems like the start of a civil war, eh? As for those children, I guess the masters needed to make a point, too - which means it's perfectly fine, right?


Stannis wouldn't crucify the innocent to make a point - do you even watch the show - that was Exactly why he burnt people alive - because they would not accept the "new" religion and to prove a point to everyone else - obey me (and the Lord of Light) or burn. I have no problem with that in the context of the world they live in.....

A few terrorists attacking people from ambush is not a civil war - its exactly as I stated, those who have lost power trying to terrorise everyone by striking back. We shall see how they react to the opening of the pits/marriage/Dragon eating example.

Yeah crucifying children was the same as selecting those guilty of ordering the same and "enacting Justice upon them" as Dany says

You keep missing the point - this is the world they all live in - its not a nice safe home in the 20th century - its a quasi medieval world where life is very very cheap - people die - horribly - on the whims of those in power - why do you want to pretend that somehow Dany is the worst offender in this regard.

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

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A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
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Stanis would kill every child with royal blood to get his way, in the name of the Lord of Light.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/05/14 10:27:48


 
   
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 d-usa wrote:
Stanis would kill every child with royal blood to get his way, in the name of the Lord of Light.


Indeed and anyone who did not bend the knee or worship the Lord of Light. Is what those using religion as a power source do and always did in the past.

Stannis and Dany are sometimes considered the "nice" ones and they yet will commit - what are to us horrific acts - but compare them with the Bolton's and you see why they are considered such. Look back at anceient and medieval rulers and see what they did "to make a point"...............

Remember Varis is trying to get Dany on the throne, ironically as the one to break the chain of oppression of the weak by the strong - not sure its ever going to be that clear cut - as Tyrion says..........

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
Made in nl
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North of your position

 Mr Morden wrote:
 thenoobbomb wrote:
 Mr Morden wrote:
 thenoobbomb wrote:
Meanwhile, Daenerys kills a lot of innocent, destabilises an entire region, and incites a bloody civil war.


You can't make an omlete without breaking a few eggs.

Daenerys freed tens of thousands from brutal and unrelenting slavery and death, gives them hope and perhaps a new realm. Again who are you comparing her to in her world - Stanis, Cersie? Robert? Joffrey? The Boltons? Thats the people whose world she lives in?

There is no civil war - those who lost thier position and power are trying to take it back - they need to be winnowed out and killed. You remember the ones who crucify hundreds of children to make a point ?

What did Fair and Honourable Ned Stark achive except death and misery for everyone?

Stannis, of course. He wouldn't crucify the innocent to make a point - even those that are burned by Melisandre are guilty of crimes.

The whole war in the streets certainly seems like the start of a civil war, eh? As for those children, I guess the masters needed to make a point, too - which means it's perfectly fine, right?


Stannis wouldn't crucify the innocent to make a point - do you even watch the show - that was Exactly why he burnt people alive - because they would not accept the "new" religion and to prove a point to everyone else - obey me (and the Lord of Light) or burn. I have no problem with that in the context of the world they live in.....

A few terrorists attacking people from ambush is not a civil war - its exactly as I stated, those who have lost power trying to terrorise everyone by striking back. We shall see how they react to the opening of the pits/marriage/Dragon eating example.

Yeah crucifying children was the same as selecting those guilty of ordering the same and "enacting Justice upon them" as Dany says

You keep missing the point - this is the world they all live in - its not a nice safe home in the 20th century - its a quasi medieval world where life is very very cheap - people die - horribly - on the whims of those in power - why do you want to pretend that somehow Dany is the worst offender in this regard.

You do realize the Florents were trying to manipulate Stannis and were found guilty of treason, right? They were guilty.

And AGAIN, Dany crucified many innocents as well.

Sure, it's a medieval world. Doesn't mean that the Stockholm syndrome girl with clear mental problems is in any way justified of her actions other than "huu I have dragons". I really can't stand her. Continuously making bad decisions, cringeworthy lines, and a massive amount of plot armor coupled with a completely messed up personality does not make for a character I could even mildly enjoy, let alone support.

   
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Lets agree to disagree - we obviously have diametrically opposed viewpoints that will never tailor together - as much as I am bias and love her - you obviously hate her - so neither is going to be impartial.

finally "huu I have dragons" - IS all the justification she needs - THATS how HER world works FOR everyone. Power makes right- for ALL the characters

Same with Stannis - you obviously feel the same way about him as Stannis - so again not real conversation to be had.


I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

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The Rock

Has anyone watched Ep 4 yet?

Spoiler:
Have they seriously killed off Grey Worm and Barristan Selmy?!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/05/14 10:59:17


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 angelofvengeance wrote:
Has anyone watched Ep 4 yet?

Spoiler:
Have they seriously killed off Grey Worm and Barristan Selmy?!


yes - do you want to know? if so:

Spoiler:
Grey Worm - alive and being tended to by pretty former slave girl
Selmy - died

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
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The Rock

 Mr Morden wrote:


yes - do you want to know? if so:

Spoiler:
Grey Worm - alive and being tended to by pretty former slave girl
Selmy - died


Spoiler:
So what are they going to do when Daenerys flies off on Drogon then? Selmy is supposed to be in charge of Meereen's security with Hizdahr ruling as King.

AoV's Hobby Blog 29/04/18 The Tomb World stirs p44
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I would take a guess that...

Spoiler:
Mormont arrives just as Dany flies off, leaving him and Tyrion to take care of things, because one of the Dothraki or something vouch for him.

They probably decided that Selmy and Mormont were too similar to keep around in the same place and will be combining their arcs now that Selmy's gone.
   
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 angelofvengeance wrote:
 Mr Morden wrote:


yes - do you want to know? if so:

Spoiler:
Grey Worm - alive and being tended to by pretty former slave girl
Selmy - died


Spoiler:
So what are they going to do when Daenerys flies off on Drogon then? Selmy is supposed to be in charge of Meereen's security with Hizdahr ruling as King.


They don't have to follow the book in this, they are doing lots of things differently - and much better by cutitng out loads of crap IMO.

it could be that

Spoiler:
Trouble in the arena - Drogon comes down and burns the bad guys, reunites them and Dany continues to rule - plus Jorah and Tyrion should be there soon unless they screw it up like GRM did

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

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A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
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Well, you know, Mormont is on a limited time table in regards to ruling anything now.......

 
   
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I can see them curing him actually... As part of the thing when they're going to pull the Red Priests into Dany's storyline.
   
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UK

 Compel wrote:
I can see them curing him actually... As part of the thing when they're going to pull the Red Priests into Dany's storyline.


If they do it...........

Spoiler:
Stannis daughter
had it arrested - wasn't it a healer from Drone who fixed her?

In the show have we actually seen any example of the actual Red Priests being able to heal etc? - Melisande has not that I can recall? They seem to only use destructive magic?


I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





The Rock

 Mr Morden wrote:
 Compel wrote:
I can see them curing him actually... As part of the thing when they're going to pull the Red Priests into Dany's storyline.


If they do it...........

Spoiler:
Stannis daughter
had it arrested - wasn't it a healer from Drone who fixed her?

In the show have we actually seen any example of the actual Red Priests being able to heal etc? - Melisande has not that I can recall? They seem to only use destructive magic?



Yup- Thoros of Myr brings Beric Dondarrion back after the Hound chops him in Trial by Combat.

AoV's Hobby Blog 29/04/18 The Tomb World stirs p44
How to take decent photos of your models
There's a beast in every man, and it stirs when you put a sword in his hand
Most importantly, Win or Lose, always try to have fun.
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 angelofvengeance wrote:
 Mr Morden wrote:
 Compel wrote:
I can see them curing him actually... As part of the thing when they're going to pull the Red Priests into Dany's storyline.


If they do it...........

Spoiler:
Stannis daughter
had it arrested - wasn't it a healer from Drone who fixed her?

In the show have we actually seen any example of the actual Red Priests being able to heal etc? - Melisande has not that I can recall? They seem to only use destructive magic?



Yup- Thoros of Myr brings Beric Dondarrion back after the Hound chops him in Trial by Combat.


Is he still a Red Priest? and they kinda seem to have moved away from that whole story and the Red Priests reviving the undead?

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A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
Made in nl
Wight Lord with the Sword of Kings






North of your position

He is a red priest.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/05/14 15:51:03


   
Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

 thenoobbomb wrote:
He is a red priest.


Speaking of...we haven't seen the Brotherhood in a loooooooong ass time.

 
   
 
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