? about Vehicles in 7ed

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**zilka86**

Did vehicles get fixed in 7ed our they still easy kill pts inless there av14 . I like some good info on this as its holding me back from getting in to 7ed

**Desubot**

Things did change. Generally for the better.

Check the book at your local LFGS.

**zilka86**

I don't have a place to go to check it out its just me and my brother who play

**Desubot**

Well to keep it simple HP striping is the same as 6th but 1 shoting tanks is harder now. so take what you will of that.

**Vaktathi**

AV10-12 vehicles are largely just as easy to kill as they were in 6th. It's more difficult to kill them via Explodes results (need an AP1/2 weapon), but they die to HP's (the primary 6E killer) just the same.

Heavy tanks are very tough indeed now. Lighter vehicles, particularly one's that aren't skimmers, are still very fragile.

**Archon_Zarbyrn**

Vehicles gain several boost in this edition: First only a roll of 7 or higher will make a vehicle explode. 2nd vehicles always count as WS1 even stationary making it harder for units such as Wyches with haywire to kill them. 3rd MCs in general will have much more trouble killing a vehicle now since Smash is a single attack at double strength. In general vehicles are much harder to kill in a single shot/attack but stripping them of hull points is still an effective method.

**Jancoran**

zilka86 wrote:
Did vehicles get fixed in 7ed our they still easy kill pts inless there av14 . I like some good info on this as its holding me back from getting in to 7ed

6E and 7E didn't necessarily make vehicles worse. In fact for some, the vehicles got better. 7E is the most vehicle friendly edition i can remember for sure.

**Makumba**

My chimeras die just the same as they die , my vendettas die faster , because there is fewer of them and the 90 degree arc hurts their shoting a lot , technicly my two Russes got more resilient , if it wasn't for the fact that they die from melta in pods or firedragons and lance weapons , and from time to time grav weapons. But at least they no longer get killed by FMC and helldrakes . The WS1 is a big bonus vs new smash too.

**zilka86**

So i still won't be able to use my 5 rhinos i guess all have to brake down and getdrop pods as my style of mech inf marines still sucks

Automatically Appended Next Post:
So i still won't be able to use my 5 rhinos i guess all have to brake down and getdrop pods as my style of mech inf marines still sucks

**Vaktathi**

Jancoran wrote:
zilka86 wrote:
Did vehicles get fixed in 7ed our they still easy kill pts inless there av14 . I like some good info on this as its holding me back from getting in to 7ed

6E and 7E didn't necessarily make vehicles worse. In fact for some, the vehicles got better. 7E is the most vehicle friendly edition i can remember for sure.

in 6E vehicles got notably worse, you saw most non-skimmer armies abandon the vast majority of non-heavy armor. You saw lots of Skimmers in 6E with cover save enhancing wargear or AV13 shields but few others. 7E vehicles regained more utility and less chance to insta-die, but light and medium vehicles are still exceedingly easy to HP to death.

**Jancoran**

who cares what the tanks took. The math to kill Land Raiders says they are harder to kill in 6E and even harder in 7E.

Dark eldar transports: way better. there are other examples.

Not everyone made out as well. that much is true. But largely, the Vehicle changes to ONE chart made the tanks that WERE alive more capable of actually influencing the battle longer...which caused more enemies to have to KEEP firing instead of being able to move on to other targets.
In any event, this argument mattersd not at all. 7E is now a VERY vehicle friendly system.

**PrinceRaven**

Rhinos are 35 point single unit Void Shields that give the unit extra mobility, they were never bad.

**zilka86**

Rhinos to me are very bad thing not worth 35 pts

**Desubot**

zilka86 wrote:
Rhinos to me are very bad thing not worth 35 pts

Ok seems your mind is made up.

**TheCustomLime**

Rhinos arent bad at all. They are fast and they keep your squad alive.

**BoomWolf**

If you think 35 point rhino is bad, look at my 80 point devilfish in the eyes.

It's equipped with a BC and 2 gun drones at that price. no fire points of any sort or the likes.
(thats a total of 8 S5AP5 shots for 18" range. not alot.)

Honestly, rhinos are a nice transpont, people just seem to think that if its not giving you easy 75% or more chance to make it to enemy backlines, its worthless.
They neglect the fact its cheap. 2 squads in rhinos is probably cheaper then 3 squads, and they have a better chance to make it across.

**Zagman**

zilka86 wrote:
Rhinos to me are very bad thing not worth 35 pts

Who else are fielding 35pt Objective Secured units that are generally immune to S4 firepower and as resilient as a Rhino? And they are pretty darn mobile. And they can protect, transport, and shield troops.

How exactly are they bad?

In 7th they got a bit harder to kill. Gained Objective Secured. Protect other Objective Secured Units. Make other Objective Awcured Units more mobile. Are still chap. And can still block LOS and grant cover.

**conker249**

I was going to respond, then I saw the OP's username. It usually leads to "X sucks, Why does anyone use X, I should sell my army"

**zilka86**

35 Pts that don't last past trun 2 is never good . i just say in my gaming experience rhinos aren't very good i have tryed use 2 in my first few games of 7 and they still just to easy to kill

**Arson Fire**

Their job is to protect a squad of infantry for a turn or two, and get them where they need to go.

Yes they die easily, but better them than the guys inside.

**PrinceRaven**

zilka86 wrote:
35 Pts that don't last past trun 2 is never good . i just say in my gaming experience rhinos aren't very good i have tryed use 2 in my first few games of 7 and they still just to easy to kill

In that case my entire army is worthless, as my opponent can easily kill at least 35 points of any unit I can field by turn 2.

**Jancoran**

zilka86 wrote:
Rhinos to me are very bad thing not worth 35 pts

whuuuuuu... 35 points for mobile Terrain that actually also HAPPENS to transport your units 18 inches up the board in turn 1?

I...fail to see how this is a bad thing.

**Lobokai**

zilka86 wrote:
35 Pts that don't last past trun 2 is never good . i just say in my gaming experience rhinos aren't very good i have tryed use 2 in my first few games of 7 and they still just to easy to kill

No offense, but your experience is limited. Are you playing with cover? Do you ever go to any sort of organized event? Do you use out of the book missions? Right now you're playing a very very limited meta. None of us can say what works in your kitchen table 1v1 matches. But math and rules says rhinos work. Player experience in an actually developed and diverse meta says they can work. If you don't value any of that, then why are you even asking the question?

Are rhinos bullet proof 35 pt transports that will shrug off concentrated fire? No. But they never were and most likely never will be.

**Archon_Zarbyrn**

Wait, how are rhinos awful? There cheap, mobile and protect the squad while still having a good number of fire points. Sure it ain't a wave serpent but it only cost 35 versus 140+ the serpent cost.

**Lobomalo**

Vehicles are awesome right now, especially Rhinos. For their price and what you can do with them if you position them right, they're almost a must in a SM army in my opinion.

**PrinceRaven**

Lobukia wrote:
Are rhinos bullet proof 35 pt transports that will shrug off concentrated fire? No. But they never were and most likely never will be.

Actually they pretty much were in 5th edition.

**Archon_Zarbyrn**

PrinceRaven wrote:
Lobukia wrote:
Are rhinos bullet proof 35 pt transports that will shrug off concentrated fire? No. But they never were and most likely never will be.

Actually they pretty much were in 5th edition.

Honestly the vehicle rules in 5th really made no sense, a rhino for example could be blasted over and over by various heavy weapons yet suffer nothing more then some shaking. Hull points is a good system to deal with this though I think some vehicles could do with another hull point or two.

**Klerych**

I don't know but to me transports of all flavours are great in 7th ed. Main issue with most non-MEQ armies was that once the vehicle popped(which wasn't really hard), more than half of the squad died, basically rendering it useless. Now you're less likely to explode and more likely to get wrecked by HP stripping, which means additional LOS blocker and your infantry unit unscathed.

Rhino got even better as it's still dirt-cheap. Mech veterans are happy too.

**Ralis**

zilka86 is a Troll, Ignore him.

**BladeSwinga**

Ralis wrote:
zilka86 is a Troll, Ignore him.

This.
Also, why would you only ever use 2 Rhinos when you own 5, as you said earlier? If you only play your brother, surely there's no harm in doing a test game with all of them.